The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
All About TUS => TUS Discussion => Topic started by: Albus on October 15, 2021, 02:29 PM
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Would it be interesting to establish that in the PO system the player can only choose 1 rope scheme, unless both agreed to choose more?
When the roping skill gap between 2 players is big, the player who like rope schemes and has good skills with rope has guaranteed wins in roper, rope race, ttrr or wxw.
I will make a comparison. My favorite scheme is intermediate. I have an advantage in this scheme compared to many players who do not like/play this scheme. Now imagine if I could choose intermediate, 80normal and freemediate (if you are very good at intermediate, you will have a good advantage in these schemes). Although I don't play 80normal and freemediate a lot, as they are more similar to intermediate, I would take a good advantage over those who don't like intermediate. The same goes for rope schemes. Someone who is pro with rope will also have a huge advantage in any schemes where rope skill is the most important against people who don't play rope schemes.
In my last PO against VoK, I already knew that I would have two losses in the rope schemes he choose (he likes to pick wxw and roper). It's okay for people to pick rope in the PO and have a guaranteed win against the opponent who doesn't play rope schemes. But being able to choose up to 3 rope schemes in a PO maybe it's not the best choice.
Perhaps the PO could be like this: choose 1 rope scheme; aerial or hysteria; intermediate; BnG; team 17; Elite. The picks in this way would be between schemes that don't have much similarity to each other. In other words, if a person is very good at one, they will not necessarily be good at the other (unlike what happens when a pro roper can choose wxw, roper, ttrr and RR).
I think the idea of alrround PO should be to recognize players who specialize in different schemes. If someone specializes in rope, it's obvious that he's going to win any rope scheme against someone who doesn't have good rope skills. But if someone specializes in intermediate, that doesn't guarantee he'll be good at Team 17 or hysteria, for example.
EDIT (final suggestion):
After reading the comments (disregarding the troll comment) I bring here a suggestion that I think could be more fair and transmit better the spirit of allround:
In allround PO players should play all allround schemes (if it's allround PO why not make it really allround?) with the following peculiarities:
1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match
Other alternative:
1 BnG
1 Aerial or Hysteria (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Rope scheme (choosen by the best positioned in rope league)
1 Elite or intermediate (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Team17 match
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Yeah, what about rope players who can't play ground schemes? What a dumb idea
Git gud
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Yeah, what about rope players who can't play ground schemes? What a dumb idea
Git gud
And what about ground players who can't play or don't like rope schemes? What a dumb idea.
Ground schemes can be very different of each other and demand very different skills and tatics. Because I'm good in inter, this means i'm good in BnG or hysteria? What you say has absolutely no logic. If you are pro roper, you will be good or have a enormous advantage in any rope scheme against those who do not specialize in rope. Then, if you are a pro roper, you will have 2 o 3 free wins because only one skill, ie, roping skills. This is to be a allround player for you? This is unfair and doesn't means that you diserve ALLROUND trophy imo. How can't you see that? It's so obivous.
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WHat are you talking about, a wxw player is completely different than a ttrr one omg get good at rope schemes and grind some points you wanker, you're always whining about everything
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WHat are you talking about, a wxw player is completely different than a ttrr, omg get good at rope schemes and grind your points you wanker, you're always crying about everything
Whoever is pro with the rope win in any rope scheme against those who do not specialize with the rope. All rope schemes demand only one fundamental skill, which is being good with rope. Ground schemes demand different skills. Being good at intermediate does not guarantee you victory in BnG or T17 or hysteria. If you are good in inter, BnG, hysteria, T17, and 1 rope scheme, then YOU ARE ALLROUND PLAYER. But win a PO because you can pick 3 rope schemes and get a free win in this way, this doesn't mean you diserve a throphy of an allround player. You are just a roper player.
"you're always crying about everything"
This is only a f@#!ing suggestion you dumb. I don't care about this f@#!ing shit. I have a choice of don't play PO anymore so why I would have to cry about anything? You called me dumb but you are the dumb here.
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WHat are you talking about, a wxw player is completely different than a ttrr, omg get good at rope schemes and grind your points you wanker, you're always crying about everything
Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope scheme against those who do not specialize with the rope. All rope schemes demand a fundamental skill, which is being good with rope. Ground schemes demand different skills. Being good at intermediate does not guarantee you victory in BnG or T17 or hysteria.
