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September 28, 2021, 09:48 PM

Author Topic: Worms Tool Assisted offer an advantage? Alternatives to make it public?  (Read 1580 times)

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Offline Albus

EDIT: a module that provides similar functions to the TA mentioned in this topic has been released. Anyone interested, go to: https://www.tus-wa.com/forums/worms-armageddon/wktoolassist-v-0-1-0-released-33517/msg280657/?topicseen#new.



For those who don't know, there is a Tool Assisted (TA) for Worms that allows the player to do various things and learn many details about the game. This tool is not public and is only shared with players who meet certain requirements.

I saw a discussion about TA being an advantage for people who have this tool because they can have faster progress in the game. For some people, the possibility of controlling replays, for example, would be what is of most interest in this regard, as it allows you to repeat mistakes from past games, in order to learn from your own mistakes in practice, instead of just looking at matches etc. I don't know everything you can do with TA. I heard the program has a manual that lists all its tools. If anyone can share this manual it would be nice.

I have been informed that there is a danger in making this tool avaible to everyone:



However, until this is possible, I would like to share the idea to make a limited version of TA for everyone, at least with the ability to control replays, since the replays files are encrypted so people couldn't use them without authorization:



Below is a video I made showing few TA features which I saw being used. Be sure to turn on the subtitles:
« Last Edit: September 01, 2021, 04:26 PM by Albus »

Offline Kradie

Tool assisted Programs aka Cheats, offers unfair advantage, and therefore should not be encouraged.

Particularly in competitive based games.

If you think cheats makes the game approachable, then this game may not be for you.

I say, play the game as is, to the best of your ability.

That's what I think.

Offline Albus

I also don't support cheats. I think there was a misunderstanding between the TA I'm talking about and what you're thinking.
« Last Edit: July 06, 2021, 05:30 PM by Albus »


Offline Squirminator2k

As has been seen in other speedrunning communities, notably Super Mario Bros., TAS runs typically compliment the human runs, as opposed to replacing them. They provide a hypothetical hard-line for the fastest possible run within the game, even if it's not within human capabilities. That's something that has always fascinated me.

Personally, I'd love to see what a TAS run of the WA missions looks like.


Offline MonkeyIsland

There are a few TA replays on TUS as well. Mostly on challenges. Check the comments sections of these challenges:

https://www.tus-wa.com/challenges/challenge-371/
https://www.tus-wa.com/challenges/challenge-768/
https://www.tus-wa.com/challenges/challenge-769/
Due to massive misunderstandings: MonkeyIsland refers to an island not a monkey. I would be a monkey, if my name was IslandMonkey meaning a monkey who is or lives on an island. MonkeyIsland is an island which is related to monkeys. Also there's been a legend around saying MonkeyIsland is a game. So please, think of me as an island or a game.

Offline Squirminator2k

Ooh, I had no idea those existed! Thanks for sharing.

Offline MonkeyIsland

Due to massive misunderstandings: MonkeyIsland refers to an island not a monkey. I would be a monkey, if my name was IslandMonkey meaning a monkey who is or lives on an island. MonkeyIsland is an island which is related to monkeys. Also there's been a legend around saying MonkeyIsland is a game. So please, think of me as an island or a game.

Offline TheMadCharles

tool assisted speedruns and real time attempted speedruns are two different types of speedruns

Offline FireRat2

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> Tool-Assisted gameplay is a thing in W:A now
> Only the chosen ones can try it yet

Good for you, lucky ones. Vbl for me though, not that I could influence too much anyway, to what I seen.
And because it just "never ever" makes sense whenever I complain about anything at all, this is the kind of things I just wish I didn't knew so early :v

EDIT: In fact, why would I (typical player) want to know if I MAY or not get to see a limited, not full version, even? Just what's the point lol
EDIT2: 2007?! ... ok no more comments.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2021, 03:52 PM by FireRat2 »

Offline Albus

EDIT: In fact, why would I (typical player) want to know if I MAY or not get to see a limited, not full version, even? Just what's the point lol

Well, I came up with the idea of giving everyone a limited version because I think it would be something more likely to happen in a near future, since they say giving everyone TA with no restrictions is dangerous because some people can use TA for illicit purposes. I don't understand this subject, so I don't have an opinion.
I know TA has a lot of cool features to use, but just the ability to take control of replays, at least for me, is awesome. So, if there was a limited version with this feature, would be better than nothing.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2021, 12:18 PM by Albus »

Offline cgar

A public TA build, crippled or not, would be amazing. It would be fantastic for practice. Trying out mission speedrun tactics without having to restart from the beginning, trying out fast roping moves without having to wait for control to return or to teleport back. The list goes on and on.
It might even help me be bothered to start trying out BnG. Being able to see trajectory for practice would make it much less off putting to start learning it.


Offline Kradie

My first post in this thread was premature due to lack of understanding of the purpose of such tool. Yet, I stand by my post in general.

I wouldn't mind such tool proposed here. It would be nice.

Though, when it comes to BNG, we have the option ''Weapon Use Doesn't end Turn''.- Still, to see the trajectory would be very handy too.

Offline Albus

If giving everyone a limited TA version (with at least the ability to take control of replays - most cool, useful and interesting feature imo) to everyone is a too big step initially, maybe it could be shared initially among players who have already reached a certain skill level, as a reward and recognition for these players, who demonstrates much interest in the game and are useful to the community, as they make leagues more competitive, make more fun and nice to watch events like CWT etc., and also these players inspire others new players.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2021, 02:28 PM by Albus »