Mole Cup 2018

Quote from: Run on April 07, 2021, 08:46 AM
I'm struggling to get in touch with Kinslayer to play our games 

It seems that he is the only one of the 32 players who has not played a single game

Kinslayer replaced, ko pairs fixed.

MAI and BLANK will play aditional match (B0 1). I should do this from the begging,when all 3 player have the same amount of points. But it is too late now. So at leats Blank and Mai will settle this between themselves.

Sorry again.

Quote from: MycyxPatroN on April 09, 2021, 06:29 PM
Kinslayer replaced, ko pairs fixed.

MAI and BLANK will play aditional match (B0 1). I should do this from the begging,when all 3 player have the same amount of points. But it is too late now. So at leats Blank and Mai will settle this between themselves.

Sorry again.

These 2 gentlemen have plenty of free time and they are almost in the same timezone. Maybe let them fight Bo7?

Nobody knew if you would untie players with tie breaks and play-offs or only with play-offs, but considering you advanced group 3, I assumed you would include tie breaks. When players have the same number of matches won, they can untie by direct confrontation and rounds won. That group doesn't need play-offs since they don't actually have the same amount of points. Mai beat BlankASD 2-1, BlankASD beat Liav 2-1 and Liav beat Mai 2-0 (if you pay attention to the replays date, the round in which Mai supposedly beat Liav doesn't count as he beat him only after Liav had already beat him 2-0), so because Mai have one round won less than the other two, he is in 3rd place. That leaves only BlankASD and Liav to untie in direct confrontation, where BlankASD has the advantage, thus granting him the 1st place and Liav being in 2nd.

If you were to consider only the matches won, the three should do play-offs, but since Liav was already advanced, doing play-offs only between the other two would be unfair for Liav as he had no equal chance as them of achieving 1st place in the play-offs. So considering you already advanced Liav in his appropriate position following the tie breaks, I'd say the best and fairest thing to do would be to simply follow the tie breaks for the other players too and advance BlankASD with no play-offs. And you'd apply the same tie breaks for the other groups so that all competitors play by the same rules.

Mycy, don't listen to him

QuoteThat leaves only BlankASD and Liav to untie in direct confrontation

I'd say the best and fairest thing to do would be to simply follow the tie breaks for the other players too and advance BlankASD with no play-offs

So you are basically allowing victories to be "weaker or stronger" among players who met only once. That is a total opposite of what group match should be. You will never see that in any football cup. How about we start counting how many worms Mai had left with his victories, how many Health Points by % he kept? How about we start counting losses, not just wins, and then it would turn out that Homunculus could give one extra loss to Liav, but he spared him of it by quitting, and then what? That is so so flawed bro. I wouldn't want to be in Mai's shoes, to see that Liav gets advanced instead of me, and he hasn't even earned a single clean 2:0. Cup is for people to explain things to each other via confrontation, often additional, not by avoidance and some micro statistics that would decide.

Mycy is 100% right that fundamentally they have 2/3 wins and all 3 should repeat. Since Liav is not exactly in the cup now, them 2 fighting for this one bracket with the gentleman Danie, seems to be the only sensible thing to do. I just suggest Bo3/Bo5 so that we have a strong confrontation. If Mycy decides to do so, I can even let all 3 repeat their group games and I will agree to have my bracket win removed.

btw. give Vitos and Pawel #1 positions. They cannot have any other one.

First of all, the way the score is counted is done by TUS's own system, but since it's a machine, it can't be used by itself; it needs a host behind it to manually advance the players since odd results like these might appear. TUS's algorithms do include the tie breaks I mentioned and they must be there for a reason. Mycy just never stated in the cup description what his rules are for ties in the group stage.

QuoteSo you are basically allowing victories to be "weaker or stronger" that is a total opposite of what group match should be.

Being able to beat your opponent 1 round even in a lost match still means merit, therefore it CAN be used as extra points for tie breaks (as long as it's not Bo1, but groups here are Bo3), because it means you were not as easily beaten. Losing 2-1 is better than losing 2-0.

QuoteYou will never see that in any football cup. How about we start counting how many worms Mai had left with his victories, how many Health Points by % he kept? How about we start counting losses, not just wins, and then it would turn out Diogofelt would could give one extra loss to Liav, that he spared him of, and then what? That is so so flawed bro.

You are saying a bunch of things I didn't say there. Don't mix things that happen inside the game with game results. And TUS's tie breaks don't count losses as you could see.

QuoteHow about we start counting losses, not just wins, and then it would turn out Diogofelt would could give one extra loss to Liav, that he spared him of, and then what?

That part's a bit illegible. But they aren't even in the same group anyway. You're again mixing things here.

