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Leagues => Leagues Playoffs => Topic started by: Senator on September 14, 2021, 08:16 PM

Title: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Senator on September 14, 2021, 08:16 PM
https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/free-playoffs/?s=34



Semifinals

Lupastic (1) vs Hurz (4) 1:3
ZorroX (2) vs danie (3) 3:2

Final

Hurz (4) vs ZorroX (2) 2:3



Deadline for the final: Sunday 10th October 2021



PO series are best of 5.

Use this thread to schedule a date and a time for your match. You can ask for more time if needed.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on September 14, 2021, 08:24 PM
Hurzie, since you are always a late night owl player I guess we will clash some time very late..  8) :D
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: SIBASA on September 14, 2021, 08:46 PM
Cool, there has been no TFL playoff since the beginning of 2017. Hopefully the next seasons will be even better.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on September 14, 2021, 09:50 PM
Initially with uncle danie we wanted to play all 5 games as 5x mole, but then we realised maybe something more different would be nice too
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on September 14, 2021, 10:57 PM
Would be great to stream these Playoffs!

Though I believe a few of these players are a bit shy about streaming.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on September 14, 2021, 11:38 PM
Would be great to stream these Playoffs!

Though I believe a few of these players are a bit shy about streaming.

I am more than shy when I listen to your sweet thick scot dialect Komytow!
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on September 15, 2021, 02:00 AM
Would be great to stream these Playoffs!

Though I believe a few of these players are a bit shy about streaming.

Feel free to stream and do commentary of my POs with danie (Thursday, 5:35pm GMT is our plan). If you do so, I will happily replace my actual picks with some nice 120-min Bungee Race and 90-min Golf, since danie likes Golf!
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on September 15, 2021, 02:16 AM
Would be great to stream these Playoffs!

Though I believe a few of these players are a bit shy about streaming.

Feel free to stream and do commentary of my POs with danie (Thursday, 5:35pm GMT is our plan). If you do so, I will happily replace my actual picks with some nice 120-min Bungee Race and 90-min Golf, since danie likes Golf!

Thursday @ 5:35pm GMT - I'll put it in the schedule for everyone to see on the channel!

Don't worry about picks! Play whatever you want, of course you can't pick the same scheme more than once though. I'm quite happy to stream Mole Shopper or whatever though.

Good luck!
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on September 15, 2021, 10:05 AM
I finish work around this time (remote one), so I might be a couple of minutes late but nothing drastic.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on September 16, 2021, 11:17 AM
5:35 pm GMT today if all goes well and I finish my work on time. Schemes are going to be:

1. Parachute race (my pick)
2. Kaos (danie's)
3. Boom Race (mine)
4. Golf (danie's)
5. Mole Bo3 (kinda mine, but also danie's)
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on September 16, 2021, 01:25 PM
Nice selection, I'll be there.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Hurz on September 17, 2021, 11:14 PM
We Play saturday night
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on September 18, 2021, 12:43 AM
We Play saturday night

What time?
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on September 18, 2021, 08:39 AM
Message me on Snooper Hurz, 1-2 hours beforehand if you can ^^ thanks
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Hurz on September 19, 2021, 03:03 PM
Eh cant Play tonight either, im sick.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on September 19, 2021, 03:14 PM
Eh cant Play tonight either, im sick.

Ok np, we still have more than a week until deadline (:
msg me when ur ready & get well soon
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Senator on September 25, 2021, 09:28 AM
Final

Hurz (4) vs ZorroX (2)

Deadline for the final: Sunday 10th October 2021
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on October 04, 2021, 01:18 AM
Thank you all for these PlayOffs. Thank you in particular, Senator, for managing it  :-[ I really enjoyed all of the games and I'm happy that I got this unique opportunity of being here. I am sure I won't be so lucky next time.

