The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
Leagues => Leagues Games Comments => Topic started by: Sensei on February 15, 2024, 05:05 PM
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Totally forgot about auto-reaim is even possible. This should be installed into TUS BnG scheme right away.
It won't stop people from using marked spots for their 4sec max power nades, but it surely would make them look foolish with their thumb on the screen for 20+ seconds :)
Really no reason this isn't part of BnG yet.
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This is not gonna possible at all and you can tell it simply by looking at Free's reaction in this game lol imagine how other people would react to this
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It was already added but...
https://www.tus-wa.com/forums/tus-discussion/anti-lock-in-bng-32911/
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This is not gonna possible at all and you can tell it simply by looking at Free's reaction in this game lol imagine how other people would react to this
[TdC-Free] u dont know what i mean about reaiming
[TdC-Free] getting the same exact cursor spot
[TdC-Free] harder to do when u start from floor level etc
[MV-Quasimoto] reaiming was a rule made in order to avoid that thing
Well, since only "good" reason to not include auto-reaim in BnG is that players would need to work a bit harder to achieve one of the lamest tactics game can offer.. I'm sure us two will be in a minority of wanting a scheme to be a bit more competitive.
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It was added, but then removed because it gives people who count their shots an advantage.
It's that simple, read it all if you want.
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It also gives an advantage to people who don't notch NOR use visual aids to repeat/adjust the previous shot. It would be fair to remove the re-aim rule completely so that people are not at disadvantage if they don't use visual aids.
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It also gives an advantage to people who don't notch OR use visual aids to repeat/adjust the previous shot. It would be fair to remove the re-aim rule completely so that people are not at disadvantage if they don't use visual aids.
Senator, we've been through this before.
For starters, EVERYBODY notches! What I am talking about, is COUNTING out your shots!
And visual aids? So what, we're not allowed to use our eyes, or the game? Not allowed to use markers on the screen or our own bodies lol? What madness is that?
It's thanks to visual aids people even have a chance against people who count their shots in BnG.
With the auto-reaim implemented the aim automatically resets, and that's how people who count play BnG, they reset the aim to the top, or from blowtorch angle, and slowly move the aim notch by notch to count out a number, that they have written down or memorized.
They have to do that every time anyway, or even if it's every first time it's an advantage that is amplified by auto-reaim.
But sure, if you want to make BnG worse, go ahead, because I for one will just absolutely destroy you all and make it a misery to compete at BnG by proving this very point if you are actually ignorant/silly enough to implement it again.
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By notching I meant counting your shots.
The re-aim rule means those who use visual aids have an advantage over those who don't (those who don't count their shots either). So removing the rule would be justified in that sense. I didn't suggest enabling the auto re-aim feature again.
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By notching I meant counting your shots.
The re-aim rule means those who use visual aids have an advantage over those who don't (those who don't count their shots either). So removing the rule would be justified in that sense. I didn't suggest enabling the auto re-aim feature again.
Ok for starters, what exactly do YOU mean by "visual aids" because that phrase can literally mean ANYTHING, including using PART OF THE GAME to aid you visually!
If you mean using either your own body, or a physical object to measure something on your screen, you can still do the same thing without doing that, by using things included in the standard game, it's the only reason I've ever done it in the first place.
I swear some of you really don't understand this game in relation to BnG properly.
I'm going to ask you, do you want a demonstration? Because I can go live and show you on Twitch if you want?
Edit - Don't you honestly think I'd have added auto-reaim myself if it was actually more useful? LOL!
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tbh, enabled or not enabled the better player is going to win. the current TUS scheme is fine and has been for a long time, this thread only proves the division such additions would add, even though i personally don't think it makes an iota of difference in the grand scheme, "if it's not broke don't fix it".
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what exactly do YOU mean by "visual aids" because that phrase can literally mean ANYTHING, including using PART OF THE GAME to aid you visually!
From the CWT rulebook:
1) No visual aids. Visual aids include rulers, straight edges, paper, transparency sheets, or other objects placed on or near your screen. They also include markings on or around your screen, glasses that help you aim in a straight line, programs that display visual overlays on the screen for aiming or measuring, etc. Placing your own unmarked hands on the screen is fine.
