The Ultimate Site of Worms Armageddon
Worms: Armageddon => General discussion => Topic started by: koalefant on May 03, 2020, 01:47 AM
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Hi everyone :),
I am working on a Shopper-inspired game called Crate Before Attack.
Just a couple days ago I have set up a Web-site and uploaded a public build.
The game is quite early in development, but I already got following:
- Roping... well "tonguing", to be precise, the game is about frogs :D;
- Six weapons. Mostare familiar, one is experimental - Boxing Gloves;
- Working multiplayer and hot-seat play;
- Single custom map, whitebox, but playable;
- Import of PNG maps;
- Physics, running at 120Hz with rolling and sliding;
- Procedural animation;
- Persistent splats - explosions and collision of frogs leave traces on terrain.
My current goal is to implement decent Shopper gameplay, so there is no terrain destruction, it is not possible to shot from the ground.
I am eager to get any feedback, especially from those who still play WA regularly.
You can play the game here: https://CrateBeforeAttack.com (https://CrateBeforeAttack.com) (it is playable in the browser)
And here is a short gameplay video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlTa3W41OFA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlTa3W41OFA)
P.S. I hope it is not a wrong forum section for this kind of post...
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That actually looks awesome!!!
Will try it soon :)
Good job! Just don't add paid DLC :D :D
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My current goal is to implement decent Shopper gameplay, so there is no terrain destruction, it is not possible to shot from the ground.
In that case shooting from the ground should be possible. ;D
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In that case shooting from the ground should be possible. ;D
Is that being a cow is part of the experience? :D
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That actually looks awesome!!!
Thank you!
Good job! Just don't add paid DLC :D :D
No-no, only microtransactions! :P
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Shopper is played without the Attack From Rope (AFR) rule.
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Microtransactions are even worse!
The game looks very smooth though, the roping actually looks effective! Better than WMD anyway ;D
But, seeing and doing are 2 different things, i've just woke up, i'll play this at some point.
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Shopper is played without the Attack From Rope (AFR) rule.
And here's an explanation:
Shopper existed very early on in the game and did not have the afr rule. It only got implemented because ropers had afr as a rule and they wanted to have it too. The fact that some of you call it a classic part of shopper just shows you don't know the history of shopper. Those who have been playing for a long time know that the wmdb tournaments never had afr as a rule. It didn't make much of a difference in the game, since everybody prefers to attack from rope anyway.
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And here's an explanation:
I am sorry for not being historically correct, but at the time I was playing WA online - Shopper was played mostly with AFR, and this still appers to be popular. I suspect that the game will not lose much if played shopper without ground attack. I would rather focus on other aspects that are more notable to the player...
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Dude, the roping in this is AMAZING, but the maps are pretty horrible to rope on in the sense, I wanna see what this thing can do! Can you make like BigRR maps and do rope racing on it? Any way you could add that? I'd get into this!
Edit - Actually, I don't know how you are making this game, but got me thinking, live rope racing, playing live with other players, would be pretty neat and would set this game apart from WA!
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Dude, the roping in this is AMAZING, but the maps are pretty horrible to rope on in the sense, I wanna see what this thing can do! Can you make like BigRR maps and do rope racing on it? Any way you could add that? I'd get into this!
Thanks for checking out! ;D This is the first feature request. :D I will add Rope Racing mode, adding it high on my list.
Edit - Actually, I don't know how you are making this game, but got me thinking, live rope racing, playing live with other players, would be pretty neat and would set this game apart from WA!
I have not planned for synchronous turns to be honest but I will think about it. Let see how normal Rope Racing is going when I have it working. :)
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This better not be Rope Clash Reborn. We don't need more of these atrocities.
Otherwise, it looks good. Keep up the good work.
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Better than all of T17 attempts after WWP. They should hire you and you code the roping.
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it's ironic this game doesn't enforce the rule of its title
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lmfao the roping in this game is way better than WMD
How is that possible
You did what team17's whole dev team f@#!ed up
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You did what team17's whole dev team f@#!ed up
Fun fact.. He told me it took him 3 months :D
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This better not be Rope Clash Reborn. We don't need more of these atrocities.
