me crazy and mablak were ttrr'ing the other day... and then i asked them how they would feel if 30 second rr's were re-intoduced to the league...
im all for it, and crazy agrees....
i believe it will make it more competitive for all skill levels, and although mablak always will prefer ttrr, he agrees that rr will be more competetive...
the thing is tho, we now have the optin to make big maps so lets utilize that... we need to have people make big rr maps (but still the same style as eminefs, Az, Nail, etc.)
just in a bigger area... kinda like stacking 4 of NAiLs maps into 1 big map to rope race on....his maps r generally 47 seconds long, so 4 of them combined would be 180+ seconds. meaning.. 6 fast and consistant turns can win you the race...
right now ttr is a scheme that seems to be dominated by about 10 or so racers... mab,dibz, shy, dulek, etc.
but if it were a 6 to 10 turn 30 second rr, it can make it a little more competetive and fun for EVERYONE.... obvioulsy the fast ttrr's are always going to have an advantage.. but atleast with a big rr map, the slower consistant rope races may still have a chance... i would really like to see this added to an scheme option... whats everyone think??
ediit: let me just also note: i presented this idea to dibz a while back, when he was in doH, he also liked the idea.. and thinks it will be more competetive aswell... so this idea has been floating arounnd in my hollow head for a while now, i just have not made the post... so here it is... lets hear what everyone else thinks.
i will always prefer ttrr too, there would be still draws if 2 good players take part in one game, but it's better option for new players
what about big tight maps i love them! n way of training.
Once I had really great map! it was all in light green colour, it looked nice, but unfortunely i have never saved it anywhere... argh! I had it from Filon, but he doesn't have it anymore i guess :P
Yes I agree! I don`t think the revolution of TTRR was ment to make 30 sec dissapear completely. I think it`s important to keep both as an option when picking the scheme, because RR 30 sec has been normal to pick as a scheme for the same amount of time (if not longer) then TTRR. If I`m saying this in jealousy because I`m not fast enough in RR myself? I don`t think so and I don`t hope so, I just loved to RR in a more turn based way. After all, worms is a turn based strategic game. As Avi says it would probably make it more competitive. Wether using bigger maps is needed, I`m not really sure if I agree 100%, but it could be tested out. I just think that if we are to ever save the "normal" way of RR`ing, the scheme must be put in the league very soon.
Quote from: Maciej on October 26, 2010, 06:16 PM
i will always prefer ttrr too, there would be still draws if 2 good players take part in one game, but it's better option for new players
Would you please stop using this as an argument, because it is simply not true. Ofcourse, sometimes it would end in a draw just like in TTRR, but not in the same scale as many of you guys think. Maciej, play some 30 sec RR`s vs any good player and post the replays here. And don`t rope in order to make it a draw, rope like you would in a league game ;P
As a leader of the Progressive Worms Party, I approve this suggestion
only in map like nail bts or something like that can work well... ;)
(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:DoWS-_8YWcA7pM:http://www.gedprefabbricati.it/image/general/approved.jpg)
In TTRR speed and consistency count. In 30 sec RR only consistency counts unless you have maps that require 5 turns or more, then also speed counts, but then... you can have that in TTRR. :) And forget abiut the tactical aspects, it's rr and no strategical scheme.
I dont agree with that at all... R u sure about what u just said?? Maybe ur confused?? We will have to have a game... Ninjacamel said he is going to work on some maps.. Hopefully he does. The faster roper will have the advanrage for sure... But the consistant roper can still have a chance... Think about it...
I think you are confused. :)
I think 30 sec RR would be quite interesting. If the map was larger like Avi suggested. Someone could absolutely hammer it through and afford a mistake if over 4 or 5 goes they gain a 'go' advantage over someone.
It would open rr up to more people too which is a good idea.
Again, just having some maps for people to choose wouldn't be a bad thing.
Arguing about ifs and buts and stuff could go on forever. If my mum had 8 tits she would be a pork etc. Show us your maps Avi and I'm sure people will try them out :<
*edit* - Also, ttrr games are often over so quickly. Wouldn't hurt to make more of a match out of rope race games by prolonging the enjoyment with a few 30 second turns.
isn't the one and only idea in roperace to be faster than ur opponent? timetrial is better at achiving this than 30 sec rr. timetrial = less draws (better for league)
Quote from: Husk on October 27, 2010, 06:11 PM
isn't the one and only idea in roperace to be faster than ur opponent? timetrial is better at achiving this than 30 sec rr. timetrial = less draws (better for league)
not necessarily. in rrtt, yes you have to be faster than your opponent, but you also have more chances to mess up and still win since you have 3 fresh tries to win. in 30s rr, you rely on your first worm. you still have to be faster than your opponent to try to win, but any mistake is way more costly in this style. it adds more pressure and forces players to be more consistent.
oh yes, true.