I mean all of that. Some players don't rely on any of those measures and are at disadvantage because of the reaim rule. If those external visual aids didn't give an advantage, no one would be using them.
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From the CWT rulebook:
1) No visual aids. Visual aids include rulers, straight edges, paper, transparency sheets, or other objects placed on or near your screen. They also include markings on or around your screen, glasses that help you aim in a straight line, programs that display visual overlays on the screen for aiming or measuring, etc. Placing your own unmarked hands on the screen is fine.
That's CWT though, as far as I know it only applies to Intermediate, if not only CWT/ONL.
Right now I can't remember if the TUS scheme is ONL and uses the exact same rules, if it does though that even allows using your thumb or hand on the screen, in fact I've been doing this in most games I've ever played, not just Worms Armageddon. It has other uses than just re-aiming in BnG lol.
Though it's not important for this anyway because even if there was a way to detect people doing this, you don't even NEED to do this to achieve the same thing, you can do it with the game itself.
I mean all of that. Some players don't rely on any of those measures and are at disadvantage because of the reaim rule. If those external visual aids didn't give an advantage, no one would be using them.
Think of it like this, which is something I explained in the thread, which I thought you already knew, or at least MonkeyIsland does which is why it was changed back.
Without auto-reaim, both players can re-aim however they please as long as they reset the angle 45 degrees from it's original position before shooting again.
Now, players who count out their shots usually never need to re-aim anyway as they will hit pretty much 1st time every time at least with full power shots and most others.
Players who play instinctually, they currently have a few comfortable ways of re-aiming back to the position they were at. Both with and without using their hands on the screen.
If you take away that, it changes absolutely nothing for the counters because they count their shot from the reset position that auto-reaim does anyway, so if anything, it saves them a second or so to move the cursor back to the start anyway.
Generally speaking, this makes it much easier for counters to play BnG and gives them an advantage against most players.
The ONLY way to stop people who count BnG shots is hopefully when Deadcode and CyberShadow update the game engine so that there's no such thing as a notch anymore, which will actually render people who rely on notching and counting useless.
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you don't even NEED to do this to achieve the same thing, you can do it with the game itself.
I'll repeat myself: if doing it with the game itself was equally good/easy, no one would place a ruler or their hand on the screen. I place my hand on the screen to measure kamikaze cos it's faster than using girders.
Think of it like this, which is something I explained in the thread, which I thought you already knew, or at least MonkeyIsland does which is why it was changed back.
I changed it back because both you and KRD were against it. MI was not involved.
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Auto-reaim + manual reaim of 90 degree!
That should take some time off these notchers and mess with their counting. So just leave the rules as they are but add auto reaim!? Or even better - add auto reaim and put a turn at 7 seconds.. I mean, wtf is with 15 anyway? You have anchored worm and 2 possible weapons to shoot from.. 15 seconds for that? Player that started playing yesterday wouldn't need more than 4 to do this.
Wouldn't changing this be fair for most of the people? Would surely make games more interesting if up against the guys that rely on counting, rather than feeling.
I'd just want to imagine someone placing their thumb and holding it for 20-30 seconds on the monitor just to repeat some full power shot they had lock on previous turn, haha!
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I'll repeat myself: if doing it with the game itself was equally good/easy, no one would place a ruler or their hand on the screen. I place my hand on the screen to measure kamikaze cos it's faster than using girders.
You're not paying attention to the specific words I'm using! It has nothing to do with re-aiming with or without using your hand being easier or faster or not.
It's that adding the auto-reaim makes it easier for counters to beat you because nobody can do it, and that's one of the very few counters(as in counter attack this time) you have against counters(people who count out their shots using math). The ability to quickly aim back and adjust your shot if you missed.
It's also good to be able to have a placeholder just incase you change your mind at the last second and want to go with the original shot, I also do it during 1st shot attempts as well.
I understand a few people think it's lame to re-aim with your hand or whatever, it's a much better choice to balance out the playing field than further widen the gap advantage that they already have.
Though, my point is, if you do put that auto-reaim on, I'll make sure you immediately notice how bad a decision it is by proving it, and showing other players how to take advantage of it as well.
Then Sensei can moan about rollers, 5s LG bouncebacks AND auto-reaim! :D
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Yeah, Senator.. You should pay attention when Komo speaks about what he thinks is the best.
