The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
Leagues => Leagues General => Topic started by: MonkeyIsland on April 16, 2016, 03:27 PM
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This topic has been popping up for a while. Let's see how the community thinks.
I will be reviewing who votes and their leagues statistics on TUS to evaluate their vote. So please do not spam votes, that won't have any effect on the result.
If there's a success, the reset will start at the beginning of season #51. The first 50 seasons stats will be kept and accessible.
You can change your vote in case you changed your mind.
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If "0-50 seasons Hall of Fame" will be, it should be mentioned i think. People might vote No thinking it will be just reset.
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Thank you, modified first post.
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So, that means "BOOM"?
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@Kradie what about now?
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I was wrong in this case.
Reset would be nice. Might get me interested to play.
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Ah man hope I can get a new house soon can't wait for this :)
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Save this topic guys we are about to witness a major change ;D ;D
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never
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i'll try to play some games
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Yes. I didn't play Classic much, and generally the leagues recently because preparing for university examination and stuff. But after reset if I find some time, I'll play for sure.
Also I would like to propose shutting other leagues for first 60 days aka for first season of classic and enable some of them if more than enough people wants so. MI, I played other leagues than classic, and if I tell you to shut them, you should understand that they really became inactive and there's no competition at those anymore. If really a lot people wants other leagues to be enabled again, you can enable them again anyway.
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League reset can be a good idea, but only if it comes with a number of updates like anti-noobashing and anti-avoiding stuff, otherwise we'd end up in exactly same situation. I hope MI won't forget that.
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I agree with WTF-8. Apart from reset statistics there should be deleted all silly leagues like TEL, HAL, free, TRL and whatever more there exists. In the past there were more schemes too, but no one thought to play these funny schemes competitive. There are cups and tourmanets. But league should be classic and respectable. Come but to past. Let's give it a try!
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Also I would like to propose shutting other leagues for first 60 days aka for first season of classic and enable some of them if more than enough people wants so. MI, I played other leagues than classic, and if I tell you to shut them, you should understand that they really became inactive and there's no competition at those anymore. If really a lot people wants other leagues to be enabled again, you can enable them again anyway.
Good idea :)
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League reset can be a good idea, but only if it comes with a number of updates like anti-noobashing and anti-avoiding stuff, otherwise we'd end up in exactly same situation. I hope MI won't forget that.
You do realize we are resetting the league for completely different reasons, right? Noobbashing and avoiding will be exactly the same.
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Actually I'm thinking about putting some lock on the noob-bashing. For example when you try to report, system first checks if your opponent has played or won any games at all. So if he is new to the league, system won't let you report. (or you can report only 5 games in the entire season vs new players)
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Nice, great idea, which criteria is going to use to recognize that, the amount of overall games played? How about the signup date on TUS?
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Actually I'm thinking about putting some lock on the noob-bashing. For example when you try to report, system first checks if your opponent has played or won any games at all. So if he is new to the league, system won't let you report. (or you can report only 5 games in the entire season vs new players)
just implement a point system similar to the one ONL uses and your problem would be solved without limiting the games of your players.
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Actually I'm thinking about putting some lock on the noob-bashing.
Awesome :)
For example when you try to report, system first checks if your opponent has played or won any games at all. So if he is new to the league, system won't let you report. (or you can report only 5 games in the entire season vs new players)
Only problem with that is if 2 new players register and want to play each other :/
Also, there are people who are still considered noobs even after being registered to TuS for many years...
An idea I had:
Players ranked 1-100 cannot play players who have been registered for less than 6 months.
Players ranked 101-200 can play newly registered players but have an alternative game per season limit(Instead of 15, perhaps 2 or 3).
Players ranked 201+ can play newly registered players as normal.
Seems like a good idea in theory to me but the chances of getting people to realize it are slim...
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Is it better to limit the number of games against new players or reward noob-bashing with less points? A game limit makes it harder for new players to get games under their belt. For a returning pro it would be hard to qualify for PO.