"you're always crying about everything"
This is only a f@#!ing suggestion you dumb. I don't care for this f@#!ing shit. I have a choice of don't play PO anymore so I would have to cry about anything? You called me dumb but you are the dumb here.
"Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope" what the f@#! are you talking about hahahahahahahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahaha why am i even trying to have a discussion with you
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WHat are you talking about, a wxw player is completely different than a ttrr, omg get good at rope schemes and grind your points you wanker, you're always crying about everything
Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope scheme against those who do not specialize with the rope. All rope schemes demand a fundamental skill, which is being good with rope. Ground schemes demand different skills. Being good at intermediate does not guarantee you victory in BnG or T17 or hysteria.
"you're always crying about everything"
This is only a f@#!ing suggestion you dumb. I don't care for this f@#!ing shit. I have a choice of don't play PO anymore so I would have to cry about anything? You called me dumb but you are the dumb here.
"Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope" what the f@#! are you talking about hahahahahahahahahhaahhahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahaha why am i even trying to have a discussion with you
"Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope scheme". Why don't you reply to my entire sentence?
My entire sentence was: "Whoever is pro with the rope will do well in any rope scheme against those who do not specialize with the rope."
Are you here on my topic just to troll?
Are you f@#!ing dumb to don't see this? I'm talking about skills gaps. If you are not good with rope, you will play bad in any rope schemes. If you have good skills in at least ONE rope scheme, this means you will have a enormous advantage in any rope scheme against who don't like rope schemes (THIS IS WHY YOU HAVE 3 FREE WINS IN PO). Sorry, if you don't see logic in that, you are f@#!ing dumb.
If you are f@#!ing noob in inter, and if you play 80normal and freemediate against me, this mean i'll probably have 3 free wins against you, because my skills in intermediate will give me enormous advantages in these other schemes where I can use my intermediate mentality and skills. Same goes for rope schemes. If you are good in only 1 rope scheme (eg, ttrr), you will also be at least much better in WxW and roper and have free wins against who doesn't like rope schemes, BECAUSE ROPE SCHEMES demands one fundametnal skills... being good at rope!! This is different if you compare some ground schemes: i'm good in inter, but i'm noob in hysteria and BnG for example.
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Admit you're butthurting from allround PO, please Mods make a league more suitable for Albus otherwise he will not be able to win ;xxx hauhauahuahuahuah
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Admit you're butthurting from allround PO, please Mods make a league more suitable for Albus otherwise he will not be able to win ;xxx hauhauahuahuahuah
I don't care for this shit man. Think what you want. My favorite scheme here is only team17 and inter. I could not play this shit. I played just to be polite and give some extra activity to the league.
"make a league more suitable for Albus"
Sorry... you are being f@#! dumb again. My proposal included schemes where I'm noob at it (BnG, hysteria, elite), but schemes where if you are good in one, not necessary you will be good in the other one.
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Admit you're butthurting from allround PO, please Mods make a league more suitable for Albus otherwise he will not be able to win ;xxx hauhauahuahuahuah
I don't care for this shit man. Think what you want. My favorite scheme here is only team17 and inter. I could not play this shit. I played just to be polite and give some activity.
There you go
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Admit you're butthurting from allround PO, please Mods make a league more suitable for Albus otherwise he will not be able to win ;xxx hauhauahuahuahuah
I don't care for this shit man. Think what you want. My favorite scheme here is only team17 and inter. I could not play this shit. I played just to be polite and give some activity.
There you go
When I said something different?
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I think you are here to one of these 2 options:
1) to defend your friends who are pro ropers and "allround" PO winners
2) to troll
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@Sbaffo, This is a gaming forum and discussion like this are natural. You don't have to call names if you don't agree. You are warned.
@Albus, You don't have to get even with the name calling either. You are also warned.
@topic,
Yes a very good roper have higher chance of winning rope schemes than a very good ground player in ground schemes but not by a big margin. One solution to combat that is by getting a higher seed in playoffs and get the first pick. You can decrease your opponent picks to 2, so you could pick maximum 3 ground schemes.
This is the current structure of the Allround league. I don't see it necessary to change. TUS leagues will be different in the future.
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@Sbaffo, This is a gaming forum and discussion like this are natural. You don't have to call names if you don't agree. You are warned.
@Albus, You don't have to get even with the name calling either. You are also warned.
