[Allround PO system (advantageous for ropers)? + Suggestion

[Chicken23]

Hi All

I've not read the whole thread but I remember thinking this before. However, the all-round PO system is also advantageous for a default player, IF they are seeded and get to pick first.

The rules in POs are that you cannot have more than 3 rope schemes (or more than 3 default). So if I'm default heavy, here is an example of a potential PO situation with a roper like dibz.

1st pick me (I can pick elite/inter/t17/bng/hysteria) - i pick elite
2nd pick dibz - he can pick between rope, ttrr, wxw, shopper) he picks rr
3rd pick me (I can still pick between inter/t17/bng/hysteria) - i pick t17
4th pick dibz - (he can pick between rope, wxw,shopper) - he picks wxw
5th and final pick - (i can pick between inter/bng/hysteria) - pick bng


In playoffs you can also force the rope schemes down because they are maxed out at only 3 rope schemes. Therefore often when CKC faced a clan in playoffs who were better ropers and seeded higher than us. As they had first pick, we'd pick shopper, to stop more rope schemes. For example.

1st pick cfc - (they can pick wxw, rope, ttrr, shopper) - they pick ttrr
2nd pick CKC - (instead of picking a default, we force an rope based scheme pick and pick shopper)
3rd pick cfc (they can pick wxe and only rope for final rope scheme based game) - they pick wxw
4th pick CKC - no more rope schemes, we now pick bng.
5th pick cfc - no more rope schemes and maybe deciding match and they are forced to pick from - elite, t17, inter, hysteria.


I think the PO system is fine as it favours those who finish higher in the standings that seasons and that is the point. In all round league we still have clans and players are are more rope based, and some that are more default based. Finish 1st in league and you'll have no problem



However, on the flip side of all of this. It would be worth viewing what games are being picked in a season. Maybe the 3 max rules for rope/default picks could be scrapped, so that if 2 default players met in POs, they are not forced to pick rope schemes if they both agree? But that isn't very allround. So either way if you have 3 rope and 2 default, or 3 default and 2 rope. This is more allround than 4/5 rope picks and 4/5 default picks.... if that makes sense?

[Kaleu]

This is a nice idea to fix this problem Chicken, but I would rather see how clans and players could perform in both scenarios, default and rope, instead of sacrificing a scheme pick to prevent my opponent of playing their most comfortable schemes.

I like my idea better of having 3 or 2 playoffs for each Rope and Default schemes + 1 Allround playoff using Albus or yours format (check my previous post.)
Fair enough for ropers, defaulters + able to collect multiple trophies per season if true allrounder + more games to play and watch.

I think this make much more sense as schemes are marked with default and rope league. It could even be only 2 playoffs, the third would just be an extra chance or recap etc...

[Korydex]

Default and rope playoffs were a thing for 2 seasons, then stopped because inactivity?

[Albus]

Yes, I imagine the activity would be the problem.

But anyway... I think making PO's allround truly allround would be the best solution at the moment.

1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match

This is a true allround PO and not what sometimes happens: someone has 2 or even 3 free wins because they are very good with only one main skill (rope skill) and the opponent is not. In this proposed format, in each round, players should show skills in each style of allround scheme, where the fact that you are good in one does not guarantee victory in the other.

[VoK]

I've suggested a PO system that would require a player to win more than just 1 scheme type (e.g. artillery+rope or strategic+artillery) but some players were against it because they think people should feel competitive in the Classic/Allround league even when they can play only 1 type of schemes.

Guess this would be best in my opinion.

[MonkeyIsland]

The schemes are NOT simply marked "rope" and "default". They wear those tags because they belong to those leagues. That means we already have a separate "default" league and a separate "rope" league which means we have separate playoffs for each. We don't run their playoffs because we don't reach enough activity for each of them. If we had enough activity, we would have 3 playoffs each season.

That being said, I don't think multiple playoffs work anymore. There should be only one.