I was just wondering hmm... There are 20 schemes in Free League. Maybe for everybody to enjoy thoroughly all 5 picks we could create a small game. The names of 20 schemes would be copied and pasted into some WA.exe map. The one who is higher in the standings would "cross out" the scheme that he would not want to play (only 1 pick at a time). Then the person lower in the standings "crosses out" his pick next, etc until out of 20 picks only 5 are left, these 5 that are enjoyable for both rivals. Since 15 picks need to be removed, the player higher in the standings crosses out 8 picks, while the one lower only 7. I think that's a fair advantage.

The schemes won't be selected spontaneously. They would all be known beforehand and their selection would be documented via replay file where the rivals just "sit" against each other, and the schemes' names are all hanging high in the sky. The Air-Strike (x8) would be used to "cross out" the schemes' names one after another. Whatever 5 schemes stay, they are final. There would be no coming back. How to determine in what order these 5 schemes are gonna be played? The one who is higher in the standings would select the scheme that would start off the PlayOffs, the one who is lower select 2nd scheme, etc (via chatbox inside of the replay).

The way it is right now (3x picks vs 2x picks), makes a really large advantage.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Senator on October 04, 2021, 04:23 PM
Final

Hurz (4) vs ZorroX (2) 2:3

Congrats, ZorroX!
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Senator on October 04, 2021, 04:59 PM
Scheme veto is an interesting idea but the problem is that some schemes are more luck based than others. Some schemes such as TTRR would always get banned by the underdog because they are 100% skill.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2021, 06:09 PM
An idea i've been discussing with a few folks who seem to agree, even ZorroX thought it was a good idea.

If the score comes to 2:2, make the last pick mutual, or, make the first pick mutual and the winner gets to pick the 2nd scheme, and then they rotate turns until it's won.

TFL should perhaps be Bo7 or more since the variety of schemes is so much more vast.

As Gabriel said recently, all you need is to master 3 schemes and you could destroy TFL. For example by picking Darts, Forts, Golf alone, since i've never played TFL much and the activity is low i'm very confident i'd have at least a 50% win ratio and enough games played to reach the Playoffs, if I was active enough the other 5+ schemes i'm pretty good at and if I manipulated my picks well enough I could probably achieve 1st place in a Season, then just pick those 3 schemes which reflect my BnG skills and the fact the only other person who really plays Darts well being Hurz.

There are several players around who could achieve the same thing with relative ease. The point is, whoever gets 1st pick is highly likely to win

When I was watching ZorroX Vs Hurz in the final and the score was 2:2 knowing ZorroX was picking Mole Shopper, I left as watching ZorroX slaughter someone who doesn't even enjoy the scheme isn't very enjoyable as the ultimate climate of a Season.

Absolutely not having a go at ZorroX for picking Mole Shopper, though can you see the point about it being an absolute letdown as a fan of spectating competitive Leagues and enjoying the big events? It was like listening to a dance song with a long buildup and disappointing drop:



I thought it was fun watching ZorroX Vs danie in Mole Shopper because at least they both enjoy it and it could go either way.

TFL is awesome, fixing Playoffs to be more balanced would be a great move instead of being pretty much whoever is highest ranked in the Season and has mastered 3 schemes.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: SIBASA on October 04, 2021, 06:36 PM
In the Allround League, 5 out of 11 schemes are played and 6 schemes remain unplayed. Then 9 games out of 19 should be played in TFL and 10 unplayed schemes remain.

In short, I'm for bo9 for the TFL playoffs.  It may seem like a long time, but it is fair.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on October 04, 2021, 07:16 PM
*Nevermind*
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: TheKaren on October 04, 2021, 07:48 PM
Absolutely not having a go at ZorroX for picking Mole Shopper, though can you see the point about it being an absolute letdown

and somehow Hurz starting off with Kaos (that he has been playing for literally the eternity) wasn't a letdown? I have never won a single Kaos match and I dreaded to see it picked (+ of course bo5) but I had respect for Hurz's passion for this scheme. Mole wouldn't even happen, if Hurz won Battle Race (he had a vast lead there) or simply Forts. I chose Mole Shopper as the very last one because I was afraid you would be whining about it, and yet you are still whining about it. Whining that I picked the only scheme that I feel comfortable in, as the very last... As always Komito, double standards. You are biased as hell.