Okay MI, I apologize to you. I just come here to give a suggestion and this guy comes up to me saying it's a dumb idea (which in other words is equivalent to calling me dumb imo) and treating it with disrespect and irony. Next time, before being aggressive, I'll try to remember to talk with you first and ask you to do something about it instead of adopt a agressive posture.
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I've suggested a PO system that would require a player to win more than just 1 scheme type (e.g. artillery+rope or strategic+artillery) but some players were against it because they think people should feel competitive in the Classic/Allround league even when they can play only 1 type of schemes. ::)
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Original post
Roper and WxW are different schemes, and so is TTRR. It's not like being good at one of them automatically makes you good at the rest, so that's not a valid argument, in my opinion.
If two players (a ground player and a rope player) are facing each other in PO's, whoever earned more points during the regular season gets to pick 3 schemes. If the person that got more points didn't get any benefit from it, what would be the encouragement for a person to play after qualifying to PO's?
And I also agree that if you are gonna play allround league, you should be able to defend yourself in any scheme, so this sort of change makes it unfair for people that, just like ground specialists, have chosen to specialize in rope schemes.
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Original post
Roper and WxW are different schemes, and so is TTRR. It's not like being good at one of them automatically makes you good at the rest, so that's not a valid argument, in my opinion.
I know they are different schemes. But I'm referring to the fact who is good at rope schemes against who is noob with rope. If you're good at rope and your opponent doesn't like to roping, you'll get 2 or 3 free wins guaranteed. However, the fact that someone is good at 1 ground scheme, for example, intermediate, does not mean that he will be good at hysteria. I'm good at intermediate but I'm bad at hysteria and BnG, and, in order to have chances against someone who isn't good at hysteria/BnG either, I'll have to train and invest time in those schemes. That doesn't happen to people who are good at rope. If you're just playing TTRR and you're really good at it, you don't need to train WxW and Roper to beat someone who isn't good at rope, so you will have 2 or 3 free wins only because of 1 skill (rope skills) in one scheme, because you will always have free wins in rope schemes against people who is noob in roping.
So, I don't consider who wins allround PO an allround player if he gets 3 free wins in rope schemes. Someone can be good in hysteria, BnG, intermediate, elite and lose the PO just because this person is not good with rope and the oponnent get 3 free wins in rope schemes.
Who diserve to be called an allround player or at leas more close to it?
1) pro player in intermediate, hysteria, BnG, team17, but not so good with rope;
2) a guy who, just because is pro with rope, get 3 free wins in the PO picking rope schemes.
Also I think it's much easier to get first place in PO seeds (and have right to 3 picks) if you are pro with roper.
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That doesn't happen to people who are good at rope. If you're just playing TTRR and you're really good at it, you don't need to train WxW and Roper to beat someone who isn't good at rope, so you will have 2 or 3 free wins only because of 1 skill (rope skills) in one scheme, because you will always have free wins in rope schemes against people who is noob in roping.
This is a bold assumption you can't really prove. I had to practice like 5 years to become mediocre at TTRR, and even then I can't play Roper to save my life.
So, I don't consider who wins allround PO an allround player if he gets 3 free wins in rope schemes. Someone can be good in hysteria, BnG, intermediate, elite and lose the PO just because this person is not good with rope and the oponnent get 3 free wins in rope schemes.
Neither is a person that picks 3 ground schemes, but that's not the league's problem. If we had some sort of "balanced" competition, like, a lot of good Allround players, maybe PO's wouldn't look so unbalanced (https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/allround-playoffs/). The problem right now is we don't have the amount of real "Allround" players to justify having it as it is, and separating Rope from Ground probably would make it better, but I don't know.
Actually, IMO, nobody that is only able to play "one half" of the schemes should be winning an "Allround" title.
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That doesn't happen to people who are good at rope. If you're just playing TTRR and you're really good at it, you don't need to train WxW and Roper to beat someone who isn't good at rope, so you will have 2 or 3 free wins only because of 1 skill (rope skills) in one scheme, because you will always have free wins in rope schemes against people who is noob in roping.
This is a bold assumption you can't really prove. I had to practice like 5 years to become mediocre at TTRR, and even then I can't play Roper to save my life.
I don't think so. If you are a pro TTRR player, you will be at least a good player in other rope schemes, because you know mechanics, know how to roping fast and safe etc. So, even if you don't practice wxw and roper too much, I'm sure you can beat who don't like or barely know how to touch 2 walls in roper and make an atack in SD.