Could the base (standard) point be +20/-20 instead of +40/-40 when your opponent has played a scheme less than X number of games? For the new player the base points would still be +40/-40 so he could reach his actual rating level quickly.
Also, there are people who are still considered noobs even after being registered to TuS for many years...
That's irrelevant though if the system checks the number of played games as MI said. Or u mean some people are considered noobs even after playing dozens of games? In that case their overall rating is low and u don't get many points for bashing them..
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Actually I'm thinking about putting some lock on the noob-bashing. For example when you try to report, system first checks if your opponent has played or won any games at all. So if he is new to the league, system won't let you report. (or you can report only 5 games in the entire season vs new players)
So, throw an atom bomb (I mean reset) cancelled? :o
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Is it better to limit the number of games against new players or reward noob-bashing with less points?
Or maybe even both :D
A game limit makes it harder for new players to get games under their belt. For a returning pro it would be hard to qualify for PO.
Remember that returning pros who start with 1000 points actually get easier points to begin with.
So actually limiting their games in this way actually helps kill 2 birds with 1 rock. ;)
I totally understand the concern about them not having enough people to play though, so maybe you could allow returning players to request their restrictions to be lifted after reaching a certain amount of games/points.
That's irrelevant though if the system checks the number of played games as MI said. Or u mean some people are considered noobs even after playing dozens of games?
What I mean is, for example Asbest has invited numerous noobs to TuS and reported wins vs them, this proposal can fix that problem, but another smaller problem still remains there are players who have played worms for many years and still suck, which means with my proposal it would fix 2 problems at same time, you see what I mean now?
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So when leagues will be reseted?
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So when leagues will be reseted?
Look at the first post 8)
If there's a success, the reset will start at the beginning of season #51.
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Is it better to limit the number of games against new players or reward noob-bashing with less points?
Or maybe even both :D
A game limit makes it harder for new players to get games under their belt. For a returning pro it would be hard to qualify for PO.
Remember that returning pros who start with 1000 points actually get easier points to begin with.
So actually limiting their games in this way actually helps kill 2 birds with 1 rock. ;)
I totally understand the concern about them not having enough people to play though, so maybe you could allow returning players to request their restrictions to be lifted after reaching a certain amount of games/points.
That's irrelevant though if the system checks the number of played games as MI said. Or u mean some people are considered noobs even after playing dozens of games?
What I mean is, for example Asbest has invited numerous noobs to TuS and reported wins vs them, this proposal can fix that problem, but another smaller problem still remains there are players who have played worms for many years and still suck, which means with my proposal it would fix 2 problems at same time, you see what I mean now?
a solution which needs another fix because it creates new issues is worth nothing. add a dynamic point system and you can play as many games as you want. the current system works like 40/30/20/10/5 etc if you keep playing the same guy who is less skilled than you. if your system would adjust the points from the first games, in relation to the games being played later, the statline would look like : 5/5/5/5/5. this seems quite fair to me. (numbers simplified for easier understanding) you could also reset overall stats every x years to get a more accurate measurement of skill. this would shift the focus to competitive gameplay instead of encouraging the stockpile of overall points in order to boost egos of players. overall stats should only exist to take the skill difference between two players into account when playing in an open league system.
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if chelsea random barman want reset, well, i dont know then. they are absolute idiots then, or under some control
i play for money and ratings, i dont care about MOST OF YOU IDIOTS. if you want to play for fun - play funners. what a differents? dont ruin leageus, fags
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a solution which needs another fix because it creates new issues is worth nothing.
Hmm, what new issues are there?
add a dynamic point system and you can play as many games as you want. the current system works like 40/30/20/10/5 etc if you keep playing the same guy who is less skilled than you. if your system would adjust the points from the first games, in relation to the games being played later, the statline would look like : 5/5/5/5/5. this seems quite fair to me. (numbers simplified for easier understanding)
I don't understand what you are trying to say here, what exactly are you suggesting by adjusting the points from the first games in relation to the games being played later? In what way? Why? That's the part you lost me at lol.