Otherwise, it looks good. Keep up the good work.
Rope Clash kicks ass. Did you ever even try it?
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You did what team17's whole dev team f@#!ed up
Fun fact.. He told me it took him 3 months :D
I think usually it does take initial 3-6 months to build up features with the progress visible to others, then the rest of the time is usually the "boring" task of fixing bugs. :D
koalefant joined my discord like 3 months ago as well and I'm kind of scared to think what this can turn into in the future. :-[
Yet we've been talking about various ways on implementing rope mechanics and shared other programming ideas, lets hope this can turn into cooperation.
We're the roping syndicate now. ::)
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This better not be Rope Clash Reborn. We don't need more of these atrocities.
Otherwise, it looks good. Keep up the good work.
Rope Clash kicks ass. Did you ever even try it?
There wasn't a need for me to try it. To hand over personal data to someone who practice shady schemes, and fleeing in the name of criticisms. Everyone need their safe space these days, what he hell happened? His/her/it/theirs game looked very generic compared to WA. But I give Rope Clash credit for trying, it is nice to play rope on phone.
CrateBeforeAttack looks alright, it depends on how THIS author decides to approach the monetization aspect of the game.
A game can look beautiful like Star Wars BattleFront 2, but it can also end up being a money slot machine with surprise mechanics.
If I were to make a rope/worms based game, and presented it to the worms community. I would take all the critique of my game, accept it, and work on it. Not to flee, tweet about how abusive everyone were. That's not how I roll, I roll mostly with the flow. I also would probably add donation links, and perhaps ask a price for the game if it were to be released in full state. That's about it.
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tweet about how abusive everyone were.
:D :D :D
That's the modern equivalent of when I was at school and someone said "I'm telling my daddy on you!" ahahaha
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Have you guys even tried the WMD rope? :D
The way the frog bounces off of a wall is better in this game and similar to WA. The rope itself is however closer to WA in WMD (pretty much 1:1 since they took the source code from WA). In this game you get a weird kick in the direction you are extending when you release the rope. This is apparent when you try to do a shadow.
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Have you guys even tried the WMD rope? :D
Yeah, but meh...
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I was fooling around a bit in training mode to see how rope handles It's pretty fun and addicting, gotta admit. In a short amount of time you managed to achieve this much, hats off!
Maybe you can allow players to choose which difficulty of training challenge they wanna have. Even with failing and trying out rope physics, this was pretty easy to do (attachment). Most ropers around here would be able to do this training course till infinity or till their hand starts falling apart, which is making it bit boring.
Still, enjoyable game. Wish you gl in further work!
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Just realized how hard-wired my brain is to expect W:A physics. Took me a while to adapt, especially shadows are "reversed" so to speak. Tapping seems pointless to build any speed or momentum. Those are issues from me tho, not the game itself. Totally serviceable rope mechanic unlike T17 attempts.
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Hmm, I didn't notice any difficulty of making the tricks. Especially shadows and spikes. Although - double shadows in this game. Especially love the mechanics where you point a direction of flight and frog goes faster there. That's something new and in need of mastering, but I dig the variety game offers while maintaining Worms feeling.
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Someone with a twitter acct should start tweeting this at team17 official twitter
#RealWorms2020
Too bad we don't have a sackful of cash to dev this game with, this is the era of a resurgence of 2D games
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You can import any PNG map made for WA as long as it's 1920x696 or slightly bigger. Also, it appears that not every map works (frogs don't spawn). Luckily there are lots of maps to choose from.
Very big RR works for me and you can choose to have x1 or x2 scaling. But sometimes it will not load correctly, this is not exactly due to the map size.
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I messed up my forum notifications, so answering late, my apologies. Thanks for all the compliments, feedback keeps me going! ;D
it's ironic this game doesn't enforce the rule of its title
I have this on my list, the game requires a bit of leniency and responsible players at this point. ;)
I do really enjoy roping in this game, except I can't seem to do any rope tricks, i.e. shadow, spike, pump and so forth. Nevermind, after a little bit of practice I managed to do shadow, spike and kicks. Definitely takes some getting used to!
