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Worms: Armageddon => Tech Support => Topic started by: Bloody on July 14, 2017, 09:38 PM

Title: Network lags
Post by: Bloody on July 14, 2017, 09:38 PM
Hey guys,

I regularly play Worms Armageddon with a few friends via WormNET / Hostingbuddy. For a few days we encounter a lot of lags / game hangs ingame, sometimes players even timeout It also takes longer for hostingbuddy commands to be accepted, even logging in on the Wormnet Server and entering the Anything-Goes lobby takes longer than usual.

Does everybody encounter this problem at the moment or is it something on my side? Is there anything I could test / do to fix it?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: WTF-8 on July 14, 2017, 09:42 PM
Someone on #Help was talking about that like 30 minutes ago, hmmmm
Out of 5 random HB games I joined, three definitely took longer to load than expected, soo I guess I can confirm that
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: TheKaren on July 14, 2017, 09:58 PM
Seen a few people mention this myself, Gab just mentioned it while waiting to begin Tournament final.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: KinslayeR on July 14, 2017, 09:59 PM
ye and fukin csongi blamed my internet...   :-*
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Csongi on July 14, 2017, 10:06 PM
ye and fukin csongi blamed my internet...   :-*
u were also blaming my snail gypsy connection, sooo  shushhh   :D
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Bloody on July 14, 2017, 10:41 PM
Oh okay, seems like its the server then. Hope they fix it soon. :)
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kaleu on July 15, 2017, 05:08 AM
Same here for 3 days straight but we (cfc and tdc) reached the conclusion that it has something to do with WormNAT2's proxies afaik HB uses it too.
Senator hosted normally while daina and I use WormNAT2, game went ok only in Senator's host.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: WTF-8 on July 15, 2017, 11:23 AM
[attachment=1]
hf
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Godmax on July 15, 2017, 11:24 AM
Hosting on your own is beautiful. But even then the laggy apes take down the server nontheless
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on July 15, 2017, 10:44 PM
Hi all,

We're doing some heavy maintenance on the server, which is having a big effect on load levels. Unfortunately everything will be slow-ish for a few more days, possibly a week. Some downtime will also happen for reboots and such.

It's all for a good reason, though, and will allow us to have much better backups and possibly allow moving to a faster server (much more efficiently than the previous server move).

Sorry for the inconvenience :)
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Bloody on July 20, 2017, 07:40 PM
Thanks for your update. :)

I really hope it's sorted out soon, its totally unplayable right now. I just played with 3 friends and we had delay times from ~1min between turns to sync everything properly and even while the gameplay was fun, the connection was so bad that they consider quitting Worms:Armageddon and search another casual game to play.

It would be nice if you could reply once everything is sorted out and going well again, because it is no fun at the moment.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Jengu on July 21, 2017, 05:56 AM
Thanks for your update. :)

I really hope it's sorted out soon, its totally unplayable right now. I just played with 3 friends and we had delay times from ~1min between turns to sync everything properly and even while the gameplay was fun, the connection was so bad that they consider quitting Worms:Armageddon and search another casual game to play.

It would be nice if you could reply once everything is sorted out and going well again, because it is no fun at the moment.
Just host on your own. It's lag-free.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: WTF-8 on July 21, 2017, 06:29 AM
Just host on your own.
That's not possible for many. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_address_translation#Issues_and_limitations
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Jengu on July 21, 2017, 09:31 AM
Just host on your own.
That's not possible for many. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_address_translation#Issues_and_limitations
It is possible if they port forward.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: StepS on July 21, 2017, 10:20 AM
It is possible if they port forward.
No, it's not.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT

Quote
It makes it impossible to host services.

Carrier-grade NAT usually prevents the ISP customers from using port forwarding, because the network address translation (NAT) is usually implemented by mapping ports of the NAT devices in the network to other ports in the external interface. This is done so the router will be able to map the responses to the correct device; in carrier-grade NAT networks, even though the router at the consumer end might be configured for port forwarding, the "master router" of the ISP, which runs the CGN, will block this port forwarding because the actual port would not be the port configured by the consumer.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: TheKaren on August 02, 2017, 10:54 PM
Any update on this?