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Reducing the points from newcomers would be good, but still wouldn't discourage noob-bashing completely.
How about putting a lock on it so you can report against new users but any points won from them will be 0, until that user plays 10 league games and plays against 3 different players (at which point all the points are then added).
Kaleu's idea of having newcomers post in a forum to get their account activated (like in ONL) would work too, at least that would stop the noobs from being able to play immediately (if someone like Asbest has convinved them to sign up just so he can bash them).
The best solution would obviously be just to ban Asbest, he is the only one abusing the system to this degree.
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The best solution would obviously be just to ban Asbest, he is the only one abusing the system to this degree.
Your ideas guys sound good but this is the one that makes more sense, he doesn't even need to get banned. If he was a man he would have asked to delete his games this season and started over again. But he is not. He is also asking why he cannot get unmuted... A guy that when he sees you in ag he starts with his insult routine, who spams the whole day, who fish noobs like this... He's also suffering form a NERD RAGE attack atm, you can open this link http://snoop.worms2d.info/ He is normally the one yelling in capital letters uhuahau.
let's keep the reset part and the noobbasher issue seprated.
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For me the best idea is a combination of sbaffo's matchmaking idea and Kaleu's idea.
Basically add a matchmaking button to TUS, this will save time from spamming #AG with "tus anyone?" as well. Right after there's 2 players in matchmaking, they wait extra 60-120 seconds. Let's say a 3rd player joined. Let's say A, B and C clicked mm button. Their overall pts are 1000 1337 6969. System matches 1000 with 1337, and 6969 waits. If noone joined but those two players, they'll match. And even with mm system if someone will abuse system, then Kaleu's rule:
In the deep I don't want any rule to be added exclusively because 1 guy abusing the system, I want his games deleted and future abusers banned, everyone that wants to play a game competitively must have some common sense, noone should go full retard abusing players like that because there is not a very specific rule, its a matter of common sense. WA/TUS is pretty dead, why we should create another rule that might discourage new players? Isn't it better to ban 1,2.. player and get it done than possibly discourage dozens of newbies?
Basically some rule like if a player seems to not follow common sportsmanship rules, they might be banned from leagues according to mod's discretion, or some shit like that.
So TLDR: sbaffo's idea will solve opponnent picking and DoN problem, and Kaleu's idea will solve abuser problems.
Also forgot who mentioned it first but a bot sending auto message to newly registered players about website would be nice too.
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reset it already
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let's keep the reset part and the noobbasher issue seprated.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's great that league will be reset, and I want to thank MI for listening to us and making this poll :)
I just hope the fresh league can be fair and fun and Asbest-free.
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Divisions would be good idea (first division for best players only, and last for worst and newcomers. PO played for promotion to better division etc.) but unfortunately league isn't active enough...
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A game limit makes it harder for new players to get games under their belt. For a returning pro it would be hard to qualify for PO.
I totally understand the concern about them not having enough people to play though, so maybe you could allow returning players to request their restrictions to be lifted after reaching a certain amount of games/points.
Could be actually automatic, like this way:
If a player has played 50 games or less overall, his seasonal game limit is 5 games per player. Once he has played 50 games overall, his game limit is normal 15 games per player. The new player would need to play at least 9 more opponents during his 1st season before he could play against the 1st noob-basher again. After 50 games it should be less rewarding to bash him more.
Combine that with lower base points for the first 10 games or so in each scheme and the noob-bashing days are gone 8)
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Why you are making it complicated?
A potential noob to be bashed, is someone with zero wins, ever. So if I find someone on AG and ask him to register only that I can report, that would fit our criteria.
If a player has played 50 games or less overall, his seasonal game limit is 5 games per player. Once he has played 50 games overall, his game limit is normal 15 games per player. The new player would need to play at least 9 more opponents during his 1st season before he could play against the 1st noob-basher again. After 50 games it should be less rewarding to bash him more.
That wouldn't solve asbest's problem atm. He could find new noobs and play 5 games each.