So, I don't consider who wins allround PO an allround player if he gets 3 free wins in rope schemes. Someone can be good in hysteria, BnG, intermediate, elite and lose the PO just because this person is not good with rope and the oponnent get 3 free wins in rope schemes.
Neither is a person that picks 3 ground schemes, but that's not the league's problem. If we had some sort of "balanced" competition, like, a lot of good Allround players, maybe PO's wouldn't look so unbalanced (https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/allround-playoffs/). The problem right now is we don't have the amount of real "Allround" players to justify having it as it is, and separating Rope from Ground probably would make it better, but I don't know.
Yes... but at least this person who master many ground schemes (elite, t17, hysteria, intermediate, bng) is much more closer to an allround player (despite not being a true allround player) then one person who wins PO just because is PRO with one main skill (rope skills).
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That doesn't happen to people who are good at rope. If you're just playing TTRR and you're really good at it, you don't need to train WxW and Roper to beat someone who isn't good at rope, so you will have 2 or 3 free wins only because of 1 skill (rope skills) in one scheme, because you will always have free wins in rope schemes against people who is noob in roping.
This is a bold assumption you can't really prove. I had to practice like 5 years to become mediocre at TTRR, and even then I can't play Roper to save my life.
I don't think so. If you are a pro TTRR player, you will be at least a good player in other rope schemes, because you know mechanics, know how to roping fast and safe etc. So, even if you don't practice wxw and roper too much, I'm sure you can beat who don't like or barely know how to touch 2 walls in roper and make an atack in SD.
So, I don't consider who wins allround PO an allround player if he gets 3 free wins in rope schemes. Someone can be good in hysteria, BnG, intermediate, elite and lose the PO just because this person is not good with rope and the oponnent get 3 free wins in rope schemes.
Neither is a person that picks 3 ground schemes, but that's not the league's problem. If we had some sort of "balanced" competition, like, a lot of good Allround players, maybe PO's wouldn't look so unbalanced (https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/allround-playoffs/). The problem right now is we don't have the amount of real "Allround" players to justify having it as it is, and separating Rope from Ground probably would make it better, but I don't know.
Yes... but at least this person who master many ground schemes (elite, t17, hysteria, intermediate, bng) is much more closer to an allround player (despite not being a true allround player) then one person who wins PO just because is PRO with one main skill (rope skills).
I disagree with you, mostly on the rope schemes part, but that's it I suppose. I'm not here to change anyone's mind.
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See... if you practice 10 years ONLY TTRR (nothing else) you agree with me that you will become a PRO TTRR player with very good rope skills right? With that skills, you can play roper, RR, and wxw? Of course you can. And even if you are not so good in those other rope schemes, you still can beat easily someone who doesn't like rope schemes and don't practice it right?
Now, imagine that I play only intermediate for 10 years and become a pro in this scheme. You think because I'm a pro in inter I necessary have any advantage in BnG or hysteria for example? OFC not. I can give the name for you of many pro inter guys who will suck in these schemes. So, this ground scheme player who became a pro in intermediate, will need invest a good ammount of time to become a pro in BnG and hysteria in order to have more chances to win in his ground picks. But the guy who became a pro over 10 years of practising TTRR, doesn't need invest any more time to beat this guy in his rope schemes that he never played before (because he surely will have some advantage he gained from TTRR experience, ie, roping fast, safe etc). So, who wins a allround PO only because rope picks, is much less of an allround player then a guy who is good in several ground schemes.
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If you decide to waste your whole time playing only intermediate that’s only your fault, and btw you’re the only who keep saying that playing ttrr is like playing wxw or shopper 🤣🤣
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If you decide to waste your whole time playing only intermediate that’s only your fault, and btw you’re the only who keep saying that playing ttrr is like playing wxw or shopper 🤣🤣
I never said that. You don't understand anything I say do you?
I'm saying that anyone who spends 10 years playing only TTRR will at least play wxw and roper very well, as these schemes require a common core skill, ie rope skill, in order to you highly increase your chances to win. So, this guys can be a pro only in TTRR (never play other rope schemes) and get first place in allround PO against a ground scheme player who is good in many ground schemes which demand diff skills (for example, inter, hysteria, BnG).
Anyone who spends 10 years playing only intermediate, will not, because of that, have an advantage in BnG or hysteria, for example. So someone who is pro at intermediate, BnG and hysteria, but very average at roping schemes, imo, deserves much more an allround trophy (although he is not a true pro allround player) than a guy who only mastered one main skill (rope skill) and wins because of that free wins in rope picks.