The lags seem to be getting worse... That's been a little over 2 weeks, is there a problem?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on August 03, 2017, 05:55 PM
The lags seem to be getting worse...

Not... really... I mean, maybe, technically, depending on how you interpret it, but it's still misrepresenting the situation.

(https://dump.thecybershadow.net/8a506134d4070252d391ffcd51b1a22e/17%3A53%3A23-upload.png)

There's a btrfs snapshot cleanup task running that should bring the load levels down again within a day or two.

There is still more maintenance work left to do.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Bloody on August 03, 2017, 07:07 PM
Just right now again unplayable lags.

No matter if using HostingBuddy or self-hosted with WormNAT, Delays up to 30 seconds in nearly every turn. :(
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on August 03, 2017, 07:49 PM
Enerving, wouldnt call it unplayable. Be patient, at least rare drops...
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: MarianRV on August 04, 2017, 11:37 AM
and whenever I play the blame goes on me for the lag xD
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on August 04, 2017, 02:08 PM
But due to maintenance, there are majority that experience it as ''lag''. Where each lag can last up to 2 minutes or more, which means a match can be twice as long. This in popular opinion can be very frustrating in games.

Although I personally appreciate the work that's being done :)
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: TheKaren on August 04, 2017, 02:18 PM
Most games I watch today seem to be lag every 3 or 4 turns for 10-20+ seconds each time, it all adds up I guess.

Will be worth it in the end though I guess.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: XanKriegor on August 04, 2017, 02:37 PM
Dont use WormNet, host via Direct IP and give your address to players you want to join you. Works perfectly. No reopening is needed, everyone can join when lobby is open.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on August 04, 2017, 03:01 PM
Quote
This in popular opinion can be very frustrating in games.

If you want, I can turn off HostingBuddy and WormNAT2 until the maintenance is finished. All games will then be hosted directly, and there will be no more lag :)
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kaleu on August 04, 2017, 05:54 PM
Quote
This in popular opinion can be very frustrating in games.

If you want, I can turn off HostingBuddy and WormNAT2 until the maintenance is finished. All games will then be hosted directly, and there will be no more lag :)

Please.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Gabriel on August 05, 2017, 05:22 AM
if you guys can setup your games without HB/WN2, then why don't you just do it?

there are some people that use those because they have no other way, and i'm sure they would be happy with keeping the stuff up
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: STRGRN on August 05, 2017, 07:45 AM
there are some people that use those because they have no other way, and i'm sure they would be happy with keeping the stuff up

I'm one of those people
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: WTF-8 on August 05, 2017, 08:55 AM
Dont use WormNet, host via Direct IP and give your address to players you want to join you. Works perfectly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT#Disadvantages
Quote
It makes it impossible to host services.
Quote
Carrier-grade NAT usually prevents the ISP customers from using port forwarding

any tips on overcoming that?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: XanKriegor on August 05, 2017, 09:05 AM
Yes, leave that ass service and find better ISP xD
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on August 05, 2017, 10:55 AM
there are some people that use those because they have no other way, and i'm sure they would be happy with keeping the stuff up

I'm one of those people
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on August 06, 2017, 12:24 AM
Please.

OK, done. I turned off HostingBuddy on the server for now.

Until the maintenance is over (and maybe some more time, depends), it will be running on my home PC instead, which is on all the time anyway.

WMDB is still on the server, so map loading may be slow sometimes. So, please don't spam !map too much.

I'll do the same with WormNAT2 tomorrow, I think.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: j0e on August 06, 2017, 12:48 AM
Map caching or a way to downvote certain maps from always appearing would reduce the !map spam a lot.

Do you have a Paypal link for donations?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on August 06, 2017, 01:07 AM
Please.

OK, done. I turned off HostingBuddy on the server for now.

Until the maintenance is over (and maybe some more time, depends), it will be running on my home PC instead, which is on all the time anyway.

WMDB is still on the server, so map loading may be slow sometimes. So, please don't spam !map too much.

