Discussion about possible TTRR League???

[TheKomodo]

I actually edited my post again btw lol.

Ok let me break down your example:

Timing: Sure this requires alot of timing for pressing the space and arrows at the right times, but it's equal to Ropers.

Precision: Every scheme requires this.

Dexterity: Same goes for Bungee Race/Ropers/JPRace for starters (for use of body) and in terms of mental skill, TTRR is one of the simplest, get from start to finish the fastest.

Forward thinking/Planning: These are more or less the same thing in TTRR as Ropers, thinking ahead to oncoming moves you must use to get the crate and attack, and same with in TTRR how to get round the course fastest, although even with this, it doesn't take alot seeing as TTRR's use a certain amount of "moves" to achieve the best speed round corners/climbs/etc, Elite/T17 definately take ALOT more of this than TTRR by a longshot.

Reaction speed: Again, it takes an equal amount like Ropers, if you fall, you must react faster to get going again, along with your hand reactions for using the keys.

As for "It is also a psychological test requiring composure and concentration in extreme proportions.", sorry but that's just a bunch of crap put together to look smart, I definately think I need to concentrate more playing BnG especially when losing because every shot counts, and as far as composure is concerned, everyone sits and has to be comfy for any scheme.

As for beers stupid comment, who is spamming? You are the one only posting "blah blah blah, f@#! f@#! f@#!" and saying NOTHING about this topic at all, either shutup or get involved, spammer lol.

Oh and this is advice for everyone: Don't leave bOr or beer will hate you forever.

[NAiL]

It is a psychological test though, every ttrrer knows that.

Holding your composure to beat a nice time on your final worm is INDEED a psychological test. You know you're capable of doing it, but under pressure its another story. Every ttrrer will tell you the same.

Sure this goes for every scheme as you said Komo, but in ttrr you must hold your composure for a far longer single period of time than in ANY other scheme. Undeniable fact.

[DarkOne]

...especially when losing because every shot counts...

Wow, you must be an awesome RRer if you can screw up and still make a winning time against anyone when your current time isn't fast enough!

[TheKomodo]

Sure this goes for every scheme as you said Komo, but in ttrr you must hold your composure for a far longer single period of time than in ANY other scheme. Undeniable fact.

That's just lies, a last turn lasts what? 30-50 seconds? losing a BnG with like 10hp left against 100hp can last 5-10 minutes of nerveracking attempts at making a comeback and winning, which has happened alot to me.

D1 I was talking about BnG there.

[DarkOne]

I know. You said that matters only in BnG, so I responded in kind

[NAiL]

Sure this goes for every scheme as you said Komo, but in ttrr you must hold your composure for a far longer single period of time than in ANY other scheme. Undeniable fact.

That's just lies, a last turn lasts what? 30-50 seconds? losing a BnG with like 10hp left against 100hp can last 5-10 minutes of nerveracking attempts at making a comeback and winning, which has happened alot to me.

D1 I was talking about BnG there.

Yes exactly komo. A turn in TTRR can range from 30 to 80 (or more) seconds of CONTINUAL focus and physical skill. No other scheme requires this. In bng the only physical skill required will last for no more than ONE second. Sure the games will go on for longer than ttrr, but in terms of continual skill over an UNBROKEN period of time, no other scheme rivals ttrr.

This is obvious...

[TheKomodo]

What about BigRR? What about BTS? Lol just messing with ya.

You are right there, with an unbroken period of time, I can't argue with that, but still BnG's (because I care more) are much more nerveracking for me and for longer and can mess with you more than TTRR can, but that just comes down to the schemes you are passionate about, the more you don't want to lose, the more nervous you will get, the more tense it can be, and the more you want to get a record time, or a perfect shot, the same thing applies, taking into consideration you are right about this one point with "unbroken turns" that still doesn't make TTRR the top skill scheme or more League worthy than for example Hysteria, which I would choose before TTRR, I ain't saying TTRR doesn't deserve a League, like I said I want it to be the next TRL scheme.