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@topic,
Yes a very good roper have higher chance of winning rope schemes than a very good ground player in ground schemes but not by a big margin. One solution to combat that is by getting a higher seed in playoffs and get the first pick. You can decrease your opponent picks to 2, so you could pick maximum 3 ground schemes.
Yes, the best strategy for the ground player, according to the current system, is to get 1st place and be entitled to the 3 picks.
But still, I think the roper player has an advantage in the current system even if he has only 2 picks. I will tell you why in my opinion.
The schemes that can be chosen in the allround PO are as follows:
aerial
Big RR / Tower Race
BNG
Elite
hysteria
Intermediate
Roper
shopper
team17
TTRR (in RR)
WxW
Imagine 2 examples of players:
Player 1) played 10 years of BnG. The guy is a beast in BnG, but only that.
Player 2) played 10 years of TTRR. The guy have insane skills in TTRR. Play super fast and safe with the rope.
Who is most favored in the system? Let's see.
Player 2) will definitely have 2 free wins in any rope scheme, as he has mastered ONLY one skill, the rope skill. This means that this player will only need to train 1 more scheme to win the PO.
Player 1) has only one guaranteed win, which is BnG. In order to win the PO, he will have to learn two new schemes in order to achieve a high chance of winning in these other schemes.
In other words, the current system, in my opinion, favors the rope player (requiring less effort from him in order to beat the ground player), that's why I proposed the suggestion that only 1 rope scheme could be chosen.
Making a comparison, I see the PO system as something like this:
player 1 (pro TTRR player) - Hafthor Bjornsson.
player 2 (pro BnG player) - Usain Bolt.
Both will participate in a competition involving various sports and they have to win a Bo5.
It turns out that Bjornsson will have the advantage, as he has several sports options where he will uses a main and core skill (brute force - which in the case of the TTRR player, would be the skill with the rope). Usain Bolt will have to work harder, as the skill he has (running - in the case of the BnG player, aiming skill) it won't give him such a huge advantage in the other sports he chooses, differently of what happens to Bjornsson.
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BnG player would also be good at Aerial and Hysteria
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BnG player would also be good at Aerial and Hysteria
and at Elite ^.-
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BnG player would also be good at Aerial and Hysteria
and at Elite ^.-
Yes. I think every skill you acquire in one scheme can be used in another, to a greater or lesser extent. But if we look at allround PO schemes, the ones that benefit the most is the rope skill, as this is main and core skill in any rope scheme.
The skills of BnG, although they can be used in these other schemes (including intermediate - not mentioned there), is not enough. You will need to develop other skills, eg, positioning, tactics, strategy, good knowledge of scheme settings etc. You can be bad at BnG and beat someone in these schemes, even if that person is better than you in BnG. This doesn't happen with rope schemes, where if you are noob with the rope, and the guy is PRO with the rope (even if he plays only one scheme, eg, TTRR), he will beat you in any rope scheme. That's why I suggested that, unless agreed, the player has the right to choose only 1 rope scheme. That way we would have allround PO involving more diverse abilities (the true spirit of allround).
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In my opinion the best solution for this would be to have 2 extra playoffs making it to 3 Playoffs for every season for each league category instead of currently 1.
That would be:
PO Rope - Rope schemes.
PO Default - Default schemes.
PO Allround - All schemes (Using Albus' format.)
Each player that reaches PO in the season would be elegible to play these, fair chances to defaulters and ropers, no more excuses... And in a way it would encourage players even more as they would then be able to collect 3 trophies per season instead of just 1.
What do you guys think? ;D
Would definately come back more active if this gets implemented.
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In my opinion the best solution for this would be to have 2 extra playoffs making it to 3 Playoffs for every season for each league category instead of currently 1.
That would be:
PO Rope - Rope schemes.
PO Default - Default schemes.
PO Allround - All schemes (Using Albus' format.)
Each player that reaches PO in the season would be elegible to play these, fair chances to defaulters and ropers, no more excuses... And in a way it would encourage players even more as they would then be able to collect 3 trophies per season instead of just 1.
What do you guys think? ;D
Would definately come back more active if this gets implemented.
