The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
All About TUS => TUS Discussion => Topic started by: TheKomodo on October 10, 2018, 12:58 PM
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Don't talk, just vote!
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Make sure to view this zar tus games here
https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/game-223613/
https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/game-223600/
You can void the games if you like, but it is an example of how a tus game can look like with zar in it.
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It's not a great idea, roper is still the better competitive scheme by far, remove mines and I'd be more amenable to this change. ZaR just injects more luck into a scheme that has had no less than 5 10+ page threads dedicated to why rope is a luck scheme and what changes could be made to it. ZaR can also already be played and reported as a roper if both players agree, I played one a few weeks ago.
No to replacing it, its senseless, except to stroke Kradie's ego.
Stop your reign of terror before it is too late Kradie.
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It's not a great idea, roper is still the better competitive scheme by far, remove mines and I'd be more amenable to this change. ZaR just injects more luck into a scheme that has had no less than 5 10+ page threads dedicated to why rope is a luck scheme and what changes could be made to it. ZaR can also already be played and reported as a roper if both players agree, I played one a few weeks ago.
I would argue that that's not a bad thing. Yes there's slightly more of a luck factor to ZaR but the best player will still win more often. They just won't win every single game comfortably. It's more fun like this imo, the league will be more open and thus encourage more games.
That w2 roper ladder that started a couple of years ago had a certain burst of popularity, because it was more interesting than one-sided tus leagues. I think ZaR could do the same. It's better than seeing someone beat the same player 10 or 20 times in a row... ::)
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I said don't talk, JUST VOTE!
What part of that don't you understand?
Let the vote do the talking please!
@MonkeyIsland - Could you remove all the comments in this thread please? And make it possible only to vote, not possible to reply, thanks!
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Hey guys, Komo said NO TALK! No opinions, no arguments, no speeches until Komo gives his approval, ok?
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Haha, come on, these votes are really not legitimate. Spleen and kradie will get dozens of ppl to click on yes, and most of regular roper players will not even participate.
I made a poll for that Wild league that started as a drunk joke, after 2 days we've had 15+ YES votes, cause Godmax promoted it in #ag.
Just remove these polls, MI. If they ever did anything useful, they don't anymore.
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OP not even in ZaR smh
that scheme is too hard to be mastered properly, regular Roper is hard enough
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Haha, come on, these votes are really not legitimate. Spleen and kradie will get dozens of ppl to click on yes, and most of regular roper players will not even participate.
I made a poll for that Wild league that started as a drunk joke, after 2 days we've had 15+ YES votes, cause Godmax promoted it in #ag.
Just remove these polls, MI. If they ever did anything useful, they don't anymore.
It is true that I Kradie, will ask fans of ZaR and some of its members to give their vote. I do not go seek random people and have them give their vote to something they have no affiliation in. I believe that those that plays Worms and ZaR, and partake in the league, should have their voice heard. I don't think it is fair that bystanders cam vote and cast their voice in something they do not partake.You could say that they have experience, sure, but they don't recognize and see WA as it is from us regular participants of the game itself. So the poll itself, could be but not necessary be inaccurate due to bystanders.
A poll in this matter could be an indicator for many things and therefor should not be silenced.
OP not even in ZaR smh
that scheme is too hard to be mastered properly, regular Roper is hard enough
A person do not need to be a member of anything, perhaps Komodo is only interested in results. There is no harm in that.
Roper vs ZaR difficulty, this is entirely subjective. But I do agree, ZaR is more punishing to player mistakes.
Then again, Roper & ZaR is not the hardest rope based scheme in the league, is it? So I think your assessment there is somewhat wrong.
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For once, just shut up, and let the voting do the talking.
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(https://i.imgur.com/NLzBVXg.png)
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(https://i.imgur.com/NLzBVXg.png)
Burn
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WILD LEAGUE FTW. f@#! ZAR f@#! ROPER
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Nothing personal against Kradie & others- I like ZaR, but I voted no. Roper is more accessible to new players. Why would we pick an exclusive scheme when we only aim to have 3-4 schemes?