I personally don't want 5 Leagues, am I not allowed to feel that way or something?

But seriously lol, I just done TTRR cup with Sniper, the last turn was intense, I knew I couldn't go as fast as I want because this trial version of Intes Keychanger doesn't work right, it keeps failing when I use space, that last turn I could have beat his time if I got that last climb right but still, at least it wasn't 2-0 lol.

[sock]

i vote for an individual league for all schemes, not sure how it would look or how you would put it together but makes a lot of sense to me

[TheKomodo]

i vote for an individual league for all schemes, not sure how it would look or how you would put it together but makes a lot of sense to me

I agree in a sense, but like not 10 Leagues lol, I would like TRL should swap schemes EVERY Season, next TTRR, next Hysteria, next WxW, next BnG, next Shoppa, next T17 etc...

[Cueshark]

I can't believe I'm rising to the bait but here goes.....

:<

Timing:
Sure this requires alot of timing for pressing the space and arrows at the right times, but it's equal to Ropers.

Roping at fast speeds makes the timing much more critical.  The faster you rope, the harder the timing becomes.  

Because TTRR requires roping as fast as possible through a maze I would argue timing to be more an issue than during a roper game.

Also, TTRR often requires 30+ seconds of consistently executed rope moves all done at high speed.  The combination of all these tricks and the timing required puts it at a higher skill level than roper.

Precision:
Every scheme requires this.

No shit sherlock.  But roping in smaller spaces requires greater precision.

Example - If you try and do a REALLY fast swoosh.  How many 'frames' do you have as your window of opportunity to hit space and go down the tunnel centrally?  Maybe 2? Or 1?

So your precision needs to be 1/50th of a second to get that trick nailed.

In TTRR you need to be nailing multiple tricks with small 'windows' in order to succeed.  This is what it's all about.  Which is why it takes so much practice.

Dexterity:
Same goes for Bungee Race/Ropers/JPRace for starters (for use of body) and in terms of mental skill, TTRR is one of the simplest, get from start to finish the fastest.

To break the fast TTRR records you need to be skating round those arrow keys, shifting diagonals, tapping space f@#!ing fast.  It's probably the most demanding on your hands.

Again, I'm not saying that other schemes require no dexterity.  I'm saying that TTRR requires the most dexterity.

Forward thinking/Planning:
These are more or less the same thing in TTRR as Ropers, thinking ahead to oncoming moves you must use to get the crate and attack, and same with in TTRR how to get round the course fastest, although even with this, it doesn't take alot seeing as TTRR's use a certain amount of "moves" to achieve the best speed round corners/climbs/etc, Elite/T17 definately take ALOT more of this than TTRR by a longshot.

When playing a TTRR, the planning and forward thinking is done 'on the fly'.  If a move doesn't happen then you're ready for plan B and possibly plan C.  If you are skillful enough you can get through without losing much time even with loads of mistakes.

I agree that other schemes require more forward thinking and planning.  It is more a characteristic of a strategy game but my point was that being able to plan for any eventuality in a split second is another aspect of rope racing skill.

Reaction speed:
Again, it takes an equal amount like Ropers, if you fall, you must react faster to get going again, along with your hand reactions for using the keys.

When you're rope racing, you need to be constantly looking at the worm which is in a small enclosed space.  Any deviation from the desired path and you need to correct it.  This is tough going and the reaction speed is so important.  I would love to have greater reaction speed.  I could then throw myself down a corridor as fast as I could but always be able to correct any problems should they occur.  Reaction speed is the essence of TTRR.  Reacting to what you see on the screen, where your worm is, how fast it's travelling, momentum, rope angle etc.  Reacting to these constantly changing variables is what TTRR is all about.

Roper is too but again, TTRR is all about speed and in smaller places.  Reaction speed is a LOT more than just reacting when you fall off the rope.