I support this idea c: Would be noice. If old time players are giving hints of the possiblity that they might return, why not make some reforms to the system? We might have more players and even more activity in the leagues
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Yes. The idea is to provide players with places where they fit. If you are a ground player, you will have the default PO with ground schemes. If you want to be a rope player, you will have rope PO with rope schemes. But if you want to be an allround player, you will have allround PO, where you have to play a varied combination of rope and ground schemes that require different skills.
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Hi All
I've not read the whole thread but I remember thinking this before. However, the all-round PO system is also advantageous for a default player, IF they are seeded and get to pick first.
The rules in POs are that you cannot have more than 3 rope schemes (or more than 3 default). So if I'm default heavy, here is an example of a potential PO situation with a roper like dibz.
1st pick me (I can pick elite/inter/t17/bng/hysteria) - i pick elite
2nd pick dibz - he can pick between rope, ttrr, wxw, shopper) he picks rr
3rd pick me (I can still pick between inter/t17/bng/hysteria) - i pick t17
4th pick dibz - (he can pick between rope, wxw,shopper) - he picks wxw
5th and final pick - (i can pick between inter/bng/hysteria) - pick bng
In playoffs you can also force the rope schemes down because they are maxed out at only 3 rope schemes. Therefore often when CKC faced a clan in playoffs who were better ropers and seeded higher than us. As they had first pick, we'd pick shopper, to stop more rope schemes. For example.
1st pick cfc - (they can pick wxw, rope, ttrr, shopper) - they pick ttrr
2nd pick CKC - (instead of picking a default, we force an rope based scheme pick and pick shopper)
3rd pick cfc (they can pick wxe and only rope for final rope scheme based game) - they pick wxw
4th pick CKC - no more rope schemes, we now pick bng.
5th pick cfc - no more rope schemes and maybe deciding match and they are forced to pick from - elite, t17, inter, hysteria.
I think the PO system is fine as it favours those who finish higher in the standings that seasons and that is the point. In all round league we still have clans and players are are more rope based, and some that are more default based. Finish 1st in league and you'll have no problem :)
However, on the flip side of all of this. It would be worth viewing what games are being picked in a season. Maybe the 3 max rules for rope/default picks could be scrapped, so that if 2 default players met in POs, they are not forced to pick rope schemes if they both agree? But that isn't very allround. So either way if you have 3 rope and 2 default, or 3 default and 2 rope. This is more allround than 4/5 rope picks and 4/5 default picks.... if that makes sense?
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This is a nice idea to fix this problem Chicken, but I would rather see how clans and players could perform in both scenarios, default and rope, instead of sacrificing a scheme pick to prevent my opponent of playing their most comfortable schemes.
I like my idea better of having 3 or 2 playoffs for each Rope and Default schemes + 1 Allround playoff using Albus or yours format (check my previous post.)
Fair enough for ropers, defaulters + able to collect multiple trophies per season if true allrounder + more games to play and watch.
I think this make much more sense as schemes are marked with default and rope league. It could even be only 2 playoffs, the third would just be an extra chance or recap etc...
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Default and rope playoffs were a thing for 2 seasons, then stopped because inactivity?
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Yes, I imagine the activity would be the problem.
But anyway... I think making PO's allround truly allround would be the best solution at the moment.
1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match
This is a true allround PO and not what sometimes happens: someone has 2 or even 3 free wins because they are very good with only one main skill (rope skill) and the opponent is not. In this proposed format, in each round, players should show skills in each style of allround scheme, where the fact that you are good in one does not guarantee victory in the other.
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I've suggested a PO system that would require a player to win more than just 1 scheme type (e.g. artillery+rope or strategic+artillery) but some players were against it because they think people should feel competitive in the Classic/Allround league even when they can play only 1 type of schemes. ::)
Guess this would be best in my opinion.
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The schemes are NOT simply marked "rope" and "default". They wear those tags because they belong to those leagues. That means we already have a separate "default" league and a separate "rope" league which means we have separate playoffs for each. We don't run their playoffs because we don't reach enough activity for each of them. If we had enough activity, we would have 3 playoffs each season.
That being said, I don't think multiple playoffs work anymore. There should be only one.
1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match
That's your point of view and it's obviously subjective. A roper player could easily count Intermediate and Elite as similar schemes the same way you see TTRR and Roper as similar schemes.