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Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems it's only Asbest who is abusing the noobbashing and taking it to the next level. Without him is there a problem?
That aside some rule in place would help any future problems
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@MI
Ah u meant 5 games in total in your first post, not 5 games against each newcomer.
It needs to be complicated to cover all situations xd
For example, someone may have played just BnG and even won one game but he is still total noob in other schemes.
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For example, someone may have played just BnG and even won one game but he is still total noob in other schemes.
sen i see what you did there, no need to troll me
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Ah u meant 5 games in total in your first post, not 5 games against each newcomer.
Yes 5 players with noobs in the entire season. 5 games overall.
We could expand the definition of noob though. If a "noob" is playing like 10 different people but losing all. Should the lock exclude him?
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For example, someone may have played just BnG and even won one game but he is still total noob in other schemes.
sen i see what you did there, no need to troll me
:D
I would just like to fix the problem that u can get too many free points (~40 per scheme) from noobs. For example some people got good points from those South Africans when they started playing tus (they played against each others so they won some games too). Imo the point difference is not big enough if I get +70 for beating dibz in WxW and someone gets +40 for beating a noob (who has 1000 points but is actually a 800 points player). That's why I suggested lower base points (+20/-20) for beating a guy with few games. The system shouldn't give or take full points until a player's skill level is known.
What if we have like 2 newcomers losing their all games? Will they run out of opponents if they don't play against each other? ;D It's rare that someone plays against several opponents and loses his all games, though. Maybe it can happen if we have like two iMacG5's :D
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https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/free-standings/Mole_Shopper/?s=overall
Just please :'( :'( don't touch this... It costed me more than 1 year... let me play these 10 games before you do any changes :'(
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Just please :'( :'( don't touch this... It costed me more than 1 year... let me play these 10 games before you do any changes :'(
Don't worry, reset won't happen until the end of Season 50 at least, so you still have at least 46 days to play 10 more games :)
Check here for information: https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/seasons-info/
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Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems it's only Asbest who is abusing the noobbashing and taking it to the next level. Without him is there a problem?
Yeah this.
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What if you just make a rule "no noobbashing" to be judged at mods discretion. You break the rules and banned for the season and all winning games voided. There is hardly ever anyone that abuses the noobbashing so it should be easy to deal with this way.
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Nah imo we should try alternative rules to rise up the competivity, season 51 will be the dawn of the new glorious tus league era!
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Nah imo we should try alternative rules to rise up the competivity, season 51 will be the dawn of the new glorious tus league era!
That sound good. "A new tus era"
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Divisions would be good idea (first division for best players only, and last for worst and newcomers. PO played for promotion to better division etc.) but unfortunately league isn't active enough...
This would really be great if community had more active players.
Classes separated in divisions. Worst players of each division would be in "dropout" zones, switched with best players of lower divisions.. League would have better flow, players would be competing only vs guys with similar skills and those who improved should just be sent off to higher rank and vice versa..
But yeah, it's more utopia than good idea, atm :)
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worms bundesliga :o
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i like this idea aswell xD whit my newb skills i will be at lowest division whit newcomers
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good idea
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Divisions would be good idea (first division for best players only, and last for worst and newcomers. PO played for promotion to better division etc.) but unfortunately league isn't active enough...
This would really be great if community had more active players.
don't call ppl n00bz if they win by rollers, joke with people more, smile to a lost game... just stop being robots obssessed with stats, there is a huge difference between playing with pizza or street workout than playing with a person who can't wait for doing ' report ' click -,- everytime I happen to win a classic game everyone is so ' shocked ' ... so weirded out.... acting as if they were meant to win into a logic " zalo plays mole, I play classic, zalo is not meant to win here.... oh.. he wins... damn lucker he is, If only I was focused more, he would stand no chance... " and the story repeats... sometimes I feel a real discomfort playing with some self crowned " WA elders " because it really pushes people off if somebody talks about his experience 100% of time and calls ur every win a lucky one... not to look far - Hush. I felt like he was my biggest role model in terms of Bungee Races but damn... people are getting more and more posh and nerdy throughout the years. There are maybe 2-3 tus classic players I met with who I was able to talk about life a bit. For this reason I think I loved WA multiplayer above all my ps3 games, for the flexibity of a loose talk, which seems to slowly disappear in people.