I'll do the same with WormNAT2 tomorrow, I think.

means wont be able to host from now on til all over? id prefer to leave it on, laggy games are better than no games...
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: StepS on August 06, 2017, 10:31 AM
means wont be able to host from now on til all over? id prefer to leave it on, laggy games are better than no games...
Until the maintenance is over (and maybe some more time, depends), it will be running on my home PC instead, which is on all the time anyway.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on August 06, 2017, 11:23 AM
Ya realized later myself  :D
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on August 12, 2017, 01:26 PM
The network lags are still present on WormNAT2, I can't speak for HostingBuddy.

Because of these lags, there's been a lot of enigma surrounding the issue. Why does it take so long to resolve? I do appreciate the effort put into it, but every time the problem is brought to light, the answer are still the same ''Soon, a few more days tops''. Some theorists believe the whole maintenance/move? is because to ready worms for the next big update 3.8 or 4.0. If you can't speak about the updates, because it's all hush-hush, then perhaps you could give a more clear answer when users can expect a resolve?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: TheKaren on August 12, 2017, 02:15 PM
It always amused me, in all of 19 years the WA server has only failed on a handful of occasions, generally it works flawlessly for those with a decent internet connection.

Yet we have 1 month of lags, which are playable although a little frustrating, and so many people complaining... Todays generation just expect things to work, they don't care for the details, if it doesn't work the person responsibile is automatically a jerk... Pfft...
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: XanKriegor on August 12, 2017, 04:43 PM
Right, instead of complaining they should ask themselves - what i can do for my country server?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on August 12, 2017, 09:39 PM
We had high load today due to another snapshot cleanup task:

(https://dump.thecybershadow.net/58f93a9b87fb87781c0a3828c9b32094/21%3A36%3A04-upload.png)

Everything is back to normal now.

Why does it take so long to resolve?
Because there's a lot of work to be done.
Quote
perhaps you could give a more clear answer when users can expect a resolve?
The bottom line answer is "when it's done" (though we have a deadline for the migration until the end of September or so, so no longer than then).
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on August 13, 2017, 03:13 AM
Alright then, thank you.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on August 21, 2017, 10:52 PM
Turning off some services for a few hours for maintenance.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: j0e on September 10, 2017, 11:34 PM
It seems like the HostingBuddy lag problems have been fixed!
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on September 10, 2017, 11:49 PM
Unfortunately not for Wormnat2.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Mega`Adnan on September 11, 2017, 08:52 AM
Maintainence gone long.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on September 11, 2017, 12:44 PM
Maintainence gone long.


The bottom line answer is "when it's done" (though we have a deadline for the migration until the end of September or so, so no longer than then).
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on October 03, 2017, 10:27 PM
any news here?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Sensei on October 03, 2017, 10:41 PM
Was just looking for this thread to comment.
Wormnat2 gonna get fixed soon?

we have a deadline for the migration until the end of September or so

If this "migration" thing have something to do with WormNET switching to new-faster server, is that option now gone? Cause september is over and last thing I understood was that CS running Hosting Buddy from his PC.
I'm really bad at getting this tech stuff, sounds scary.   ???
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on October 12, 2017, 03:49 PM
If it sound like I come out as ungrateful, but I'm not. The lag through Wormnat2 is still ever so persistent as before. What is going on CyberShadow? We're way past end of September, and halfway through October. Are there anything new to report regards to the relentless lags?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Hurz on October 26, 2017, 09:46 PM
atm hosting with wnat2 is lagfree.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kaleu on November 02, 2017, 04:17 AM
atm hosting with wnat2 is lagfree.

Anyone else can confirm?
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kradie on November 02, 2017, 12:38 PM
atm hosting with wnat2 is lagfree.

Anyone else can confirm?

It became lag free a few days after my last entry in this topic. In other words, WormNat2 isn't lagging now.
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: Kaleu on November 02, 2017, 09:41 PM
Ok thanks!
Title: Re: Network lags
Post by: CyberShadow on January 29, 2018, 04:06 AM
There is a backlog of snapshots on the server again (2 months' worth). I've begun a controlled cleanup. It may impact load somewhat, but hopefully it shouldn't cause downtime or massive lags.