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Yes, elite and intermediate can be considered a bit similar by some people. But if it were like this:
1 BnG
1 Aerial or Hysteria (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Rope scheme (choosen by the best positioned in rope league)
1 Elite or intermediate (choosen by the best positioned in default league)
1 Team17 match
5 matches with completely different schemes.
By the way, I don't think I expressed myself correctly. TTRR and roper are not similar imo. I meant that whoever is PRO in TTRR (ie, has high level skill with the rope - eg, Rudolf), even if he never played any other rope scheme before, has a guaranteed win against someone who doesn't dominate the rope (like me, Rafka etc.) in any other rope scheme (roper, wxw, RR). The idea would be to make players play schemes where being good at one doesn't guarantee they'll be good at other one which demand the same main and core skill.
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The schemes are NOT simply marked "rope" and "default". They wear those tags because they belong to those leagues. That means we already have a separate "default" league and a separate "rope" league which means we have separate playoffs for each. We don't run their playoffs because we don't reach enough activity for each of them. If we had enough activity, we would have 3 playoffs each season.
That being said, I don't think multiple playoffs work anymore. There should be only one.
100% well said, MonkeyIsland. I have still seen Sbaffo understanding "Clanner Tus any1" as "we are gonna pick rope, you are screwed :) ". Thank God there are still players like Jimmy or Senator who separate "Default tus" from "Rope league", and with whom we had great Elite + T17 picks.
Albus has got the point though... and since I joined here in 2012 it has always been a bit strange and unfair to me that there are many schemes (Wxw, Roper, Big rope race, TTRR, ...) all involving... 1 Inventory Weapon/Tool??? (Rope).
How about we have 5 schemes in which the "Mole" (weapon) is used?? I bet my kidney that I would have a guaranteed win against whoever is bad at this weapon. After all you can use these pets for aka Golf purpose, for Basketball scheme (making Moles accurately fly through tiny indestructable spaces), you can do Vanguard scheme (Parachute + dropping Mole from above). You can also fly towards a specific fort, and when releasing it underneath, invade a new fort with it, tunneling yourself through.
Now you might say "It doesn't make sense, all you do is just releasing a mole", but funny thing is that the same can be said about Wxw, Roper, Big Roper Race, TTRR. it's just relocating yourself with rope. Nothing else. All you do is just adding some random different purposes to it, but at the end of the day, you just do the same thing :-[
(Trick race is absolutely different though)
There are of course different demands for people here and there. I love watching the most competitive Rope players. I think there is a beauty hidden there but having what... 50% of All Round schemes about the use of 1 weapon? 1 weapon??? .... that's just some bad joke. It has absolutely nothing to do with being better at Worms Armageddon. That''s why I feel sorry for whoever needs to be in the Classic league All round POs.
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Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you ;)
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Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you ;)
You don't seem to understand... :) I already meet many players half-way by entering Default Classic league and Default Classic clanners. Today with danie we lost Elite + Team17 but it's okay, we will learn to play better over time. These are not my most fun schemes, nor schemes where I play too well, but I still play them to get to know some players and to integrate with them :) You are stuck in your cheap wins (in many cases free wins), You are stuck in your roping schemes, and refusing to leave your comfort zone even for a moment. That's the cowardice you are known for. Just be grateful that WA scene is so centered around your roping and stop barking at Albus.
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Albus has got the point though... and since I joined here in 2012 it has always been a bit strange and unfair to me that there are many schemes (Wxw, Roper, Big rope race, TTRR, ...) all involving... 1 Inventory Weapon/Tool??? (Rope).
How about we have 5 schemes in which the "Mole" (weapon) is used?? I bet my kidney that I would have a guaranteed win against whoever is bad at this weapon.
Now you might say "It doesn't make sense, all you do is just releasing a mole", but funny thing is that the same can be said about Wxw, Roper, Big Roper Race, TTRR. it's just relocating yourself with rope. Nothing else. All you do is just adding some random different purposes to it, but at the end of the day, you just do the same thing :-[
Exactly Zalo! I think allround PO should involve play many different schemes, in which you will have to use different skills and strategy to win, ie, being good in one scheme of these schemes (that demands a main skill), doesn't guarantee your victory in the "similar scheme" (ie, that involves a same and main skill in order to highly increase your chances of victory) against those who haven't mastered this skill.
Examples:
BnG and Golf (if someone is PRO in BnG, certainly will beat someone who is noob with BnG skills at Golf too);
TTRR and roper (if someone is PRO in TTRR, certainly will beat someone who doesn't know how to rope well);
Intermediate and 80normal etc.
