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Other Things => Gaming Central => Topic started by: HHC on August 03, 2017, 10:01 PM

Title: PC console
Post by: HHC on August 03, 2017, 10:01 PM
Yoo,

Any of you have something comparable to a 'PC console'?

Been checking those steam machines. They say products like the Alienware Alpha R2 is pretty neat and comparable to a PS4 and other current gen consoles. Except that it's twice as expensive  :-[
That can be compensated with cheap games through steam though.

But it's true without a doubt though that these slim PC consoles are more expensive when compared to similar regular PC builds. Like a laptop to a desktop PC.

Pro's probably are that it is smaller and specifically designed to be played on TV and with a controller.

Some people also complain about the Steam controller that is apparently fairly shite compared to real console ones in terms of layout/design.

And choosing between Steam OS and Windows I reckon it's prolly better to go with windows cause it allows any game in the steam library instead of just the Steam OS ones.


So yah, I'm looking for some feedback from people who have one of these steam machines/PC consoles. Or just the Steam controller.. (cause I could give that one a try first and just HDMI my normal PC to the TV)

Main reason for (maybe) getting this: I wanna try the more demanding games on Steam for which my current cheap PC is too shite + playing my PC games with a decent controller that doesnt have to re-callibrate every f@#!ING TIME I START RL *ahem* + it seems interesting to have a PC that acts like a console.. one that is only used for playing games.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: XanKriegor on August 04, 2017, 05:02 AM
Why PC should act as a console?
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: skunk3 on October 03, 2017, 06:39 AM
Don't even bother with a Steam machine or some overpriced Alienware crap. Just figure out how much power you want / need / can afford and then buy the components separately after shopping around and put it together. It isn't hard, and it will be exactly what you want.

PC gaming shits all over console gaming in most respects. The only thing that console gaming has over PC gaming is the fact that there's some exclusives that are pretty cool, there's less shovelware, and if you are playing a multiplayer game (a FPS for instance) everyone has the same specs, so nobody really gets an advantage as long as internet speeds are relatively equal.

When it comes to multiplayer PC gaming, having a more powerful machine actually does confer an advantage in some games. I play some games with a buddy of mine and he has a really nice PC with multiple monitors, including a 4k @ 120... he will always be calling out enemies to me on the map and I'm looking and can't see them... the 4k resolution helps immensely. Blah blah blah. It really just depends on what kinds of games you want to play. You can easily build something that delivers graphics on par with a PS4 for not that much money. (Relatively speaking.) My laptop is almost 2 years old and is still better than a PS4 in terms of power and loading speed.

Also, if you are serious about gaming, you don't want to play on a normal TV. The refresh rates are garbage on those things. You'll want something with g-sync, or a 4k with the fastest refresh rates. It can be very pricey but it looks amazing. My laptop is only capable of 1920x1080 and after seeing games played with ultra settings on a nice 4k monitor, going back to 1080p looks like shit... lol

The Steam controller is shit and isn't worth buying. You can just use a XB1 controller or dozens of other controllers with your PC. I have some cheap Logitech dual analog controller that is basically a PS3 controller minus the feedback.

My advice if you are considering a gaming PC is don't buy anything pre-packaged. Buy the components separately and make sure that you get a motherboard that will allow you to use the latest technology and be 'future proof' for a while. You'll want as many PCI lanes as you can get for video cards, m2 drives, etc. Also, don't skimp on the power supply, and make sure you have a decent cooling system. I'd say that 16gb of RAM is good enough for just about anything these days, although 32 wouldn't hurt. You'll want to buy the best monitor that you can afford.

If you just want to play some video games and not deal with the hassle, just stick to console. The newer versions of the PS4 and XB1 support 4k.

Last thing - IMO Steam isn't all that great. I'd say that a majority of the games on there are trash. You have to do so much digging to find good stuff, and the good stuff is usually AAA-priced. You can get lots of fun, cheap games but they aren't going to have the most modern graphics and whatnot.


Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 03, 2017, 06:49 AM
some overpriced Alienware crap.

Well, I used to have an Alienware laptop, cost me £1050, before I bought my new one(custom build from PC Specialist) last year at £2225, they are both awesome, I personally find the weight, design and feel of the Alienware to be better than my new laptop, sometimes it's worth a little extra for a sleek look, imo, I worked f**king hard for it, so i'm gonna enjoy it!

HHC, don't get a PC Console, get a Console if you want a Console and a PC/Laptop if you want a PC, otherwise you may as well just kill yourself  8) ...

Edit - Actually, my new laptop probably a little overpriced as well, cuz I got it built for me, but rather have it done by people who know what they are doing anyway and totally don't mind paying for it, thanks to this laptop, i've became a professional music producer/mixing engineer, so definitely worth the investment!
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: HHC on October 03, 2017, 12:17 PM
Yeah, I decided to stick with just buying a better controller for PC. Used a PS3 one for a bit, but the driver hack died on me. Now I bought an XB controller and it works just fine.