You are absolutely correct ZorroX, I am talking about in general that watching a Grand-Final where each game is pretty much a one sided slaughter is not very fun. It is not double standards when I comment only on the games that were watched, I just didn't watch those first matches so couldn't comment on them. I apologize for not being specific enough.

You picking Mole Shopper is not the letdown, it's watching one-sided slaughter matches that is a letdown, when it supposed to be an epic finale of the season! Do you understand? I said it was nice to watch you Vs danie because it was equal.

The Darts game was a slaughter too, and wouldn't have watched that either except Hurz asked me to host it for you guys.

Also, please note that i'm not complaining you picked Mole Shopper, I enjoy watching this scheme when 2 great players are facing off.

Edit - Also, and this is very important, spectators are far less important than the players, you shouldn't care about who is watching, you play whatever you feel comfortable with!  :)

Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Gabriel on October 04, 2021, 09:48 PM
I played some free league seasons myself (years ago hehe), and I agree completely with ZorroX,, free league is unbalanced, mostly because:

- There are TOO MANY schemes in it (man, what the hell is elemental?)
- Some of those schemes were added because of a burst of activity, then those players were never to be seen again.
- People can master 3 schemes and win a league season (especially if there are not a lot of players).
- With this, a person almost automatically wins if they get to pick first.

There is almost 100% chance any person is a rookie in at least 3 of the free league schemes; and if you want to improve at a certain scheme, you have to find someone that plays the scheme too, which is a hard task by itself lmao.

Scheme elimination sounds fine to me.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Albus on October 04, 2021, 11:39 PM
Congratulations on your victory, ZorroX! ;D

PS: about this little frustration in the picks I did not understand. Hurz chose a scheme that he is pro (kaos) and ZorroX chose a scheme that he is pro (mole), right!? So everything is fine.
But I understand the frustration of those who don't want to see a massacre but a more disputed match. I don't like that aspect of the PO very much. Maybe players could agree not to choose schemes where the skill gap is huge. But Hurz picked a scheme in which he is pro so ZorroX did the same in his pick.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Hurz on October 07, 2021, 11:51 PM
thing is it all went kinda crazy here. zalo said to me b4 we played pos that he would pick mole for sure. so, after i lost the battlerace i picked kaos, not knowing his kaos skills, but, since kaos is a scheme with quite much luck involved - ofc im pretty experienced in scheme, still, crates and placements mean a lot there - and knowing hes a skilled player i thought it would be SORT of fair, having in mind to lose a round for sure in mole.
as he pointed out, if i did better in forts (what i felt, was a killer pick vs me aswell, nvm that tho, pick is pick) or battlerace, where i just messed up a stuck part in a wierd way haha, it wouldnt have come to mole that far anyway. i picked darts after lose forts for sort of sure win, yes. but i never expect a "slaughter" there, it wasnt one in darts imo since i sucked a lot, and i didnt feel waaaay onesided losing that molematch either.
zalo tried to be fair but looked a bit too much to whos lookin i think
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Hurz on October 07, 2021, 11:59 PM
when saying you tried to be fair i dont mean you behaved unfair btw, all fine.

actually i didnt plan to pick kaos or darts since i thought i couldnt pick same schemes i picked vs lupastic. there i only picked my "strongest" schemes cuz he picked wascar first to annoy me :D but as said, after lost battlerace i was sure you would pick mole next so i said lez kaos, so its not a 0:3 ;)


i think i sorta like the erase schemes idea.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on October 08, 2021, 01:13 AM
actually i didnt plan to pick kaos or darts since i thought i couldnt pick same schemes i picked vs lupastic. there i only picked my "strongest" schemes cuz he picked wascar first to annoy me :D but as said, after lost battlerace i was sure you would pick mole next so i said lez kaos, so its not a 0:3 ;)
sorry for the wascar gag, maybe I can promise it will never happen again..? :-* :D (at least not against you, ofc :P)