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Nothing personal against Kradie & others- I like ZaR, but I voted no. Roper is more accessible to new players. Why would we pick an exclusive scheme when we only aim to have 3-4 schemes?
There are no exclusive schemes here Joe. To my understanding, Komodo wants to know if people would like traditional Roper to be replaced with ZaR.
Roper is more accessible? Correct me if I am wrong, are you saying that newer player requires more experience to play ZaR? Then I would like to add that; Big RR is more accessible than TTRR, and that TTRR should be removed from the league. Why? Because whenever I host a TTRR, people often comment that the maps are too small, that they way to tight, and that they are used to play on bigger maps. Sure you could argue ''Play on bigger maps'', I would say... No. TTRR shouldn't necessarily look like Big RR maps. So in big RR, it is easier to play, to navigate, you're not under constant pressure of having the best time, because we all know the pressure in TTRR, especially against an experienced player. So no, TTRR is NOT accessible for beginners. So we should totally have separate league for beginners, mole, shopper and normal.
Thanks for voting though :)
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Jeez, you guys always suggest hard and old schemes that no one on Wormnet cares about. Please add new schemes and those old schemes that are still popular this day, just put schemes for guys who don't play league games and just play WA for fun. They might get interested.
And yet, you guys still talk about old rope and classic rules using same schemes (some of it been added and removed over time) revolving them over and over again, which very less of us cares. Don't make the league suitable for yourselves, make the league suitable for everyone, and probably there will be chance of increasing a little activity.
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are you saying that newer player requires more experience to play ZaR?
yes
also, this sums up this drama pretty well
[attachment=1]
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I actually dont care coz league is dead, but roper is roper, where is point to change it to zar? yes I like play zar sometimes coz it is funny, but orginal roper is more fair and need more skill, it should stay in league and never should be replaced.
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No one is saying that ZaR is more fair than roper. But it is more enjoyable for the weaker player, which encourages more games and a league that is not completely dominated by the top 3 or 4.
The better player will still win more often. But a series of games will be more likely to be 8-2 or 6-1 than 2-0 or 3-0 when it's a better player vs a weaker player.
Could at least be worth trying for a TRL season or something.
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Roper is Roper, no need ZaR or other bullshit.
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How about we have ourselves a ZaR TRL season?
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XanKriegor. that's a good idea, we could do that. it is not like ZaR will ruin it if it was replaced with roper. So why so persistent? There is nothing to lose. Some claims it is luck while I personally say no. Even if it is luck, it isn't a bad thing. That's what makes it fun & addicting. Besides, ZaR would play like Intermediate bo3, with 1 worm, and 2 worms in CaveZaR as final.
I've had impossible crates appearing in regular ropers, but in ZaR they wouldn't had been that hard due to destructible terrain. So in other words, destructible terrain would compensate for some of the ''supposedly'' hard crates.
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Not sure if this will ring with anyone, but here goes.
XanKriegor. that's a good idea, we could do that.
I have to point out, spleen17 said it 1st ;) :P
Some claims it is luck while I personally say no. Even if it is luck, it isn't a bad thing. That's what makes it fun & addicting.
There are actually quite a few people, one of which being HHC, who has previously said the luck factor is one of the reasons they enjoy schemes and we shouldn't remove luck entirely from schemes, to what degree he means that, i'm not sure though.
Honestly, it's over 19 years now, i've been playing Roper for almost 19 years! Can we please just change it to something new and fresh, ZaR is by far the best alternative to Roper, please do not fear change.
We could change Roper to ZaR, and anybody who still wishes to play the Classic Roper scheme, could still do so, and report it as ZaR, but having the newer, fresher scheme being advertised as the main scheme, could be important to drawing in new players, especially with how fast these games can be finished, i'd honestly like to see all the schemes replaced.
Aerial / Big RR / ZaR / Intermediate
Possibly add MoleShopper.