As for "It is also a psychological test requiring composure and concentration in extreme proportions.", sorry but that's just a bunch of crap put together to look smart, I definately think I need to concentrate more playing BnG especially when losing because every shot counts, and as far as composure is concerned, everyone sits and has to be comfy for any scheme.

I recently posted about this in a recent TTRR challenge.  It's far from a bunch of crap Komo and perhaps you have never been in that kind of gaming 'zone' before.  It's a great place to be and great things can be acheived.  The mix of adrelanine, sweat and tears that happens during hardcore TTRR.  You're missing out man :<

Dulek even mentioned about the fact that he can't blink during his runs.  So as well as the psychological pressure, he has dry eyes.  

Awesome stuff.

[DarkOne]

I think we can all agree that sheepraces are hardest.

Now how about discussing the possible TTRR league rather than whose scheme is the more demanding/fun/has the biggest dick/whatever?
Komo, I hand you a challenge: go in 5 debates without mentioning BnG.

[NAiL]

Personally, I found it weird that we can play elite for both the classic league and TEL Only thing that's added is playoffs for TEL in addition to the classic league. The system works exactly the same and the schemes are exactly the same.

So why not just have 2 playoffs for classic league? An overall playoff and a specialist playoff? The specialist playoffs pick one of the scheme ratings and uses the same criteria. The specialist playoff should be a new scheme each season so it's still interesting.

This is actually making a lot more sense now.

You can also simplify a lot of reporting problems by just making everything report into the classic league. The only real differences for TEL right now is that it has its own standings/playoffs/overall ranking. If everything just reports into the classic league (MI confirm if this is possible), everything is ok as long as you still have separate Elite standings you can view -> which also has it's own separate playoff seeds/minimum requirements. The only outstanding issue would be how to handle the currently two separate overall ratings (classic and TEL).

Naturally, this concept could also expand to other schemes that gain enough support. So there could be separate Roper standings with its own playoff seeds/minimum requirements. And now for TTRR, there would be separate standings and its own playoff seeds/requirements.

Depending on popularity, these separate standings/playoffs could be removed, or just go dormant. In the end though, all is reported into classic league, so that instead of duplicate schemes getting split up reports with separate leagues... the classic league could truly show all games being played, and hopefully show the true allrounder.


edit: also, this could potentially increase the chances of finding those specialized games in ag -> "TTRR tus anyone?" will probably get more people to accept because those games will count toward those specialized standings along with the classic standings.

I dont like this idea.

The reason I dont pick ttrr as much as id like to for the classic league is becuase I dont get many points for it. I try to pick the scheme I get the most points for when I play the classic league.

People dont wanna mess with their classic league rank, if we did it this way it would also mean that people who only want to play ttrr or elite would have to reach the minimum games limit in order to make the playoffs.

If good players who dont want to take part in the classic league (like cue) were to ask for "TUS ttrr anyone", or spw "tus elite anyone", people would be less inclined to play them considering they dont want to risk their overall rank in that scheme.

If there was a seperate league with seperate rankings, people would be far more likely to play, knowing that those games will not infringe on their overall statistics.

The solution is simple to me, make another league for ttrr... what harm could it possibly do?

We've already confirmed that it wont affect classic league activity in any way, and there are a large number of players who want to have a ttrr league. Again, what harm could it possibly do!?

If it does indeed turn out to not be active, then we can just remove it... you cant lose! Make a ttrr league, there hasnt been one for ages and so many people want one so badly!

[sock]

i vote for an individual league for all schemes, not sure how it would look or how you would put it together but makes a lot of sense to me

I agree in a sense, but like not 10 Leagues lol, I would like TRL should swap schemes EVERY Season, next TTRR, next Hysteria, next WxW, next BnG, next Shoppa, next T17 etc...

ooo, i like this idea too.