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Either rope or default, im still going to play vs you, that’s the difference between me and people like you ;)
You don't seem to understand... :) I already meet many players half-way by entering Default Classic league and Default Classic clanners. Today with danie we lost Elite + Team17 but it's okay, we will learn to play better over time. These are not my most fun schemes, nor schemes where I play too well, but I still play them to get to know some players and to integrate with them :) You are stuck in your cheap wins (in many cases free wins), You are stuck in your roping schemes, and refusing to leave your comfort zone even for a moment. That's the cowardice you are known for. Just be grateful that WA scene is so centered around your roping and stop barking at Albus.
Funny that i’ve been hearing that i am only a rope player, but you know what else is also funny? Last time i’ve heard your name you were pumping your ego around the forums so much that you put your money upfront in a challenge, and when you got the chance to prove your self you ran away, you ran away so bad you flew to Mexico and got your self a new profile… i think you should think twice before calling someone coward and talking about my reputation like that because it doesn’t look like you have a better one.
I love how you guys take it so personally when someone disagree with your ideas you feel to urge to past walls of texts, thinking that the more words you put in your posts the more it is going to look rightful or some shit like that hauahauahauahauahu
Like we say in my village “lend me your brain, i need a vacation”, altro che Gonzalo al massimo sei un Cozzalo
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I love how you guys take it so personally when someone disagree with your ideas
Oh, what a saint he is. I’ve got your number.
You don't add anything to a debate. You are totally partial who want just defend you interests.
Isn't that the point of debate? To defend your interests? Aren't you doing the same for pages now?
Yes. The difference is that he comes here to defend only his exclusive interest and with partiality and irony. He doesn't know how to have a correct posture in a debate.
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You are totally partial who want just defend you interests.
Isn't that the point of debate? To defend your interests? Aren't you doing the same for pages now?
You guys just keep talking about rope and ground schemes for ages now but no one is doing anything to bring new blood. And there's this funny Lupastic guy, not sleeping for days to promote his SUPERSHEEPER (yeah, fkn supersheeper) cup in #ag.
If clans had 20% of his will power, to recruit and train new ppl, you could have some serious talk about league system.
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I'd advise everyone to stick to the topic. I'll remove irrelevant posts.
There are of course different demands for people here and there. I love watching the most competitive Rope players. I think there is a beauty hidden there but having what... 50% of All Round schemes about the use of 1 weapon? 1 weapon??? .... that's just some bad joke. It has absolutely nothing to do with being better at Worms Armageddon. That''s why I feel sorry for whoever needs to be in the Classic league All round POs.
It is simply supply and demand. If Mole had so many dedicated players to make websites/content for it or it could alone attract players just to "Mole", then yes we would dedicate a whole section for it.
Worms game series was originally designed to be played as a ground battle but the "Rope" made worms so much more. The weapon "Rope" in this game is something to be cherished and appreciated.
Back to the main topic:
In the future, I'm planning to change the way leagues work. It won't be about Rope/Default leagues anymore.
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The schemes are NOT simply marked "rope" and "default". They wear those tags because they belong to those leagues. That means we already have a separate "default" league and a separate "rope" league which means we have separate playoffs for each. We don't run their playoffs because we don't reach enough activity for each of them. If we had enough activity, we would have 3 playoffs each season.
That being said, I don't think multiple playoffs work anymore. There should be only one.
1 BnG match
1 Aerial match
1 Hysteria match
1 Rope match (scheme chosen by the best positioned in the rope league)
1 Elite match
1 Intermediate match
1 Team17 match
That's your point of view and it's obviously subjective. A roper player could easily count Intermediate and Elite as similar schemes the same way you see TTRR and Roper as similar schemes.
I must have missed when tus had multiple playoffs then, never heard it was a thing.
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i just want to say i think POs are advantageous to ropers just as much as POs are advantageous to default players.
Whoever picks first has a bigger advantage. Senator has informed me that the rule I said about where you could force a shopper pick to max out 3 rope pick no longer exists. Therefore the system is more advantageous to whoever has first pick, that could be a more rope based player, or a default based player.
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Would we ever go back to the old PO rules that I mentioned? This would give a bit more advantage to non ropers who are not seeded higher than their opponent because they could pick shopper and max out the rope based schemes :)
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Well no but we'll have scheme categories and each player can pick one scheme per category in the POs.