And if we all decide 5-6 seconds per turn is enough for scheme like BnG.. I'm sure he'll prove us wrong, too! :)
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Yeah, Senator.. You should pay attention when Komo speaks about what he thinks is the best.
And if we all decide 5-6 seconds per turn is enough for scheme like BnG.. I'm sure he'll prove us wrong, too! :)
5-6 is enough for BnG lol, definitely not enough for most players who play instinctually though, or for most people to play comfortably the way BnG is known.
I wouldn't be against that though, would make it easier and less boring waiting for other players for me lmao.
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(https://c.tenor.com/9ma2VEUqJc0AAAAC/tenor.gif)
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@Komo
We are talking about different things. I'm talking about the rule and you about auto reaim.
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Or even better - add auto reaim and put a turn at 7 seconds.. I mean, wtf is with 15 anyway? You have anchored worm and 2 possible weapons to shoot from.. 15 seconds for that?
Not a BnG player, but I also find this idea interesting.
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Not a BnG player, but I also find this idea interesting.
3 sec hot seat, 7 sec turn sounds good. 5 or less would be too little to line up bank shots where you are bouncing off 1-3 pixel walls. I would be in favor. Auto reaim I am ambivalent about, if people want it then sure. It’s not going to change anything except making it harder for inexperienced players.
The perception is that auto reaim would level the playing field, but I think it would do anything but that.
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It’s not going to change anything except making it harder for inexperienced players.
As said - only change auto-reaim adds is for people that used thumb for locking their 4s nades aim. Now they'll need to hold their thumb on the screen during whole opponent's turn. Which is awesome and sad at the same time.
Yeah, 7s turn looks like a sweet spot! If more people agree, mods should really consider changing this in Season #30.
While we're at it, wouldn't kill us to brainstorm about other schemes and their problematics. So we update them all for #30 and make league as competitive as it can get.
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You guys are clueless lmao.
But whatever, whatever makes you happy lol.
You'll have to learn the hard way it seems 🤣
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https://www.tus-wa.com/forums/tus-discussion/anti-lock-in-bng-32911/
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This is legit hilarious 🤣
Can't wait to see you all f yourselves over with this one.
Like we didn't think about less turn time 15 years ago 🤣🤣🤣
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1v1 me comet dodging komo
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1v1 me comet dodging komo
Oh it's on now!
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3 sec hot seat, 7 sec turn sounds good. 5 or less would be too little to line up bank shots where you are bouncing off 1-3 pixel walls. I would be in favor. Auto reaim I am ambivalent about, if people want it then sure. It’s not going to change anything except making it harder for inexperienced players.
The perception is that auto reaim would level the playing field, but I think it would do anything but that.
If you use a 7-second scheme, don't you need auto reaim so that you don't waste your precious seconds on manual reaiming?
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If you use a 7-second scheme, don't you need auto reaim so that you don't waste your precious seconds on manual reaiming?
don’t care either way, reaim is a formality, my opinion is you shouldn’t even have to do the stupid reaim at all. Good players have easy ways of reaiming. If you are lazy there is fingernail, but I’ve long since used sprite reaim. Sprite changes after a certain amount of presses, you can find your reaim easily with this. No reaim would make the skill gap in bng less, but I’m happy to continue reaiming perfectly while everyone else can’t. It only makes the gap between me and someone else in tus bng larger. I’ll make a short video on it if anyone wants to see how easy it is.
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don’t care either way, reaim is a formality, my opinion is you shouldn’t even have to do the stupid reaim at all. Good players have easy ways of reaiming. If you are lazy there is fingernail, but I’ve long since used sprite reaim. Sprite changes after a certain amount of presses, you can find your reaim easily with this. No reaim would make the skill gap in bng less, but I’m happy to continue reaiming perfectly while everyone else can’t. It only makes the gap between me and someone else in tus bng larger. I’ll make a short video on it if anyone wants to see how easy it is.
Even if we didn't have to change angle anymore, I'd have to still do it out of routine.
It's also a routine I like, BnG has always been a relaxing scheme, it's chill.
Re-aiming isn't just about saving time or preventing repeating shots, I always seen it as a window to think about other stuff. Also while re-aiming you sometimes see other angles that might be useful.
So yeah, it's a routine for me that I think makes you a better player anyway.