I am the point where my personal roping skill (lack of it) prevents me from improving controls further. If you could pinpoint what difference exactly makes it challenging - I would be glad to address it.
Maybe you can allow players to choose which difficulty of training challenge they wanna have. Even with failing and trying out rope physics, this was pretty easy to do (attachment). Most ropers around here would be able to do this training course till infinity or till their hand starts falling apart, which is making it bit boring.
You guys are so much better at roping than I am! :D I get can get 12 crates at most with current settings. :-X I will try to balance this to be more enjoyable for a good roper. Thanks for mentioning!
CrateBeforeAttack looks alright, it depends on how THIS author decides to approach the monetization aspect of the game.
A game can look beautiful like Star Wars BattleFront 2, but it can also end up being a money slot machine with surprise mechanics.
If I were to make a rope/worms based game, and presented it to the worms community. I would take all the critique of my game, accept it, and work on it. Not to flee, tweet about how abusive everyone were. That's not how I roll, I roll mostly with the flow. I also would probably add donation links, and perhaps ask a price for the game if it were to be released in full state. That's about it.
THIS author does not really have any monetization plan yet, but he certainly would like to avoid any schemes that are offensive to an experienced player, no mechanic similar to Pay-or-Wait or Pay-to-Win will land in the game.
I am eager to get ANY feedback, I can't promise to fix/implement everything, but if you would like to influence development - you're very welcome to give feedback. I have no problems with critical feedback or people disliking things. That is the only way to make it better.
Very big RR works for me and you can choose to have x1 or x2 scaling. But sometimes it will not load correctly, this is not exactly due to the map size.
If you know of a map that breaks - feel free to send me a link, I am interested in having more content playable.
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There is another Alpha Update online at https://cratebeforeattack.com/play, here is what changed since my first post:
- Race mode: a player can now choose different game rules, and there is now a Race mode available. It is bare-bone, there is no bundled racing map yet. I am curious what you think of it...
- Switched over from Vorbis to Opus as Vorbis is not supported by Safari
- Fixed occasional crash during tongue elongation/contraction
- Fixed collision with newly placed projectiles
- Consume F-keys and Backspace, so pressing F5 does not reload the page anymore (where possible)
- Controls: reverse swing direction when upside-down
- Increased network buffer size by 50% to reduce interruptions on bad connections
Any way you could add that? I'd get into this!
I hope that is what you expected.
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A little sneap-peak of what is coming next :)
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I've seen this before... Sarah Connor would disapprove... :D
Looks good!
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Hi, another update is up:
- PNG maps: dramatically reduced memory usage, 8-bit images are not expanded to full color anymore, upscaling is done in the shader. E.g. Pizza map went down from 1.9GB to 140MB in memory;
- Added zoom, helps to navigate large racing maps;
- Enabled AI in racing mode (only local games at the moment);
- Fixed mines not being affected by explosions;
- Fixed jumps mid-air;
- Fixed incorrect orientation of dynamite pack;
- Fixed turn/arrow indicator appearing when no input is taken;
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Race mode is amazing. The AI is already godly at roping.. you'll probably want to add a dumber one for noobs. AFAIK there has NEVER been an AI that can rope before - very impressive. The game handled my .png map flawlessly, and the start/end position and turntime counting features are wonderful. Love the ghost and zoom features. Still getting used to the physics but they are pretty intuitive - glad you reversed the upside-down extend direction.
For long races, I recommend adding the ability to create checkpoints
You could add a "practice" mode/checkbox where if the frog drowns during a race, he gets teleported back to the last checkpoint. (Similar to WA's "antisink")
After a race ends where the player successfully reaches the finish line, it might be good to ask "do you want to share this map and your ghost online for others? I certify that I own the required copyrights etc". Then we could race against other people's ghosts, have things like a leaderboard, daily featured map challenge, etc, even if nobody else is online. Asking after the game would help ensure map quality, correct start/end/checkpoint placements, and overall playable/bug-free.
It's really incredible what you've accomplished in such a seemingly short time.. keep up the great work!
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I just feel intoxicated by the update being received so well! ::)
Thank you for your feedback! :D
Why did you call it "Broken AI" though?
