The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
All About TUS => TUS Discussion => Topic started by: Bonhert on December 15, 2012, 10:53 AM
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Ok. It's been few months since I came back and there's been one thing that I found especially frustrating. That is looking for a league match sometimes for hours and not being able to find one. Having to spam #AG is also rather unpleasant part of worming for most of us.
So during on of those lazy evenings I've scrolled through #AG chat and noticed that people often ask for tus, wait few mins, go afk/leave/join funners, then just few mins later someone else pops up and asks for tus, then again. So I've came with an idea, that you might be already familiar with from some other games.
That is matchmaking mechanism, which can be also implemented in a browser (I've it seen in Heroes of Newerth league).
Basically it would work somehow like this:
1. You click button "I want to play tus now" on the website.
2. You're put in a queue and your button changes to "Looking for a game...".
3. Algorithm searches for a proper rival (we can skip this in the beginning as it might be not needed with current number of games, but I believe matchmaking would increase number of games greatly over time).
4. When players are paired button changes to "Match found" and both players receive relevant information.
Optional settings for the future and discussion:
- algorithm (already mentioned),
- random scheme,
- random map,
- option to select "Quick find" for shorter queue but less balanced games.
People could still play games old-fashioned way.
PS. I'm willing to help or even do all the coding.
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We had one at WormsLeague long ago. It worked nicely for a few weeks, but then it became rather inactive.
I think for most people it's still easiest just to go on snoop and ask for TUS.
Especially if you want to make the games balanced. I know a few guys who like the games when they aren't especially balanced :-[ :x
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great idea.... this could work if u do it correctly ~!
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this is something I would pretty much always use when I am logged into TUS, would be so great.
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Matchmaking is a good way to prevent avoiding and it makes the standings waaaaay more accurate. From my (very) competitive point of view this is actually a must-have and should be enforced once implemented. I really think this was TPL's and AL's mistake, it didn't work out because people could still look for games the old-fashioned way and keep picking their opponents, avoiding etc. An avoider or noob basher wouldn't ever use it if he didn't have to. :)
Edit: If this is ever going to happen personally I'd like to see the overall standings reset right before it kicks in. Can still save them in a hall of fame sort of thing.
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For singles this could be made the only way to find a TUS.
Would have a more diverse set of games played then.
Scheme picks could be made later.
It would be funny if you declare scheme as you enter the matchmaker - you could end up with best players of a scheme playing eachother! I understand that this creates luck element though.
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Also would be cool to make reporting possible only after system understand you are paired with your opponent
So in fact you can't avoid at all ;D
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Also would be cool to make reporting possible only after system understand you are paired with your opponent
So in fact you can't avoid at all ;D
Yep
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I think that may work to solve avoiding issue, but I think it will cause some issues. What if I want to play with my friend?
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You can give players more points for using the challenge system.
And even more points for having the challenge system choose scheme as well.
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You can still play with your friend, just not TUS unless you're roughly the same rank and both queuing for a TUS match. I really don't see the problem to be honest. :D
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It would work better as a desktop application, and even more better, as a Snooper plug-in, but I doubt it will be made :)
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oh and MI I am sure u can play with ur friend a TUS if u both click the button somewhat same time, sometimes there are 0 people searching for tus games ):
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I'm glad you guys finally noticed the topic ;), as I consider this game-finding solution extremely comfortable and very competitive. I'd like to address just a few thing that have been mentioned.
It would be funny if you declare scheme as you enter the matchmaker - you could end up with best players of a scheme playing each other! I understand that this creates luck element though.
Yes! There could also be an option, for example, to delete one scheme from queue, if you don't want to play it. There are really many ways to play around.
It would work better as a desktop application, and even more better, as a Snooper plug-in, but I doubt it will be made :)
Sounds very nice and would need to be merged with the website queue.
I'm quite sure this can be implemented by using, for example, PHP SDK library.
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somehow this way looks uncomfortable to me. wouldnt be really motivated to visit tus every time before i play a game, then waiting until some shitty stuff is lighting up and beeing paired with some random person. just speaking for myself, i play most games with people i enjoy to play/talk. i guess our main problem is we have different groups of people playing this league. some take it serious, others play all the time, some just play now and then for the fun of an competetive game. i would rather see a complete new more serious league co existing with the current classic one. there you could add this feature.
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I think that may work to solve avoiding issue, but I think it will cause some issues. What if I want to play with my friend?
U can still play with ur friends. It is meant as an alternative besides the normal #AG Spamming which could be frustrating, especially for people like me who love skillgames like BigRR or just fun things from free league where it is rlly hard to find a partner for that :P
The idea is very good.
For some people u could add a button: Noobbashing only. XDDDD :D :D :D
Or for people like me who try a lot of times the opposite / other things: PRObashing :P 8)
Edit:
- Important is that u can set how long ur announcement (asking for a tusgame / tus league / tusscheme) should be shown.
- U can click leave if u join a funner or if u gtg b4 the time of ur shown announcement is over.
- To avoid avoiding it must not be allowed to click quit if u see who will be your opponent.
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...
("\(*;..;*)/")
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This idea looking very nice for me, coz i played Heroes of newerth and i know that it works very nice. But difference between those games is very high, also HoN have general system, there league is included to the game. Here is tus and wa are not intersect.
So it wont work like th genaral mechanism, it would be just helper for searching oponent. :(
Else we will have many troubles.
Also i painted it:
(http://i049.radikal.ru/1304/f9/9becf0b30804.png)
(http://s020.radikal.ru/i722/1304/75/fb89f9bcf759.png)
xDDdddd
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Well, I had this idea a while back also. It was a slight alternative idea where you could set your status as looking for a tus single/clanner (with specific needs like only rope/no rope/hysteria only...) and you'd see how many people are looking for tus and you could just do that matchmaking right after.