QuoteI wouldn't want to be in Mai's shoes. Cup is for people to explain things to each other via confrontation, often additional, not by avoidance and some micro statistics that would decide.

Nothing wrong with different forms of justice, but I think they should be equal among all participants.

QuoteMycy is 100% right that fundamentally they have 2/3 wins and all 3 should repeat. Since liav is not exactly in the cup now, them 2 fighting seems to be the only sensible thing to do.

Sure the host could do that, but it wouldn't be 100% fair for Liav for the reason I explained in my previous post.

QuoteIf Mycy decides to do so, I can even let all 3 repeat their group games and I will agree to have my bracket win removed.

I also agree with this way of resolving ties. Like I said, it's another valid form of justice. If you don't mind losing your progress in the cup to allow the 3 to compete among each other fairly, this is a reasonable option too.

QuoteFirst of all, the way the score is counted is done by TUS's own system

By that system anyone with 2:0, 2:0, 2:0 victories get "3/6", the same number that people get after having 2:1, 2:1, 2:1 or 2:0, 2:0, 2:1. You are basically just proving my point by refering to the TUS system. TUS doesn't care if you lost the round when winning, you are on equal position as somebody who won 2:0. Spare everybody's time and do your research next time.

Quote from: ZorroX on April 13, 2021, 06:43 AM

QuoteFirst of all, the way the score is counted is done by TUS's own system

By that system anyone with 2:0, 2:0, 2:0 victories get "3/6", the same number that people get after having 2:1, 2:1, 2:1 or 2:0, 2:0, 2:1. You are basically just proving my point by refering to the TUS system. TUS doesn't care if you lost the round when winning, you are on equal position as somebody who won 2:0. Spare everybody's time and do your research next time.

In that case obviously not since the matches won number wouldn't be the same among players. Then you wouldn't need to use the extra rounds to untie. Number of rounds won is just a tie break system used in case players had the same amount of matches won. And if TUS didn't care about extra round wins, their number wouldn't be showing in the Won column. BlankASD and Liav are actually 2/5 there, whereas Mai is actually 2/4. If TUS didn't care about the rounds, it'd just show 2 for each of the three.

I don't care what Mycy will decide. I'm just clearing things up here; both ways are acceptable as it all depends on what rules the cup is being played on.

I get your point. The thing is that Mycy got 32 people to manage. If one makes 2 mistakes about reporting 1:0 instead of 2:0 and then another of reporting 2:1 instead of 2:0, and Mycy gets no message whatsoever for days, then Mycy got no choice but to follow plain "wins/losses" rule, especially since Liav was granted walkover to begin with. Even if we are to follow your way of counting rounds, Liav made a mistake of letting Mai play and acknowledging his 3rd won round, after Liav already got 2 won ones. At this point, it's just too messy to eliminate Mai like that since by the end of the day he did win 1 round out of 3. If he really is a player not deserving to go through, he will lose to Blank.

Disconsidering Mai's won round over Liav is no different than what Mycy did about Pisyavki's 3rd win over tlocoselli. There is no third game to consider after a 2-0. We did try to warn Mycy about Liav's mistake; even Liav himself told me he sent Mycy a message about it.

Quote from: Magnus on April 13, 2021, 04:20 PM
Disconsidering Mai's won round over Liav is no different than what Mycy did about Pisyavki's 3rd win over tlocoselli. There is no third game to consider after a 2-0. We did try to warn Mycy about Liav's mistake; even Liav himself told me he sent Mycy a message about it.

Alright, I am convinced, but Mycy said he got no message from Liav. I really don't mind any scenario. If Mycy wants, he can cancel my win and I can play my bracket stage with somebody else, I'm bored after all.

Quote from: ZorroX on April 12, 2021, 10:15 PM
Mycy, don't listen to him

Mycy, why did you delete my victory with Ty3? this game took place very first 
PS and it looks very strange 2-0 Requin vs Sibasa (I replayed the game with Sibasa at his request, total result 4 -0), 2-1 Ty3 vs Requin,  2-0 Ty3 vs Sibasa very strang
_

QuoteI replayed the game with Sibasa at his request, total result 4 -0

Liav! lets have some more rounds as well, I wanna play bo7 too 

EDIT: just talked to Liav, he agrees to continue our bracket match up to Bo9. Can we play like this Mycy? please please please agreeeee : D

Quote from: ZorroX on April 14, 2021, 04:13 PM

QuoteI replayed the game with Sibasa at his request, total result 4 -0

Liav! lets have some more rounds as well, I wanna play bo7 too 

Honest and confident players have nothing to fear fear for only cowards and chiters