Those seem to be the most popular schemes right now, we've had so many years with the other schemes, it would be nice to see our community come together, support something new and fresh, at least try and make it work, if it doesn't after some time we can swap right back if you want...
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You guys are out of your mind if you think newcomers will rather play zar roper (1 weapon, no chute, less time, instant mines) than regular one that's been around for 20 yrs. I mean, new guys will never play either of these schemes, but thinking zar is newcomer friendly is just being delusional.
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You guys are out of your mind if you think newcomers will rather play zar roper (1 weapon, no chute, less time, instant mines) than regular one that's been around for 20 yrs. I mean, new guys will never play either of these schemes, but thinking zar is newcomer friendly is just being delusional.
Do you speak for newcomers? Do you know what everybody wants? I am 100% confident, you do not speak for every other human being that has played WA, and also, I strongly believe you are not psychic.
Let's take a look at the definition of "delusional":
"characterized by or holding idiosyncratic beliefs or impressions that are contradicted by reality or rational argument, typically as a symptom of mental disorder."
ZaR is no more difficult to learn than Roper, in fact you have less weapons to learn how to use, not that it's hard to learn anything in WA anyway, it's pretty straight forward really.
Every scheme simply takes practise, you hit spacebar to attach and release rope, you use arrows to move around, you use F keys to select weapons, you use enter to fire weapons on rope.
That is SO simple, that literally a child under 10 years old can do it, and actually there have been young children in the past who HAVE done it!
THAT is the reality, there is no rational arguement that contradicts it, so it is NOT delusional.
The simple fact is, you, and some others, conveniently enough strong all-rounders or people who have been around for a while and have built up a certain level of respect from the community, don't like ZaR, this community suffers from oldschool syndrome, we fear change, we spent many years loving a few schemes, and refuse to change.
When I ask people why they aren't interested in TUS, they usually just say it's boring, it isn't what they want, and the players are elitists and rude. This, is the reality.
Personally, I feel like ZaR has a certain level of fast paced fun that Roper doesn't offer, the games are quick, you get punished for roping carelessly so people will learn to rope more efficiently, fall damage is insane, avoiding mines at times takes a high level of precision, all in all I am starting to believe it's a better scheme, and you cannot say I do not have enough experience to say so because i've dominated Roper every time I wanted to(along with a few other players) and have a lot of experience with the ninja rope in general.
Prove me wrong if you can, but don't start insulting me for no reason because you don't like what I am saying, I have not insulted you, i've kept my post clean and used experience and a few facts, so I expect you to do the same please :)
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I have to point out, spleen17 said it 1st ;) :P
True.
Before i met ZaR, i thought Roper is difficult and boring scheme :D Destructable terrain is really helping to get to the crates that were hard to reach earlier in the game. Tommorow i am going to approach MI with the TRL idea, if he wont see it befote that.
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Xan, or Kradie, host some ZaR Roper tournaments please :)
I would, but not a MOD anymore.
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You guys are out of your mind if you think newcomers will rather play zar roper (1 weapon, no chute, less time, instant mines) than regular one that's been around for 20 yrs. I mean, new guys will never play either of these schemes, but thinking zar is newcomer friendly is just being delusional.
Sorry but you are wrong on this.
I understand people feeling attached to the scheme that has been around for a long time, but let
me ask you this - when was the last time you saw anyone host a Roper funner?
Lots more ZaR games are hosted every day, and I’ve played with plenty of casual players who, despite having some basic rope skill, have not played much roper but enjoy ZaR due to its fast pace and action, and the fact that they never feel completely out of the game even when up against a better player.
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But... but nope is already winning...
It's funny to see people who were never competitive players trying to push zar so hard. What's next? Godmax scheme?
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But... but nope is already winning...
It's funny to see people who were never competitive players trying to push zar so hard. What's next? Godmax scheme?
It's funny to see why these so called competitive players fears a more difficult scheme than what they are used to.
If there is nothing to be afraid of, then accept it and play it like a man. ZaR doesn't hold your hand.