I actually love Steam, so much choice and so small prices (generally). Most games are good, just don't buy shit that has reviews below Very positive.
I could upgrade my system to run the latest games, but meh, better save some for later, when this one breaks down or really goes out of date.

Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Sensei on October 03, 2017, 01:34 PM
Desktop PC is all you need. Not laptop, not console.
Console is great for sport games like Fifa and NBA if you have few buddies that plays it. (main reason I've got ps4)
Laptops is a must have if you're a traveller/bussinesman, but buying one for few thousands $ like Komo did is a total waste of money. (let's be honest, Komo, if you're doing everything from home, I don't see a point in having laptop that's worth that much. Just my opinion) Not to mention spare parts for laptops which is hard or even impossible to replace(!?).

Do what Skunk3 said. Find few IT shops and build configuration by yourself that will suit you. Good advice is to ask someone on local NL forums where and what to get to make a best possible rig for money you'd like to spend.

For 600-700€ you can build a PC that will run every game on highest settings for next 1-2 years.
And if you choose good processor you'll only need to change graphics card in a few years.

That's what I did last year. Only mistake I made was to buy RX460 which is low end gpu, and I already want something better. For everything else - this PC is a beast. Got it for ~600€.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 03, 2017, 11:15 PM
I do actually take my laptop about with me, so yes, it's very important that it's mobile, you could have asked 1st though, cuz the truth is, i'm going to be getting rid of my desktop PC soon, and replacing it with a laptop, I just like them better, i've had pretty much no issues with my laptops where I constantly have issues with desktops.

And the worst thing about having a desktop, is cleaning it, I hate that, laptops are insanely easy to keep clean.

laptops take up less space, I don't want to have to pack/unpack PC everytime I move house/change things, which is quite a lot.

There are many advantages of laptops you may not even realize...

Anyway, neither is a waste of money, all comes down to personal taste, same with consoles, it's really just a waste of your breath complaining about what other people like, unless it's dangerous or illegal.

"For 600-700€ you can build a PC that will run every game on highest settings for next 1-2 years."

I don't believe that, please convince me otherwise with evidence, i'm patient.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Sensei on October 03, 2017, 11:30 PM
Go into triad PC thread and you'll find lot of great rigs for about the price I've said up there.
I'm not gonna search web and build components to prove you it's possible - cause it is.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2017, 12:09 AM
Sorry Sensei that's not how it works lol.

It may or may not be true but I would need evidence, not hear say and speculation, Triads thread doesn't show any footage of top games played with equipment for that price, not to mention we can't predict what is possible in next 2 years...

I have no doubt you can buy a pc for that price, and have it run the best games fine, but no way is it gonna play every single game at top settings, definitely not as comfortable as possible with no stress on the computer, let alone for the next 1 or 2 years lol.

Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Sensei on October 04, 2017, 01:05 AM
:)

It's ok man.. You don't have overpriced laptop.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2017, 02:44 AM
I don't understand your sarcasm especially after i've already said, my laptop is overpriced.

I don't know, maybe you just don't have enough passion, or you are too lazy to try and back up your statements you made earlier, whatever, i'm happy with my product.

"I'm not gonna search web and build components to prove you it's possible - cause it is."

Are you so confident you would make a £5000 bet? A bet with an official contract we both have to sign, one there is no backing out of, no loopholes.

You build a PC for £700, and if it handles every single game at absolutely full specs, without any signs of stress or struggle for the next 2 years until October 4th 2019, i'll give you £5000.

If any single game, even including games nobody knows about yet, fails in the slightest, you have to give me £5000.

But I know you won't put your money where your mouth is, cuz you aren't that stupid lol.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Sensei on October 04, 2017, 02:57 AM
Are you so confident you would make a £5000 bet?

Ofc not m8. Tho, I'm confident you could buy pretty good laptop for that amount.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheWalrus on October 04, 2017, 05:39 AM
cant build a computer to run highest settings on AAA games for 700

can build a computer to run all AAA games at med settings for 700

thats the difference
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2017, 06:39 AM
Are you so confident you would make a £5000 bet?

Ofc not m8. Tho, I'm confident you could buy pretty good laptop for that amount.

Hah, actually i'd use it to setup a proper music studio, my laptop is better than what most professionals use lol.

But Sensei, I know what you are getting at, was just trying to get you to be more specific, rather than exaggerate slightly.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Sensei on October 04, 2017, 10:42 AM
cant build a computer to run highest settings on AAA games for 700

can build a computer to run all AAA games at med settings for 700

thats the difference

Buddy copied my rig but instead rx460, I convinced him to take rx470 gpu.
It was around 100€ more.
I'm pretty sure he's still maxing out all games he tried.

So.. My rig is 1+ year old. It was 600€ with rx 460. With rx470 it would be around 700€.
It means - with better gpu i would still to this day run everything on max settings.

For 600-700€ you can build a PC that will run every game on highest settings for next 1-2 years.
And if you choose good processor you'll only need to change graphics card in a few years.
Did I said something wrong? No!
Komo just wanted me to prove this type of talk, cause he also knows he could spent his money LOT better than with those 2 laptops he got. But as we both said - it's individual choice and personal opinion. I'm not judging or anything. Just stating some facts and throwing my 2cents.