Quote from: franz on October 27, 2010, 07:02 PM
in 30s rr, you rely on your first worm. you still have to be faster than your opponent to try to win
On long maps. And if i take a look at what maps usually get played it is mostly linear 2 turners. Even if you play on a map that requires 3 turns its most likely that not the faster but the more safe player wins. Anyway, i'll always prefer TTRR to 30 secs RR but if you like it to be in the league, why not. I still think TTRR is a logical progression from 30 sec RR. :) That's why it kinda replaced it i guess.
Quote from: chakkman on October 27, 2010, 07:51 PM
On long maps. And if i take a look at what maps usually get played it is mostly linear 2 turners. Even if you play on a map that requires 3 turns its most likely that not the faster but the more safe player wins. Anyway, i'll always prefer TTRR to 30 secs RR but if you like it to be in the league, why not. I still think TTRR is a logical progression from 30 sec RR. :) That's why it kinda replaced it i guess.
I actually still prefer rrtt, but the people wanting 30s rr have their reasons. I wouldn't mind playing 30s rr if I was forced to because I can understand if a player likes it better.
chakkman, i still think ur confused.. obviously....
it would not be 2 turn maps... it would be 6-10 turn maps....
the patch that made the clock count upwars was introduced b4 large maps, so ttrr quickly took over 30 seconds rr's....
but now that we have the option of making large maps.. we can go back to 30 second rr's with maps that will take about 10 turns to complete....
im hoping NC is working on maps, but i dunno if he is.... anyone wanna volunteer to make some 30 second 10 turns rr maps? i would.. but i dunno how, i sux :X
You know avirex, you are a hopeless case, unable to accept other opinions than your own. You don't even have a clue what the meaning of a discussion is. Well go on with your stupid ego show, i'll just sit back and laugh from now on. :) My time is too valuable for this.
Quote from: chakkman on October 27, 2010, 09:08 PM
You know avirex, you are a hopeless case, unable to accept other opinions than your own. You don't even have a clue what the meaning of a discussion is. Well go on with your stupid ego show, i'll just sit back and laugh from now on. :) My time is too valuable for this.
chakkman seriously? avi's post was actually very normal and he brought up some points that directly answered your argument that maps would be only 2 turns. it seems more like you are the one who is unable to hear his opinion just because he usually has crazy posts. there was no ego in his post.
Quote from: franz on October 27, 2010, 07:02 PM
not necessarily. in rrtt, yes you have to be faster than your opponent, but you also have more chances to mess up and still win since you have 3 fresh tries to win. in 30s rr, you rely on your first worm. you still have to be faster than your opponent to try to win, but any mistake is way more costly in this style. it adds more pressure and forces players to be more consistent.
+1 and your other posts
Quote from: chakkman on October 27, 2010, 09:08 PM
You know avirex, you are a hopeless case, unable to accept other opinions than your own. You don't even have a clue what the meaning of a discussion is. Well go on with your stupid ego show, i'll just sit back and laugh from now on. :) My time is too valuable for this.
jajajaajajaj..... read what franz said, u dip shit... so now its me sitting back and laughing at ur dumb ass.
Honestly, I don't like the idea, 30s RR's will result in more draws than TTRR, I am not saying it will happen all the time, but theres definately a bigger chance of a draw than a TTRR.
I never liked 30s RR in the 1st place, maybe this is because we didn't have all the updates we do now such as big maps etc, so i'd like to partake in some 30s RR's on these "dedicated maps" before making my final decision, but I think I will prefer TTRR anyway.
Anyway, I honestly don't think 30s RR should be added to Classic, even as a 2nd choice to normal RR like w2rope is to Roper.
I would be pretty dissapointed if this was added to Classic and such things like SSR/Bungee were not, I think SSR would be played more than w2rope for a start, and bungee, w2rope is kind of a fail lol.
I know for a fact i'd play alot of SSR/Bungee and I know alot of other players that would pick them also, just as much as people would pick this suggestion.
But anyway, i'd like to play some of these with you avi, and anyone else, and get a better feel for it.
I personally think that 30s on bigger maps would be a good idea! But I wanna mention something else too:
I always thought that TTRR on these 40-50s maps are quite too fast over, not because of their length but in my opinion it should take more than 3 turns to determine who is the better RRer. Imagine if Elite was over after 3 turns, or BnG. Sure it CAN happen but it's not really the case. I think that a scheme should encourage you to play it for about 15-30 Minutes. Depending on how many mistakes someone makes. Basically right now every TTRR 1v1 is over after 5 Minutes. I would add at least 5-6 Worms per team in TTRR to have to rely on better 'real' results since the more often you try a map the better you get to know the map and can show your skill. It's like getting used to a BnG map. Also it allows more tactics, if, for example you have 5 or 6 worms you can try to put pressure on your opponent and try faster turns in the beginning or the other way around. Currently it's just maybe 1 safe turn and then try to do fast ones. In most races in real life the race is not over after 3 turns, because it simply doesn't show who is the better racer, they take a lot of rounds in F1 to see who is faster and determine the positions.