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Wow so macho! Do you get hard when you play zar?
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Wow so macho! Do you get hard when you play zar?
Yep, me and 34 others. 8) And that's a rule. ;)
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It's funny to see people who were never competitive players trying to push zar so hard. What's next? Godmax scheme?
Nobody here is not competitive though.
XanKriegor, spleen17 and Kradie have all played Clanners, Xan & spleen have played other schemes such as Darts competitively in dS Tours etc, Kradie plays ZaR religiously and takes it seriously, aka, plays competitively, Mega`Adnan has took part in Darts Tournaments/dS Tours, Hysteria Cups/Tournaments, pretty much every Cup and Tournament there has been all schemes, I don't know about TheMadCharles, I don't know him very well, they just don't play TUS Singles often I think... I wonder why? Is it perhaps because they find the scheme selection on TUS Classic boring?
Compare the amount of people presently who enjoy TUS Classic schemes, maybe except Hysteria and Intermediate to the people who enjoy other schemes right now, I think TUS Classic schemes will lose. I don't mean on TUS forums, I mean every single person that plays Worms Armageddon online.
I honestly feel like we are losing out on a huge player base because of outdated schemes, and more importantly an outdated League system that Anubis suggested.
Make fun of me today, nobody cares about it by tomorrow, but make a change to Worms Armageddon/TUS NOW, and it could last for many years.
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Roper > W2 Roper > ZaR Roper
I wouldn't worry about the skill gap in Roper. In TTRR and WxW (hard map) it's much more apparent.
Who else besides Kradie and spleen17 hosts ZaR Ropers? The fact some newcomers join your hosts and enjoy ZaR doesn't mean they don't enjoy regular Roper...
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Wow so macho! Do you get hard when you play zar?
Wanna know something even more macho? Bungee race.
I can beat you in it very easily, no problemo! ;)
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@Senator - I've hosted ZaR in the past, at certain points in time i've been one of the most obsessive, successful and dedicated Ropers of all time.
I've also saw dibs hooked on ZaR for a while.
You know what's fascinating to me, in general, humans hate change, they love to remain in their comfort zone, they find a routine and they stick to it, anything outside of that, regardless if other people like it or not, makes them feel uncomfortable and/or angry and frustrated.
You are all addicted to the only schemes the league had to offer, outside of that, honestly what have you tried?
It's like old people saying new music sucks, it's like America telling China not to buy their weapons from Russia.
It's simple, PEOPLE ARE BORED of TUS Classic, why else don't they play anymore? Sure, people have families, jobs, commitments, but you know the simple truth about life? If something is interesting enough, or important enough, you will make time for it regardless of what else is happening in your life.
This League got boring, same people, same schemes, same challenges, same outcomes, same sh*t day after day after day...
You know what proves this? Money, people come out of the shadows they lurk in to compete whenever TUS League offers cash prizes, because JUST PLAYING the schemes for fun, isn't fun enough anymore! They have done it to death already, so the addition of money makes it exciting again! Let's face it, the time spent to win like $20, you could earn way more in a day with a real job, so all the money does, is introduce certain bragging rights, which adds the excitement.
You wanna know what I honestly think, people are ruining this League, because they refuse to change anything but also refuse to play, you argue against change even though you don't even play anyway, that's extremely stupid...
"OH, PLEASE DON'T CHANGE A LEAGUE I NEVER PLAY, I DON'T LIKE IT, AND BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE IT SURELY MEANS NOBODY ELSE DOES"
And you all accuse me of having a massive ego lmao, please, the amount of hypocrites on these forums is crazy.
The only difference is, I just say it outright, you guys do everything you can to hide it because you are afraid people won't like you.
Edit - I know the post is long enough but think about this please without judging me as a person, and focusing ONLY on the words said.
Why did we get into the schemes we did in the 1st place? For some of us, who specialize in certain schemes it's because we are simply the kind of person that finds something simple and fun enough you get good at it fast, and doing things that impress other people make us feel good or because it's so popular, and our cultures in general are defined by success and popularity, which drives people being competitive in the 1st place!