I think it's no problem if someone slaughters someone in a scheme. If you like the game, and enjoy spending time on it, learn the other schemes. For me, I would have no problem to lose in mole shoppers (or in darts, against experienced veteran players, who knows all maps basically), if in exchange I can defeat someone in wascar ;) I still enjoy mole shoppa and darts too. This is how the system works, I think it's fine like this. If you're not so good in something, improve ^^
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: SIBASA on October 08, 2021, 02:28 AM
I think that the idea of erasing schemes in turn is not ideal, because the players analyze each other before the game and, first of all, the players will exclude schemes in which their opponent is clearly strong, so some mediocre nonsense will remain in the list, and not something that pleases both players.
I propose to modernize this idea: Before starting to erase schemes one by one - the players choose one scheme that cannot be deleted, and then erase the unwanted schemes. This will keep both players interested in the upcoming games.

But still it is not correct to deprive players of the game in the schemes they want, so I also adhere to the idea of simply increasing the number of games, for example, BO9 will be optimal if we take into account the number of schemes in TFL.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on October 08, 2021, 03:17 AM
Before starting to erase schemes one by one - the players choose one scheme that cannot be deleted

That would be actually ideal for me  ;D ;D
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Gabriel on October 08, 2021, 06:08 AM
I think that the idea of erasing schemes in turn is not ideal, because the players analyze each other before the game and, first of all, the players will exclude schemes in which their opponent is clearly strong, so some mediocre nonsense will remain in the list, and not something that pleases both players.
I propose to modernize this idea: Before starting to erase schemes one by one - the players choose one scheme that cannot be deleted, and then erase the unwanted schemes. This will keep both players interested in the upcoming games.

But still it is not correct to deprive players of the game in the schemes they want, so I also adhere to the idea of simply increasing the number of games, for example, BO9 will be optimal if we take into account the number of schemes in TFL.

I think we should reduce the amount of schemes in Free League before trying any of these changes. There are so many schemes in Free League right now that you can hardly be bothered to master (or learn at least) all of them, and there is almost no incentive for a person to play the league if your opponent can just pick a scheme you have never seen in your life. I don't even know, for example, if Pro is in Free League anymore, or if Big RR is in Classic or Free; heck, people can't even remember Holy War rules anymore.

Right now, there are 19 schemes in Free League. What about we reduce it to 12? Then, each person would be able to ban 2 schemes, you'd have a pool of 8 schemes. We should open a poll, maybe? So these schemes are decided by activity and not niche pickers.

(Also, completely off topic, what about opening a poll to remove donkeys in T17?)
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: SIBASA on October 08, 2021, 03:57 PM
Yes, create a poll in the League General section, I think there are already many options for discussion.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Lupastic on October 08, 2021, 04:10 PM
You didn't want a poll vote at the Kaos tus scheme Siba, you just simply made the creator of that tus kaos scheme go there and make it clear that every match should be bo5 (cuz that's what you prefer) :P why are you making seem like a poll would be necessary here this time ;) :D :D This is how the system has always been like.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: SIBASA on October 08, 2021, 04:43 PM
You didn't want a poll vote at the Kaos tus scheme Siba, you just simply made the creator of that tus kaos scheme go there and make it clear that every match should be bo5 (cuz that's what you prefer) :P why are you making seem like a poll would be necessary here this time ;) :D :D This is how the system has always been like.
Kaos originally and always was bo5 and I did not force anyone, I just asked the creator of the scheme to express my opinion and it confirmed my words, like most other people who can read and watch the scheme settings before playing.
Title: Re: Free League Singles Playoffs #34
Post by: Zalo the moler on December 20, 2021, 08:51 AM
Oh nice. I didn't know that there is such thing as free league singles playoffs. Most of the tournaments that I know will require you to pay fees. Some are even too expensive join. Anyway, are there any other tournaments similar to this one?

All the tournaments on our humble website are "for free"  :-* (both Free League, Classic League, and Team17 league). "Free" in the name of the league refers more to a something like "Freestyle", rather than to paying anything.

In past, there used to be also Worm Olympics (ended in 2016 sadly)
http://wormolympics.com