Classic Season #32 goes experimental!

[DarkOne]

Calling me names and agreeing with me is still agreeing with me.
Focus on that if you really have something to say, or if you want to say something. I've said.

You certainly have!

[...]because I understand that some struggle when realizing their own stupidity but that's what the others are for so they can easily point it out.[...]

The horse line of thought followed here (horses are put eye patches that allow them to move only forward and never look back)[...]

I can picture MonkeyIsland... "changes, changes, people want changes! I need to make choices!" at this point and faced with the responsibility to tweak a scheme and not fck it all up his pants are already wet... "just change everything and let everyone else decide!".

Bottom line is, every single one of you that was aware of these changes and didn't put the voice on the sky about them before they were made public have proven a severe lack the ability to embark in a coherent thinking process.

I'd be more inclined to agree with that little statement of yours of you weren't such a colossal hypocrit

btw: what do you mean here?

Even if you managed to make good fixed for schemes, which you didn't thought you were close to ruining a pair or two it would still all be a big waste of time because the word "experimental" implies that the end user is going to finally have to accept these changes and seeing as what the experts have come up with I don't even want to stop and think what kind of feedback the not so clever ones can come up with.

If it means what I think it means you're already making 2 baseless assumptions. If you can't read a sentence out loud in one breath, then it's probably too long and will become a mess that no one can understand.

Also:

I specifically spoke about fixes that introduce problems and that make no sense either way.

You mentioned one specific problem in this thread and I addressed that one. The rest is pretty generalised insulting.

[zippeurfou]

Why do you bother answering darkone ? This guy has been *trolling* around for years and not even playing the game or at least this league. He did nothing except criticizing everything. A good example is as far as I remember him he never plainly admitted he was once wrong. Komo used to get crazy with his 10k word post but he actually did admit sometimes he was wrong but no not ropa :-) Just go [utl=https://www.tus-wa.com/profile/?area=showposts;u=25]there[/url] and watch his post since he is back.
He comes here only to have fun trolling everyone. At first it is frustrating because he clearly isn't one of these people who say "XLOLOL f@#! YA ME GOD YOU SUX" and inside his non stop aggressive post sometimes there actually are good ideas but at the end the result is the same as a basic troller.
Anyways, nothing personal against you ropa. In real life you might be a real nice guy (and I wouldn't be surprised about that) but in this game forum I can't say you behave really nicely.

[Kangaroo]

I'm not sure about 5 sec SD in hysteria, but sounds experimental  We'll see. For funner games it's better to stay with 10 sec. In tus games players are more skilled, they don't lose their turns accidently, so 5 sec should be fine i think

I Think this 5 sec thing is horrible, Its going to make it too easy to force sudden death, And i can already tell people are going to agrue and claim as a "Noob" tactic.

The people who complain about Hys are not the ones who play it... Keep 10 sec i say...

[avirex]

its a shame how ropa behaves....

hes a very smart guy, and we all know this because he goes out of his way each and every post to to display just how well spoken he is... he reminds me of Ryno, or what ever his name was from FirstBlood days...  who even ropa, at that time would make fun of, because he talked as if he was in a professional setting... 

anyway, if ropa just took his smarts, and knowledge of the game, and applied in a way to help and encourage change for the better... maybe we would get to the point we all want to be, with good schemes that suits the majorities needs...

but all ropa is interested in, is bashing everyone, pissing everyone off, and showing how much of a smart ass he can be.


its really a shame.

[Aerox]

You mentioned one specific problem in this thread and I addressed that one. The rest is pretty generalised insulting.

Because I overestimate your perspective, and because I expect you to already realize the problems with these changes without me having to highlight them one by one (I did highlight the most insane of them all, mind). I was kind of waiting for a justification that outweighs all the problems introduced with these changes. But I'm getting none. There's certainly not one in the OP.

You talk as if rope knocking adds a whole new ground of strategy to Elite, it does. You know where does it borrow that set of moves to build that new set of tactics? From intermediate. You're essentially making two very different schemes play more similar. Tweaking classic? Ruining it. You've gone to save the schemes by focusing on a set of principles but ignoring the whole picture; you're completely ruining the balance. And the insults all come from the shock that you were unaware of it the whole process.

Avirex, I've been pioneer in vocally complaining about some of the changes that were made to schemes in the latter times here in TUS, I'm not taking any credit, but you were saying the same bullshit back then too, so mind want to avoid the rock the second walk.

[DarkOne]

[...] I've been pioneer in vocally complaining[...]

Like I said, youngest old man I know. I wouldn't put that on my resume.
I'll just focus on the one specific thing you mentioned because the rest is like a ringing in my ear about how great you are and how awful the rest is.

You talk as if rope knocking adds a whole new ground of strategy to Elite, it does. You know where does it borrow that set of moves to build that new set of tactics? From intermediate. You're essentially making two very different schemes play more similar. Tweaking classic? Ruining it. You've gone to save the schemes by focusing on a set of principles but ignoring the whole picture; you're completely ruining the balance.

So what you're saying is that with rope knocking, we have too much of intermediate in TUS classic league?