I liked that idea but then someone said truly that there's already AG for that and I remember it didn't work that well in past..So I dropped my idea :)
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yeah, it would be as simple and awesome as Rogi's img shows
maybe someone can do such feature and contact MI when it's done?
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i cant see those images :(
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imagine the amount of games people would find with this feature
at the moment people ask 10 mins for tus in ag and quit because no1 answers them (there are many people ready for tus but they r browsing the internet and doesn't get a sound when someone asks tus)
let me rephrase that: there are many players in #ag that want to tus, but they don't see u asking for tus...
also: u ask 10 mins for tus, u get bored and ask less frequently, during those times ppl might wanna tus but u r not asking ):
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A desktop application would be better, as it would be easier to implement a sound notification feature. I don't think it should be enforced, as it would only increase the activity amongst those, who look for games the way Bonhert described (myself included). So it only adds one more layer of possibility how to find a game.
The big thing in my opinion could be that the system would notify you whenever one of your cup opponents is online on the site and/or #AG. That would be nice, just a modal window on the site saying: "Hey you lazy f*ck! Your opponent you didn't bother to play with is available!" or something similar and less harsh perhaps. :D
But that's getting off the rails a little. About the topic, I was preaching for something like this to implemented years ago, without much success. :(
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That's exactly the case Husk. Recently I've also been too lazy to spam AG to find enough TUS games. Currently quite a lot of dedication is needed to play enough games to qualify into playoffs. I'm sure that with this system more people would play enough games and we would have more competition as it would take less effort to find a match.
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we rly need this: chanserv gave me don't-know-how-long-maybe-few-mins-ban for asking clanner any1 in #ag...
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I'll see what I can do.
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Didn't read the whole thread, but I assume that you are talking about "The League Queue", right?, you put yourself on a queue, waiting for a single/clanner match, someone accept and play.
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yeah, no more 1000x "tus any1" in ag just to find 1 opponent
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Bump for brilliant idea. Any plans for this?
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Now I im vacations , i can playing with all players hehe :D
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I agree, I really want this feature.
Especially if you can get the matchmaker to select a scheme for you. I always end up playing the same schemes with the same players with this picking system.
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yes, also wa:// links, the website would host a game for you and offer you to click on your WA link to open WA.EXE to host the game with the needed parameters (not compatible with WormNAT2 !)
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That sounds sweet Steps.. I'm corcerned however that it would encourage more noobashing, people like chelsea for instance could pick among which opponent he would like to play. The feature would have be random imo; you don't know to what player you agree to play versus. Would actually be kind of exciting entering the link, who am I playing this time? :D
My other concern is that it would lead to less activity on WN. We would be kind of distancing ourselves from AG, wouldn't we?
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chels would find a way to noob bash no matter what we do!
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The feature would have be random imo; you don't know to what player you agree to play versus. Would actually be kind of exciting entering the link, who am I playing this time? :D
this would be exciting =P
oh and I agree with the concern
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allow only matchmaking, force up 4 schemes each tus classic game (2 rope 2 default), disallow any scheme agreement ,disable all the useless shitleagues (leave trl with a default roatation of x schemes), reset all stats. stop to lick the ass of people who only want to play a certain scheme or you create another 20 xrayez who have a life long passion to add weapons and rules to hysteria. ae the komo is strong in me ;D
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f@#! it
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allow only matchmaking, force up 4 schemes each tus classic game (2 rope 2 default), disallow any scheme agreement ,disable all the useless shitleagues (leave trl with a default roatation of x schemes), reset all stats. stop to lick the ass of people who only want to play a certain scheme or you create another 20 xrayez who have a life long passion to add weapons and rules to hysteria. ae the komo is strong in me ;D
Wow, Peja respects and likes me recently :D
I was going to be inactive, but if you implement this feature... oHohoho ;) I would throw aerial scheme in Free league, and I would start playing classic league without any chance being intentionally noobashed in ttrr, and without no side-thoughts about to noob-bash others in hysteria :)
+ People would start playing BnG xD
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Does it matter if you suck in a certain scheme. Once you lose enough times you lose not many points anymore. Match making would be fun as long as you are locked into the match and quitting just because you don't like the scheme or opponent resulted in a free win.
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I agree, I really want this feature.
Especially if you can get the matchmaker to select a scheme for you. I always end up playing the same schemes with the same players with this picking system.
this +1
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This is a wonderful idea. I'm all for it and I think it would make the game much, much better and bring more people to the competitive scene. It has be done right, of course. Else it will fail like some might expect it to so I think it's important to keep the development very open for community input.
I'd gladly help if help is needed.
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havn't been to tus lately, this idea got any spark recently?
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Matchmaking for whom, husk?
TUS league scene is in worst condition ever :)
Only games that are being reported are from cups and tournaments.
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I wonder whether matchmaking is still relevant for TUS... I need matchmaking for the game I develop and it's a concept I'd like to delve into anyway in spite of TUS inactivity, so maybe I could come up with some solution as a by-product of my experiments. ???
For instance, Steam (https://partner.steamgames.com/doc/features/multiplayer/matchmaking) has a detailed description of how their matchmaking services work.
yes, also wa:// links, the website would host a game for you and offer you to click on your WA link to open WA.EXE to host the game with the needed parameters (not compatible with WormNAT2 !)
I also thought about that, so basically there could be a proxy lobby similar to WormNET one (with chat), but also with an ability for automatic pairing, notifications, beeping, alarms. This would be a small desktop app built upon a tiny game engine that would connect to a matchmaking server though, hmm.
Just my 2 cents, don't expect anything. :D