1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match

That's your point of view and it's obviously subjective. A roper player could easily count Intermediate and Elite as similar schemes the same way you see TTRR and Roper as similar schemes.

[Albus]

Yes, elite and intermediate can be considered a bit similar by some people. But if it were like this:

1 BnG
1 Aerial or Hysteria (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Rope scheme (choosen by the best positioned in rope league)
1 Elite or intermediate (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Team17 match

5 matches with completely different schemes.

By the way, I don't think I expressed myself correctly. TTRR and roper are not similar imo. I meant that whoever is PRO in TTRR (ie, has high level skill with the rope - eg, Rudolf), even if he never played any other rope scheme before, has a guaranteed win against someone who doesn't dominate the rope (like me, Rafka etc.) in any other rope scheme (roper, wxw, RR). The idea would be to make players play schemes where being good at one doesn't guarantee they'll be good at other one which demand the same main and core skill.

[Zalo the moler]

The schemes are NOT simply marked "rope" and "default". They wear those tags because they belong to those leagues. That means we already have a separate "default" league and a separate "rope" league which means we have separate playoffs for each. We don't run their playoffs because we don't reach enough activity for each of them. If we had enough activity, we would have 3 playoffs each season.

That being said, I don't think multiple playoffs work anymore. There should be only one.

100% well said, MonkeyIsland. I have still seen Sbaffo understanding "Clanner Tus any1" as "we are gonna pick rope, you are screwed ". Thank God there are still players like Jimmy or Senator who separate "Default tus" from "Rope league", and with whom we had great Elite + T17 picks.

Albus has got the point though... and since I joined here in 2012 it has always been a bit strange and unfair to me that there are many schemes (Wxw, Roper, Big rope race, TTRR, ...) all involving... 1 Inventory Weapon/Tool??? (Rope).

How about we have 5 schemes in which the "Mole" (weapon) is used?? I bet my kidney that I would have a guaranteed win against whoever is bad at this weapon. After all you can use these pets for aka Golf purpose, for Basketball scheme (making Moles accurately fly through tiny indestructable spaces), you can do Vanguard scheme (Parachute + dropping Mole from above). You can also fly towards a specific fort, and when releasing it underneath, invade a new fort with it, tunneling yourself through.

Now you might say "It doesn't make sense, all you do is just releasing a mole", but funny thing is that the same can be said about Wxw, Roper, Big Roper Race, TTRR. it's just relocating yourself with rope. Nothing else. All you do is just adding some random different purposes to it, but at the end of the day, you just do the same thing 

(Trick race is absolutely different though)

There are of course different demands for people here and there. I love watching the most competitive Rope players. I think there is a beauty hidden there but having what... 50% of All Round schemes about the use of 1 weapon? 1 weapon??? .... that's just some bad joke. It has absolutely nothing to do with being better at Worms Armageddon. That''s why I feel sorry for whoever needs to be in the Classic league All round POs.

[Sbaffo]

Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you

[Zalo the moler]

Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you

You don't seem to understand... I already meet many players half-way by entering Default Classic league and Default Classic clanners. Today with danie we lost Elite + Team17 but it's okay, we will learn to play better over time. These are not my most fun schemes, nor schemes where I play too well, but I still play them to get to know some players and to integrate with them You are stuck in your cheap wins (in many cases free wins), You are stuck in your roping schemes, and refusing to leave your comfort zone even for a moment. That's the cowardice you are known for. Just be grateful that WA scene is so centered around your roping and stop barking at Albus.

[Albus]

Albus has got the point though... and since I joined here in 2012 it has always been a bit strange and unfair to me that there are many schemes (Wxw, Roper, Big rope race, TTRR, ...) all involving... 1 Inventory Weapon/Tool??? (Rope).

How about we have 5 schemes in which the "Mole" (weapon) is used?? I bet my kidney that I would have a guaranteed win against whoever is bad at this weapon.