As for the 30s, the more turns you need to finish the map the less it gets likely to have a draw.
Yeah TTRR is by far the shortest scheme, I think you make a good point, it'd be nice to have 6 worms to make it longer, but then again some people might argue that the better player has an even better chance, because it's short it gives some players a chance to win.
I'm kinda 50/50 on that one, although it'd be nice to have longer, now you mention it, i'm starting to like this 30s RR idea a little more...
Well since RR is a race without random events such as cr8s there will always (or should) win the better player. If the better player doesn't win that basically means that he isn't the better racer on that particular map. I have some maps which I really have a hard time on, and then the next one I can race so nicely. Different style of Racers so different results. :)
Quote from: DeathInFire on October 28, 2010, 08:21 AM
Well since RR is a race without random events such as cr8s there will always (or should) win the better player. If the better player doesn't win that basically means that he isn't the better racer on that particular map.
I wouldn't say so, sometimes the better player just can't focus right, or has "pc problems" lol.
Komo on about a 10 turn map.. Like i said several times.. A tie will e very unlikely... Not to mention we can make rules.. Such as
If the first worm finished with 12 seconds then the next worm has to finish with the clock at more then qw seconds... If second worm toi start finishes b4 first worm.. Its obviously a win.... I really hope ninjac or some othere peopel ... Maybe angus work o some maps so we cam al test this and see how we like it.. I rly think if u give i a chance komo.@. That u may enjoy it..@ we will give it a try.. K?? Kisskiss
well of RR i undestand cos maybe iam the best RR'er ever ;) LOL
But well that thing of 6 worms sounded really great imo.
theres one map, dunno if its too short but at least its bigger than avis<3
Ahhhh cant view at the moment.. Im at work.. But im excited to try it out when i get home... How many turn map is it??? Thnx NC@@ <3
I'd accept this idea if this is played on normal rr maps like senecas, magics, hermits, tr, etc. But in those giant maps that I can barely see because I feel a f@#!ing pain in my eyes with png maps I don't and I won't play on them lol.
I wonder with what idea Avi will come now, 20 seconds shoppers maybe or comet dodging. Before trying to implement whatever you should try to make your idea popular in wormnet.
Quote from: Komo on October 28, 2010, 07:12 AM
I know for a fact i'd play alot of SSR/Bungee and I know alot of other players that would pick them also, just as much as people would pick this suggestion.
if u think ssr and bungeerace are so great, why havn't u played them even once in tus? x; sorry dave but i just see u contradicting urself over and over again. most people who "would" play alot of ssr and bungeerace are playing them already [: i sure as hell am enjoying them, and i can find the fun and competitiveness of the schemes in freeleague aswell.
Lalo. I never said the rope race maps will have to be color maps... However they do have to be larger maps.. About 6-10 turns long... If u play a 30 second rope race on a 45 second map... Yes.. Ties will be very likely.. No shit... Thats why we needd longer maps for rope racing... Short maps r good for ttr
R but not longer ones for rr.... And lalo... Yes 20 second shoppa would be ideal.. But that idea will never go unfortunatly... And yes.. Komo contraeicts himself quite a bit husk... But i think he means well... We all still love u komo.
i must admit i tend to step on people's toes with my shitty accusations, and i blame myself for overreacting most of the time. im just curious why dave hasn't played any ssr or bungeerace matches. i gotta take a chill pill.
Quote from: NinjaCamel on October 28, 2010, 03:07 PM
theres one map, dunno if its too short but at least its bigger than avis<3
Nice map NC!!
I'll be playing that later for sure!
:<
Seriously avi, husk, how the f@#! have I contradicted myself?
I don't play these schemes in Free league cuz I don't f@#!ing like Free league ok, how the f@#! does that mean i've contradicted myself...
Seriously, some people were just born stupid...
Avi, like I already said, yes, I will try it with some rules and maps if you sort something out :)
and there u go again, calling people stupid.
edit: on a more serious note, i do understand ur decision of not playing free league [= lets try get back to topic lol, my bad.
Quote from: Husk on October 28, 2010, 06:15 PM
and there u go again, calling people stupid.
edit: on a more serious note, i do understand ur decision of not playing free league [= lets try get back to topic lol, my bad.