Right now, TUS Classic schemes are not popular, look at the amount of people playing Worms Armageddon schemes that aren't used in Classic League.
I don't think that people want to compete in things where they have to play catch up for many years to compete with people who have been doing something for so long that the only chance they have is to practise literally for years...
What Anubis said hit me like a ton of bricks, the matchmaking system in this game is extremely old and outdated, even with everything i've said, even if we did change the schemes, I still think we would have a better chance of bringing popularity back into Leagues if we were able to convince DC/CS and Team17 to give us some sort of online automated service for playing games and having a rank that way.
As a newcomer to Worms Armageddon, in this day and age where everything else is so easy, having to register and manually report games on a website with a complex and confusing layout, can't exactly be very motivating can it?
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Вы ебанулись совсем?
Maybe Change Shopper to Walk for weapons?
WXW for WXW 25 sec with health cr8s ?
TTRR with not max power of rope (it was practic 500years ago)
BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA
BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA
I like ZaR, it's f@#!ing funny to play when 0 host at AG and nobody wants play TTRR with me or something instead mole shopper, but im not FAN of this shit, and also last time i see stucks with 6 ppl in, and no1 motivated to do nice turns, just noob moves, after 5 min of the game map is destroying in MEAT and stupid shortcuts evrywhere, i need 10 sec for catch any place...
Why zook? try shot timing nade from middle of map in roper, lad mine from roof on the head
Go to hell all, Tnx MI for opening this GOLD season with my lovely classic schemes (which fixed while i was inactive and i even dont care(t17 water rise 100 metrs in sec wtf))
Tnx For this thread, i can bla blablabla too it's so cool :DDD
And I leave ZaR community coz it become FAP FAP FAP FZAR
But I VOTE yes for trl zar, why the f@#! not
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TRL always has been, and always will be better than TUS Classic in the sense that at least you play people dedicated to whatever scheme it is there :)
(Like, I mean people can't avoid certain schemes in TRL cuz it's only 1 lol.)
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Вы ебанулись совсем?
Maybe Change Shopper to Walk for weapons?
WXW for WXW 25 sec with health cr8s ?
TTRR with not max power of rope (it was practic 500years ago)
BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA
BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA BLA
I like ZaR, it's f@#!ing funny to play when 0 host at AG and nobody wants play TTRR with me or something instead mole shopper, but im not FAN of this shit, and also last time i see stucks with 6 ppl in, and no1 motivated to do nice turns, just noob moves, after 5 min of the game map is destroying in MEAT and stupid shortcuts evrywhere, i need 10 sec for catch any place...
Why zook? try shot timing nade from middle of map in roper, lad mine from roof on the head
Go to hell all, Tnx MI for opening this GOLD season with my lovely classic schemes (which fixed while i was inactive and i even dont care(t17 water rise 100 metrs in sec wtf))
Tnx For this thread, i can bla blablabla too it's so cool :DDD
And I leave ZaR community coz it become FAP FAP FAP FZAR
But I VOTE yes for trl zar, why the f@#! not
Brutally honest and no offense taken. There is actually a scheme called fap zar too XD
Anyhow, I do respect your honesty and I am not angry about it. In fact, there are a couple of members in ZaR that are against the idea of having ZaR in the main league. That's something I appreciate, an open dialog. I'm not going to strong arm anyone to vote for something that I believe.
Komodo, there was a while back ago that you were somewhat against ZaR? Has something changed? Or perhaps nothing changed and I misinterpreted.
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hi, oldschool worms2 player (1999-2004) here. I'm amazed and think it's cool this game still gets played. I watched a few rope match files and the rule sets used now are lame as hell.
A few things
-2 worms is ESSENTIAL there's a lot of strategy you remove from the game without it
-12 second turns. 15 is an eternity. You need high pressure (low timer) and high punishment (high fall damage) to create tension
-The map cannot be indestructible. I watched matches where they take turns hiding in the same spot 10+ times.