I feel like it is still hectic and motion is far from being smooth. I want it to be more elegant and relaxed... 8)
The current race mode has unlimited turn timer which is nice and should definitely remain for smaller maps, but for large maps there needs to be a turn based mode (30 or 40 seconds long perhaps?).
That is an elegant solution to long waiting time in a Race, noted! :)
I've actually gotten used to the controls now and have no complaints aside from, like Anubis said, shadows are "reversed".
I don't understand it exactly what is the difference yet, but I will investigate this...
Anyway, here's a couple map generator programs you may be interested in (from a programming standpoint):
Thank you for the links, these are awesome tools, I will look into this topic. :)
The AI is already godly at roping.. you'll probably want to add a dumber one for noobs.
Good idea, I will finish Shopper-support, do some polish and then look into adding difficulty settings.
For long races, I recommend adding the ability to create checkpoints
That would be a nice addition. I bet it will soothe the pain of losing your worm in the middle of a long run! :'(
After a race ends where the player successfully reaches the finish line, it might be good to ask "do you want to share this map and your ghost online for others? I certify that I own the required copyrights etc".
I had an automated leaderboard in mind, but this would be even better, would ensure consistency as people could contend a race just by clicking on a previous result. I love it! ;D
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Incredible progress, t17 never figured out how to make worms AI rope even, lol
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I still don't like how the frog jumps after releasing the tongue if you are holding down/up arrow key. Is it just me?
also, you can't do power spikes! To me it feels like the roping/tonguing is more limited compared to WA.
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I still don't like how the frog jumps after releasing the tongue if you are holding down/up arrow key. Is it just me?
also, you can't do power spikes! To me it feels like the roping/tonguing is more limited compared to WA.
Can't really say that I like it, but can probably get used to it. It's the thing that makes this Frogs, not Worms. Wouldn't mind an option to turn it off though. Overall the roping is really good.
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Lol, Team17 should hire this guy. :-*
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I like how you can tongue while sliding, i always thought worms should be like that to open up more possibilities
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In this game you get a weird kick in the direction you are extending when you release the rope. This is apparent when you try to do a shadow.
Can't really say that I like it, but can probably get used to it. It's the thing that makes this Frogs, not Worms. Wouldn't mind an option to turn it off though.
I believed I made progress on this, thanks to help from Syc.
Now when you release the tongue the velocity is projected on the tangent of rotation once again.
This change is in the live build, if you would like to try.
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I added first level art to the game - Space map:
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This is insanely cool. Nice. I've subscribed to your YouTube channel and I'm looking forward to updates.
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In this game you get a weird kick in the direction you are extending when you release the rope. This is apparent when you try to do a shadow.
Can't really say that I like it, but can probably get used to it. It's the thing that makes this Frogs, not Worms. Wouldn't mind an option to turn it off though.
I believed I made progress on this, thanks to help from Syc.
Now when you release the tongue the velocity is projected on the tangent of rotation once again.
This change is in the live build, if you would like to try.
Yeah, it feels more familiar now (and better to me). Now you need to find ways to make the game different. :D I wouldn't mind if you could jump while in the air by pressing enter, for example. 'Tonguing' doesn't have to be different, though. It can be something else.
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Yeah, it feels more familiar now (and better to me). Now you need to find ways to make the game different. :D
Good point, I will try to see if I can get more out of sliding.
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Meanwhile, playing with eye animation:
(https://i.imgur.com/DBfp3CP.gif)
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And there is a Golf-Club weapon now in the game:
(https://s7.gifyu.com/images/2020-07-12_02-59-1939b63116b547c6f8.gif)
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A new Shopper map was recently added: Ruins.
It is now possible to join and observe a match after it was started.
(https://i.imgur.com/yo7YVTc.png)
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I think I slowly start to burn out and skid, my change velocity is lower, but here is another little update:
This time Training mode is getting some love:
- There is a new map: Dungeon.
- New training settings settings.
- It is now possible to pick up crates mid-air.
Some GPU performance improvements for users with integrated graphics.
Some more details are here: https://cratebeforeattack.com/posts/20200831-august-update/