Cuz it f@#!ing IS stupid, avi keeps saying I contradict myself when I f@#!ing don't...
I apologise to you Husk, it isn't normal i'd say things like this to you, but avi just does it cuz he's a proper bellend.
They don't even know the meaning of the word, it's so pathetic to accuse people of things they don't even understand...
Komo... I can think of about 10 people ofF the top of my head that have recently told u that u contraDict urself...if 10 people say the sky is blue... And 1 person says the sky is green... MOre then likely the sky is blue.... Do u see where im going with this??? Or were all the people that tell u thast u contradict urself born stupid??? Anyway lets not turn it into a flame thread... I still cant wait to get home n try ninja map!!!
Quote from: lalo on October 28, 2010, 03:57 PM
I'd accept this idea if this is played on normal rr maps like senecas, magics, hermits, tr, etc. But in those giant maps that I can barely see because I feel a f@#!ing pain in my eyes with png maps I don't and I won't play on them lol.
I wonder with what idea Avi will come now, 20 seconds shoppers maybe or comet dodging. Before trying to implement whatever you should try to make your idea popular in wormnet.
First off, maps looks GREAT nc! Lets 30 sec that one later when you get back ;D And yeah Lalo, there are plenty of strato, herm and seneca maps that can be used for 30 sec indeed. +2 for that post <3
apology accepted dave <3 :-* i need some fresh air or i could go ride my horse in red dead redemption, yea thats what ill do :'(
Quote from: avirex on October 28, 2010, 06:26 PMOr were all the people that tell u thast u contradict urself born stupid???map!!!
Like i've already said, I doubt they all know the proper defination of contradicting.
You all throw that word around too much without even thinking about it, basically, you all say I am being contradicting when I say something you don't agree with, when I explain something more in depth you say it's contradicting, it's not, that's actually called re-defining.
Going by your judgement, I could say Shyguy contradicted himself, but he didn't... He redefined his opinion, just like I did.
Well then.. That settles it... The sky is green!
From the other topic:
I support 30 second rr... I think it would be a better indicator of skilled ropers, tbh... you also gotta have tactics in that scheme.. think about it... like if you are leading, do you continue to go at a fast pace and risk falling? or just kinda of cruise control it? if you are behind, do you want to try to catch up by rushing and risking falling? or hope for your opponent to fall? +1 for 30 second rr.
Quote from: Komo on October 28, 2010, 07:22 PM
Going by your judgement, I could say Shyguy contradicted himself, but he didn't... He redefined his opinion, just like I did.
When?
Well it'd settled then, you are unfortunate in brain-power.
Let's call you, a mentally challenged muppet :)
^^ avi
Shy, it doesn't matter, really lol, just leave it.
komo, the muppet joke revolves around you... nice try though.. and dude, the sky is green!! huahauhauahauhauh.. ok im home now, lets 30second rr baby!! im going to check out NC's map
Funny how your mind is so egotistical you think you can decide everything haha.
You just joke about me being a muppet, but you really ARE a muppet :D
lets make a poll about who is the mightiest muppet
komo, not only do people often tell you that you contradict yourself.. but they also comment on your egotistical attitude....
but sure, try to turn this around onto me, just like the muppet joke.. good job :D
but k.. i have to fix my PC.. i have some sort of virus it seems..
prolly from downloading too much muppet porn.... hauhauhah
avi, the only people who have really said it alot and said it the most are you and shyguy, funny that lol.
A few other people have said it like once or twice, I hardly call that often, i'm so jealous of your memory, I wish I had a memory like yours...
I ain't joking about you being a muppet, I really think you are a pain in the ass recently just as you probably think so too vice versa, but at least I don't keep making bad repetitive jokes and bad repetitive assumptions or accusations about you.
shhhhh BOTH! aff u r making the king sad :(
Quote from: Komo on October 28, 2010, 08:40 PM
avi, the only people who have really said it alot and said it the most are you and shyguy, funny that lol.
A few other people have said it like once or twice, I hardly call that often, i'm so jealous of your memory, I wish I had a memory like yours...
I ain't joking about you being a muppet, I really think you are a pain in the ass recently just as you probably think so too vice versa, but at least I don't keep making bad repetitive jokes and bad repetitive assumptions or accusations about you.
lol, no... ur right... instead u just take my repetitive jokes and try to turn them around on me.. lol... MUCH BETTER!!! ;P
LOL !!! You posted the same video on both friends, I thought it was summin different but actually made me laugh even more, serious I love your sense of humour nino haha.
When you think it's over nino just comes back to kill you laughing on the ground. xD
Nino is king ae!
i love u nino :DDDDD
Nino for president hahahah
my 1st job was animator of funeral, loved this job hehe