[TheKomodo]

I'm too lazy to make quotes atm so i'll just answer your points point by point Cue.

I still stick to my opinion Cue, you can lose a Roper because of one failed move which you timed wrong which made you fall, miss your hide, miss a crate and give the opponent too big an advantage, which is bad enough considering you need to do your best every turn just incase you get that impossible crate.

Roping in smaller spaces does not require greater precision, for starters I think BnG requires more precision than any scheme, considering you have to hit the opponent with a weapon, especially the way I play BnG at the skill level I am used to, and how many League games do you see people doing the fastest possible moves? More or less none because it's too risky, if you are trying to win TTRR's for a League or a Cup you will play as safe as possible with going as fast as possible which totally blows your point out the window.

Edit: I'd just like to point out here, we can both argue against both TTRR and BnG here, you could say, well it's your fault for wanting to use tricky and hard shots for BnG, and I could say, well it's your fault for wanting to TTRR on tighter maps, we both want the best out of the scheme, so i'll agree with 50/50 here.

This is no different from Ropers, you are "skating round those arrow keys" just as much with Ropers and WxW, especially with some maps people use, so again I don't agree it requires most dexterity.

And split second thinking/planning is an aspect of Ropers/WxW also.

I have to use BnG for a good point here, I need EXCEPTIONAL timing and reaction speed for getting the right "pwoer" in BnG's alot of shots only work with "1" level of pwoer, and i've had so many games where i've had to nail that 1st time, or risk losing the game next turn because my hide is easy to hit, which also makes me nervous which messes with your reaction speed because it's a mental challenge as well, you are talking about correcting any problems should they occur, at least you can still win correcting a few bad reactions in a TTRR under pressure, I have 1 chance, 1 turn to get that perfect pwoer and if I miss it theres no second chance should my opponent hit me the next turn, and this happens alot when the opponent is hiding evil or in a very very very tight hide and theres only 1 angle/level of pwoer that will get in.

Most BnG's I am sweating like hell because I am so into the game, especially on Thursdays with the BnG Tournament I get so into it I concentrate so much I get myself into this position on my chair, I actually have to take my top off and sit in my boxers because I get that hot and intense(I know this sounds weird lol).

This has nothing to do with because of the scheme, this is because you are passionate about TTRR and same with me and BnG, i've played BF2 online for years and that's intense as hell too, maybe even more so than the whole of WA imo, but it's totally different, I played Quake3 online for about a year, I even played some with GreeN, that shit is VERY intense, i've played golf online, WoW online, i've even played Genesis emulator online and that was intense lol, trust me, I know the feeling and glad we share the same passion, even if it's with different games and schemes

I can't accept that challenge D1, BnG is a HUGE part of my life, and helps to make points alot, NEVER !!! xD

[Dulek]

I have to use BnG for a good point here, I need EXCEPTIONAL timing and reaction speed for getting the right "pwoer" in BnG's alot of shots only work with "1" level of pwoer, and i've had so many games where i've had to nail that 1st time, or risk losing the game next turn because my hide is easy to hit, which also makes me nervous which messes with your reaction speed because it's a mental challenge as well, you are talking about correcting any problems should they occur, at least you can still win correcting a few bad reactions in a TTRR under pressure, I have 1 chance, 1 turn to get that perfect pwoer and if I miss it theres no second chance should my opponent hit me the next turn, and this happens alot when the opponent is hiding evil or in a very very very tight hide and theres only 1 angle/level of pwoer that will get in.

You can't compare crucial moment of BnG to whole TTRR run. If we want to make it equal, then TTRR run is in its crucial moment as well, ok? By following this thinking, it's clear that when you're approaching the finish in TTRR any mistake will be fatal in consequences just like in BnG and probably any other game.

I uphold Nail's argumentation - so far 2 seperate leagues didn't affect activity on the Classic League and I think we can move on. You can always close TTRR League if it turn out to be a failure. The poll is on our side, weak but still.