Thx.
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: XanKriegor on October 04, 2017, 11:02 AM
All i can say is this - laptops are better for music making coz it have a battery by deafult. You will not lose hours of painstaking work if you get a power outage. UPS for a PC is a much different thing, cos PC's power consumption is higher, UPS' power storage capability is lower, switching to battery is not instant and last but not least thing - its battery cant absorb power quickly (coz ancient lead-acid chemistry).
Title: Re: PC console
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2017, 11:20 AM
Did I said something wrong? No!
Komo just wanted me to prove this type of talk, cause he also knows he could spent his money LOT better than with those 2 laptops he got. But as we both said - it's individual choice and personal opinion. I'm not judging or anything. Just stating some facts and throwing my 2cents.

Thx.

Well, it depends on your definition of "better", what's better for you might be worse for me based on our different situation in life and our own goals.

I've already admitted money could be saved if I knew how to build it myself, and could get better hardware if I had bought a desktop instead of a PC.

But let's not forget, please, this started because you said this:

"Laptops is a must have if you're a traveller/bussinesman, but buying one for few thousands $ like Komo did is a total waste of money. (let's be honest, Komo, if you're doing everything from home, I don't see a point in having laptop that's worth that much. Just my opinion) Not to mention spare parts for laptops which is hard or even impossible to replace(!?). "

To be honest, I should be insulted, not because you called it a waste of money, but because you assumed you know enough information about my life to state it was a waste of money, without ANY evidence whatsoever to back that up. Even if you were correct I still wouldn't consider it a waste of money, because as you said it entirely depends on a persons personal opinion, so the fact you went ahead and said that was pretty surprising.

Do not try to wriggle out of this by making excuses, it was ignorant, but I honestly don't mind, don't worry about it, I only want to clear this up, so the same mistake won't happen again.

Long story short, I take my laptop everywhere with me, to work where it's used on my breaks, at home, I take it out sometimes when i'm out on my bike and sit in a field or something when I feel creative for a few hours, I take it on holiday with me when visiting Liam/M3ntal so we can share projects/files and work together more efficiently, and most importantly take it with me when I visit studios, meet clients or anyone who wants to collaborate and they can't visit my house.

After that I actually want you to prove to me that a £700 computer can run ANY game in the world, or any game that will come out for the next 2 years, cuz i'll tell you what, it sure as sh*t won't beat this laptop ;)

I don't ask this because i'm trying to prove you wrong, i'm asking this because I want you to prove me wrong, cuz if you actually show me something, I might buy it lol. Did you ever think of that?

Edit - Also, what Xan said about battery, it's actually happened to me before and I lost work, that's a very useful bonus.





Title: Re: PC console
Post by: Anubis on October 05, 2017, 01:32 AM

When it comes to multiplayer PC gaming, having a more powerful machine actually does confer an advantage in some games. I play some games with a buddy of mine and he has a really nice PC with multiple monitors, including a 4k @ 120... he will always be calling out enemies to me on the map and I'm looking and can't see them... the 4k resolution helps immensely. Blah blah blah.

The resolution does not affect FOV, the aspect ratio does. You/he could be playing in a cinema and he will still see the same area. 16:9, 16:10, 4:3. That's it, can't cheat the game with bigger screens/resolution.

For 600-700€ you can build a PC that will run every game on highest settings for next 1-2 years.
And if you choose good processor you'll only need to change graphics card in a few years.

Also, Komo/wally are right, you can build a PC to run the newest most fanciest games for 6-700€ on medium. I have a i7 6700k and high quality MSI GTX 1070 (which was 450€ on it's own half a year ago) and can play most on Ultra with 60+ FPS with Full HD (1080p). But even with this much power I find games (Deus Ex: Mankind Divided, my god is it hardware hungry) that I can't run at maximum settings with everything turned on.

If you want Ultra/Maximum graphic fidelity you will need approx. 1k Euro, especially if you want to last 1-2 years. And we are talking 60fps to count as "can run maximum", nobody in their right mind wants to look at 30 fps eye cancer and get a headache unless you got used by it from years of 30 fps on consoles. :P

CPU and GPU are 700€ish on it's own to get Ultra on all games. Then add SSD/HDD, Decent MB, some decent PSU (don't be stupid and buy 600W no-name PSU...) and DDR4 8GB and you are easily around 1k. And that's without a PC case or any extras.

Here is stock rx470 vs stock gtx 1070: http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-1070-vs-AMD-RX-470/3609vs3640

I can barely hit 60+ on every game maxed out. I can say with 100% confidence your 470x will never, EVER, run every game currently at maximum fidelity on 1080p. Your friends RX470 is low middle class. While my 1070 is low upper class. To be "safe" for 1-2 years you would need a 1080 GTX or AMD equivalent (Vega or some shit), which is 500€+. Good luck building a PC with 700 Euro when your video card is 500ish. :D