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Zalo, you tend to get very pushy and arrogant sometimes. At least I've experienced that side of you. So, before judging whole community based on their social skills, start from yourself.
And yeah, I agree that big majority here cares more about pts than having fun. But, that's why there's terms: League/Funner.
don't call ppl n00bz if they win by rollers
If no one call them noob or lame, they'll never change.
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And yeah, I agree that big majority here cares more about pts than having fun. But, that's why there's terms: League/Funner.
This is directed at Zalo too I just couldn't be bothered quoting him.
Most people have fun with this game at heart, their friends, but they also take League seriously, and they don't like when they get screwed over by loopholes/faults in the system.
Everything on WA Online stems from Leagues, without Leagues WA would be dead online.
There are hundreds of extremely skilled League players and most of they enjoy other schemes also that usually don't get played in Leagues, who the hell do you think teaches all the newcomers?
Don't take it for granted, without us serious players, you'd have nothing ;)
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Zalo, you tend to get very pushy and arrogant sometimes. At least I've experienced that side of you. So, before judging whole community based on their social skills, start from yourself.
And yeah, I agree that big majority here cares more about pts than having fun. But, that's why there's terms: League/Funner.
don't call ppl n00bz if they win by rollers
If no one call them noob or lame, they'll never change.
You must be joking... After our Tus game you had complained for 40 minutes that I shouldn't had won that Bng on AG#... damn 40 minutes... dude... talking endlessly about my rollers that I Seriously wanted to not report that game... and I proposed not reporting it. You actually even started the game with the idea of making some points out of me because it was so ' obvious ' to you that you would win and later you cared only about proving me that it was not deserved the least bit.
as the game went into a report Sensei goes into forum and writes " I was bad in this game, but ye, congratz zalo, gj"
I am an asshole sometimes, I was an asshole to a Sniper in our bungee race cup because of a rule he introduced there but... I cannot understand people who call me a n00b if my nade didn't explode mid air above the target, and it seriously goes into keeping myself far from either players or schemes.
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43 days left till the reset, ew.
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''don't call ppl n00bz''
Contrary to the belief of many, a noob/n00b and a newbie/newb are not the same thing. Newbs are those who are new to some task* and are very beginner at it, possibly a little overconfident about it, but they are willing to learn and fix their errors to move out of that stage. n00bs, on the other hand, know little and have no will to learn any more
I my self enjoy playing whit newcomers, and they pation and will to lern i inspire them aswell . I am newb too at some point ,but i enjoy the game and like to improve my skills.
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I have to agree, "No moaning about rollers or lame shots" should be added to league bng rules.
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I have to agree, "No moaning about rollers or lame shots" should be added to league bng rules.
I disagree. It would only create more nitpicking and drama. If you play league, you play to win, and lame shot contributes to aggressive play. ''don't call ppl n00bz''
Contrary to the belief of many, a noob/n00b and a newbie/newb are not the same thing. Newbs are those who are new to some task* and are very beginner at it, possibly a little overconfident about it, but they are willing to learn and fix their errors to move out of that stage. n00bs, on the other hand, know little and have no will to learn any more
I my self enjoy playing whit newcomers, and they pation and will to lern i inspire them aswell . I am newb too at some point ,but i enjoy the game and like to improve my skills.
Heh yeah, got that right. Newbies = Basically new and willing to learn. Noobs = Lack many attributes: Language, communication, will and respect.
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I have to agree, "No moaning about rollers or lame shots" should be added to league bng rules.
I disagree. It would only create more nitpicking and drama. If you play league, you play to win, and lame shot contributes to aggressive play.
Such shots are not against the rules, if someone is calling their opponent a noob or making them feel like they don't deserve the win then that for me constitutes insulting/trolling behaviour.