I recommend doing it anyway.
It's sort of like, Chess vs Speed Chess.
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sprite reaim.
Omg notcher!
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I’ll make a short video on it if anyone wants to see how easy it is.
Do it. I'm curious
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I mean, I don't even need to use sprites but yeah. :P
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I'm not a BnG player. But I think I'm in favor of adding reaim feature and all other BnG rubberworm or TS features since always. I think reaim is not even the most polemical feature, for me is that Anti-lock power that the max power is harder to achieve, and the power starts regressing until reach zero and release the weapon on your own worm.
EDIT: and by the way, yes I am totally in favor for less turn time for BnG. 7 seconds is a great value, and also it is the name of a song that I love and the lyrics are in 3 different languages and basically talk about racism. In my interpretation of the lyrics, 7 seconds is the time that someone will wait to see if someone will look at your skin color and treat you good, with respect. If 7 seconds pass and no good treatment happens, then it's better to go away and don't talk to that person.
So yeah, basically 7 seconds in BnG is the time you have to give a respectful shot and apply 46 damage to the opponent.
i=Zc--PdMKgxKaJaGQ
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I'm not a BnG player. But I think I'm in favor of adding reaim feature and all other BnG rubberworm or TS features since always. I think reaim is not even the most polemical feature, for me is that Anti-lock power that the max power is harder to achieve, and the power starts regressing until reach zero and release the weapon on your own worm.
EDIT: and by the way, yes I am totally in favor for less turn time for BnG. 7 seconds is a great value, and also it is the name of a song that I love and the lyrics are in 3 different languages and basically talk about racism. In my interpretation of the lyrics, 7 seconds is the time that someone will wait to see if someone will look at your skin color and treat you good, with respect. If 7 seconds pass and no good treatment happens, then it's better to go away and don't talk to that person.
So yeah, basically 7 seconds in BnG is the time you have to give a respectful shot and apply 46 damage to the opponent.
i=Zc--PdMKgxKaJaGQ
totally forgot about anti-full power!
I retract everything I’ve said, autoreaim is stupid for sure, but not being able to shoot at full power is wayyyy more useful for not being able to repeat. Support 100%, forgot that existed. Should be implemented in bng league scheme.
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What James said.
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https://www.tus-wa.com/forums/tus-discussion/experimental-season-result-bng-25681/
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Yeah, we tried all that stuff, it didn't work then, it won't work now.
Well, obviously it WORKS, but it's definitely not preferrable by the majority of good BnG players.
You can't aim straight up, and if you miss full power and the bar goes back down, it just blows up when it reaches 0 again, that absolutely sucks!
What exactly are you trying to accomplish anyway? Every single idea you guys are mentioning HELPS counters and gives them an advantage lol.
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Sure but what if we don't work with "majority of good bng players" and work instead with actual league players, not forum mummies??
And what if we don't care if we are benefiting some super duper nerdy (which seems to be more likely an imaginary creation, no one mentions any relevant names, never) that will count their monitor pixels, and instead try to care about gameplay experience like not forcing us to make boring stuff like manual reaim when we have reaim feature?? I don't think it will prevent these imaginary players to cheat lol. Like bro, what you so scared of? I would say that This fear of an imaginary cheater raising from ashes because reaim is added is pure imagination, the idea is in the edge of some schizophrenia to be honest, lol. If this goes out of control just roll back.
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Yeah, we tried all that stuff, it didn't work then, it won't work now.
Well, obviously it WORKS, but it's definitely not preferrable by the majority of good BnG players.
You can't aim straight up, and if you miss full power and the bar goes back down, it just blows up when it reaches 0 again, that absolutely sucks!
What exactly are you trying to accomplish anyway? Every single idea you guys are mentioning HELPS counters and gives them an advantage lol.
I think the power mod thing is good, its used in later worms games as well, keeps from full power being an easy strategy
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It's nice to be nice. I need to remember this.
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Actually you know what...
Do it! I genuinely believe it will degrade the scheme as a player BUT.
I'm a streamer so can stream all of YOU guys live and it can help see what the general WA people think of it.
Regardless what I think I have to show I'm willing to help when it's against MY idea of what works best.
I'm sorry, I wish we were more on the same page here but I'll do my best to help even if I don't like it.