Now you might say "It doesn't make sense, all you do is just releasing a mole", but funny thing is that the same can be said about Wxw, Roper, Big Roper Race, TTRR. it's just relocating yourself with rope. Nothing else. All you do is just adding some random different purposes to it, but at the end of the day, you just do the same thing 

Exactly Zalo! I think allround PO should involve play many different schemes, in which you will have to use different skills and strategy to win, ie, being good in one scheme of these schemes (that demands a main skill), doesn't guarantee your victory in the "similar scheme" (ie, that involves a same and main skill in order to highly increase your chances of victory) against those who haven't mastered this skill.

Examples:
BnG and Golf (if someone is PRO in BnG, certainly will beat someone who is noob with BnG skills at Golf too);
TTRR and roper (if someone is PRO in TTRR, certainly will beat someone who doesn't know how to rope well);
Intermediate and 80normal etc.

[Sbaffo]

Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you

You don't seem to understand... I already meet many players half-way by entering Default Classic league and Default Classic clanners. Today with danie we lost Elite + Team17 but it's okay, we will learn to play better over time. These are not my most fun schemes, nor schemes where I play too well, but I still play them to get to know some players and to integrate with them You are stuck in your cheap wins (in many cases free wins), You are stuck in your roping schemes, and refusing to leave your comfort zone even for a moment. That's the cowardice you are known for. Just be grateful that WA scene is so centered around your roping and stop barking at Albus.

Funny that i’ve been hearing that i am only a rope player, but you know what else is also funny? Last time i’ve heard your name you were pumping your ego around the forums so much that you put your money upfront in a challenge, and when you got the chance to prove your self you ran away, you ran away so bad you flew to Mexico and got your self a new profile… i think you should think twice before calling someone coward and talking about my reputation like that because it doesn’t look like you have a better one.

I love how you guys take it so personally when someone disagree with your ideas you feel to urge to past walls of texts, thinking that the more words you put in your posts the more it is going to look rightful or some shit like that hauahauahauahauahu

Like we say in my village “lend me your brain, i need a vacation”, altro che Gonzalo al massimo sei un Cozzalo

[Albus]

I love how you guys take it so personally when someone disagree with your ideas

Oh, what a saint he is. I’ve got your number.

You don't add anything to a debate. You are totally partial who want just defend you interests.

Isn't that the point of debate? To defend your interests? Aren't you doing the same for pages now?

Yes. The difference is that he comes here to defend only his exclusive interest and with partiality and irony. He doesn't know how to have a correct posture in a debate.

[Sensei]

You are totally partial who want just defend you interests.

Isn't that the point of debate? To defend your interests? Aren't you doing the same for pages now?


You guys just keep talking about rope and ground schemes for ages now but no one is doing anything to bring new blood. And there's this funny Lupastic guy, not sleeping for days to promote his SUPERSHEEPER (yeah, fkn supersheeper) cup in #ag.
If clans had 20% of his will power, to recruit and train new ppl, you could have some serious talk about league system.

[MonkeyIsland]

I'd advise everyone to stick to the topic. I'll remove irrelevant posts.

There are of course different demands for people here and there. I love watching the most competitive Rope players. I think there is a beauty hidden there but having what... 50% of All Round schemes about the use of 1 weapon? 1 weapon??? .... that's just some bad joke. It has absolutely nothing to do with being better at Worms Armageddon. That''s why I feel sorry for whoever needs to be in the Classic league All round POs.

It is simply supply and demand. If Mole had so many dedicated players to make websites/content for it or it could alone attract players just to "Mole", then yes we would dedicate a whole section for it.

Worms game series was originally designed to be played as a ground battle but the "Rope" made worms so much more.  The weapon "Rope" in this game is something to be cherished and appreciated.

Back to the main topic:
In the future, I'm planning to change the way leagues work. It won't be about Rope/Default leagues anymore.