-5 seconds retreat time. The extra long retreat time ensures you can get into the perfect hiding spot every single turn without risk. And because the maps are indestructible it is always there.
-Get rid of the rules. CBA and no crate blowing was talked about ever since I joined. But these rules were banned for a long period. It is another strategy to leave them. If you're worried people skip them, then make them more valuable (30H) easy
Also bummed the Jake Game rule set looks dead.
Other than that, have fun, one day I'll come whoop your asses
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hi, oldschool worms2 player (1999-2004) here. I'm amazed and think it's cool this game still gets played. I watched a few rope match files and the rule sets used now are lame as hell.
A few things
-2 worms is ESSENTIAL there's a lot of strategy you remove from the game without it
-12 second turns. 15 is an eternity. You need high pressure (low timer) and high punishment (high fall damage) to create tension
-The map cannot be indestructible. I watched matches where they take turns hiding in the same spot 10+ times.
-5 seconds retreat time. The extra long retreat time ensures you can get into the perfect hiding spot every single turn without risk. And because the maps are indestructible it is always there.
-Get rid of the rules. CBA and no crate blowing was talked about ever since I joined. But these rules were banned for a long period. It is another strategy to leave them. If you're worried people skip them, then make them more valuable (30H) easy
Also bummed the Jake Game rule set looks dead.
Other than that, have fun, one day I'll come whoop your asses
This is my favorite roper scheme.
Not so long time ago a bunch of ex-w2 players from Brazil created a scheme exactly like this to reproduce w2 roper, even the gravity is lighter (RubberWorm needed) and the rules are the same, they had 2 schemes version to be played with 1 or 2 worms. They runned a w2 league for some months, pretty active but no longer alive. I have the schemes and play from time to time.
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hi, oldschool worms2 player (1999-2004) here. I'm amazed and think it's cool this game still gets played. I watched a few rope match files and the rule sets used now are lame as hell.
A few things
-2 worms is ESSENTIAL there's a lot of strategy you remove from the game without it
-12 second turns. 15 is an eternity. You need high pressure (low timer) and high punishment (high fall damage) to create tension
-The map cannot be indestructible. I watched matches where they take turns hiding in the same spot 10+ times.
-5 seconds retreat time. The extra long retreat time ensures you can get into the perfect hiding spot every single turn without risk. And because the maps are indestructible it is always there.
-Get rid of the rules. CBA and no crate blowing was talked about ever since I joined. But these rules were banned for a long period. It is another strategy to leave them. If you're worried people skip them, then make them more valuable (30H) easy
Also bummed the Jake Game rule set looks dead.
Other than that, have fun, one day I'll come whoop your asses
This is my favorite roper scheme.
Not so long time ago a bunch of ex-w2 players from Brazil created a scheme exactly like this to reproduce w2 roper, even the gravity is lighter (RubberWorm needed) and the rules are the same, they had 2 schemes version to be played with 1 or 2 worms. They runned a w2 league for some months, pretty active but no longer alive. I have the schemes and play from time to time.
The rules aren't the same. You must get health before attacking from rope, you can attack a mine from rope, so the instant mine can hit a player without you having to do crate before attack. Wall to wall (w2w) replaces crate before attack when sudden death is on. Zar only has zook and rope, so you must use that to your ability.
I played a couple of games with these Brazilians casually and competitive, including the administrator of the league. After my recollection, he fairly enjoyed Zar and there were no disrespect between the scheme versions.
Some says that I literally stole worms 2 roper from these Brazilians or from the past and made it my own. Then I ask the question, who is responsible for the roper? Big RR? It's basically the same! There's many versions out there, and Zar just happens to be the main roper version for casual play play at this day and age.
Well erectionman4000, I look forward to it.
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erectionman4000, seems legit LOL
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erectionman4000, seems legit LOL
Well I did not summon this entity. It must be a secret admirer of zar or me or both, tbh I dunno.
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erectionman4000, seems legit LOL
I was a bonerboy but time stops for nobody