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This isn't aimed at a specific person, it's aimed at anyone:
What a lot of utter nonsense.
A 4s grenade that bounces a few times is not a lame/cheap shot when used correctly, sometimes they are the only shot efficient enough to hit, if you have to miss 10+ shots to hit your opponent with 3s or 5s LG because their hide is super evil then you're a f**king moron, you may as well just quit playing cuz you're wasting your time.
There is a huge difference between someone throwing a few rollers to fit the situation because their opponent hides really evil, and someone like Chelsea who does it constantly even if their opponent is easy to hit with multiple other shots.
For example especially in 2v2 games sometimes usually after 10-15+ minutes 1 side has no hides left, so there is nowhere good to hide yet your opponents are sitting comfortable in super tight hides, it's the OBVIOUS shot to use a roller to try and draw them out.
Also, if someone has tried to shoot you with some nice shots several times but it keeps bouncing on 1/2 pixels above, it's ok to try and attack with a roller.
Kinda like, in real life, violence is horrible, it's lame, it's mostly primitive, you can't just go around stabbing people n stuff cuz people tend to frown about that, but if some guy walks up to you and threatens your life for no reason you can defend yourself by using violence, sometimes you have no other choice, it's not so lame then when you are fighting for your life.
And for those of you who say "violence is never the answer", well good luck to you when you are lying in a pool of your own blood dying, no one to save you, no police to bring justice, you are F**KED, because you weren't strong enough to do what it takes to survive, it's completely natural to fight for your survival, especially when faced with superior enemies.
Man, what the actual f**k am I talking about now how did I end up here? Fun times :)
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talking endlessly about my rollers
they see me rollin, they hatin (C)
n1
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Could someone concisely explain to me why one would WANT a reset? Bear in mind that I have nothing to do with TUS and haven't played a ranked match in years. I guess I just don't understand why anyone would want a reset unless something is currently broken... ?
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Could someone concisely explain to me why one would WANT a reset? Bear in mind that I have nothing to do with TUS and haven't played a ranked match in years. I guess I just don't understand why anyone would want a reset unless something is currently broken... ?
Afaik these are the main reasons
1) Many of the top ranked players are 'retired', which makes it difficult for the current players to reach the top ranks.
2) The ratings of the inactive/retired players are outdated. For example Random00 would have hard time keeping his rating where it is if he came back after such a long break. Perhaps some of the retired players don't want to make a comeback because their hard-earned overall rating would get screwed.
3) People want changes, no matter what ;D
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Also imo part of the game meta has change a lot (such as WxW maps and player's rr skillz)
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hmmm... why reset? (sorry I missed). How does overall scoring affects anything?
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they wanna kill random00 !
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hmmm... why reset? (sorry I missed). How does overall scoring affects anything?
Impossible to reach top on classic/scheme because less activity than before. I mean Zippo is still #1 in Roper for long time and he can't even rope anymore. That's why putting current overall on a hall of fame and make a fresh start is a good idea.
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this should have been done about 3 years ago... atleast...
good to see something might happen...
enough with the voting MI, show your balls to the community and make a decision
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this should have been done about 3 years ago... atleast...
good to see something might happen...
enough with the voting MI, show your balls to the community and make a decision
there's going to be the reset next season! :)
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avirex, before playing your tough card read the topic first maybe? The changes will take place at the start of season #51.
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avirex, before playing your tough card read the topic first maybe?
relaax homs, im sure he didint want to hurt ur feelings ;D this is just how some bitch ass gangstas make their jokes 8)
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Yo :)
I just knew that here something going interesting and i come to say that i rly don't care about overall stats, bad luck for old players who target to top line but u know it's just illusion of ur skill.
Be focused at current season! Current moment, current game! Peace! :)
Hope my vote will help you make best decision!
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Now that I've given this more thought, I agree that the leagues should have been reset ages ago. Not only that, but they should be reset periodically so the same sort of issue doesn't happen again.