• Intermediate isn't even in classic league at the moment.
• With intermediate, you have a lot more time to pile worms at a specific location, especially since roping distances are usually shorter in intermediate.

This is like comparing knocking options in shopper with knocking options in WxW.
More interestingly, if you think borrowing moves from other schemes to improve your elite skills is a bad thing, then we should remove bazooka and grenades, because you're borrowing ideas from BnG. We should remove the superweapon because the supersheep borrows from sheeprace and sheepforts. The bungee clearly is a technique from bungeerace, so scrap that shit. Parachute? Please. That's for T17. Same goes for girders.

[Aerox]

[...] I've been pioneer in vocally complaining[...]

Like I said, youngest old man I know. I wouldn't put that on my resume.
I'll just focus on the one specific thing you mentioned because the rest is like a ringing in my ear about how great you are and how awful the rest is.

You talk as if rope knocking adds a whole new ground of strategy to Elite, it does. You know where does it borrow that set of moves to build that new set of tactics? From intermediate. You're essentially making two very different schemes play more similar. Tweaking classic? Ruining it. You've gone to save the schemes by focusing on a set of principles but ignoring the whole picture; you're completely ruining the balance.

So what you're saying is that with rope knocking, we have too much of intermediate in TUS classic league?

• Intermediate isn't even in classic league at the moment.
• With intermediate, you have a lot more time to pile worms at a specific location, especially since roping distances are usually shorter in intermediate.

This is like comparing knocking options in shopper with knocking options in WxW.
More interestingly, if you think borrowing moves from other schemes to improve your elite skills is a bad thing, then we should remove bazooka and grenades, because you're borrowing ideas from BnG. We should remove the superweapon because the supersheep borrows from sheeprace and sheepforts. The bungee clearly is a technique from bungeerace, so scrap that shit. Parachute? Please. That's for T17. Same goes for girders.

No. What I'm saying is that taking a non broken scheme and making it more similar to another one whilst taking an irrelevant scheme which is already very similar to roper and basically cloning it is stupid. Nevermind making "fixes" that makes those really inclined to notch have an even easier time doing so. Forget about 4 second full power grenades, that was 10 years ago.

The examples in your post only go to show that even to this day, your understanding of schemes in a competitive environment is still extremely limited. There's a major difference between adding or subtracting weapons and changing the gameplay of a scheme. You might want to oversimplify it in your head for you own understanding but please do not insult my intelligence, because what it looks like is that the roping knocking change was just added to compensate for the other changes, as if your objective was from the beginning to change every single scheme, at least a bit, that's wrong design, or design focused in the wrong direction; ultimately you're not fixing anything, you're just offering changes for the sake of it, and then see if it's popular enough to see an increase in activity. Good corporate.

[avirex]

Dear All-Mighty Ropa,

Would you please be the ultimate hero of this community. Would you be as kind to gather all your knowledge, and wisdom together for the sake of creating the best schemes!!   there is not one single person on these forums that have the exact same opinion on how the schemes should be, but with your guru train of thought, you will make the perfect scheme accepted by all!! i just know it!!

you can be the man someday known as the one who saved this game we all know and love so much!! thank you in advanced


                      Signed, Your Friends at TUS.



i think this is what ropa expects

[OrangE]

i think he doesnt expect anything. he's just a frustrated guy.

(i mean it, i'm not trolling)

[DarkOne]

He clearly is, but at some point he has to realise that even if he's completely right, nobody will listen if he wraps it in a bag of shit.

[OrangE]

yeh, good point.

[ANO]

I was thinking that maybe 5 worms in ttrr is really too much. we ve tried with masta, there is less adrenalina and stress factor... what I l like when I play leagues...

Maybe 4 worms should be better even if I would prefer 3 in any case... but let's see

[Aerox]

He clearly is, but at some point he has to realise that even if he's completely right, nobody will listen if he wraps it in a bag of shit.

Of course you listen. I present criticism in a way Flanders would not approve, you confront me because you don't like the rock & roll I add to my lyrics to finally claim nobody listens because I put emotion into my arguments. Consider the bag of shit a filter and you're being caught in it because apparently you're that easily impressed by a bag of shit.

But you overestimate the power of the bag of shit, whilst the bag of shit stops you from seeing past it right now, in the future, you'll incorporate said bag of shit and call it the new all around league or changes to hysteria 2.0

Sad bit is, you'll probably mess up big time in the whole process whilst trying to please everyone, see the case that occupies us if not.

[TheKomodo]

I don't know why anyone would say SG helps notchers in BnG because I really don't think it does, 1st off it takes 1 turn to use SG, therefor if they hide evil they will have an extremely limited angle, all the other player has to do is move hide and then they have the advantage.

Notching is exactly the same with or without SG anyway, it isn't harder or easier.

Eager to see why you think it makes notching worse, do share.

[DarkOne]

ropa, when's the last time you got things done on WA? Like actual things, projects, league changes, league launches etcetera. I'm not talking about hosting a single tournament or anything, that's easy stuff.

If you have to think real hard for an answer (or more likely, not find an answer at all), I'd say the bag of shit has no power at all.
You can try to polish that turd all you want, it's still a turd.

Call me again when you grow up, ropa.