Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMWhat is with you people that every single, tiny aspect of the game needs to be 'corrected' to take out the random/ "bad luck" factor?? Ask yourself this, would Worms, on a competitive level, still be fun if it came down to pure skill all the time? Wouldn't it be just as easy then to get rid of TUS and just hand out the Elite trophies to the CF squad, the RR to Ryan, the BnG to Komodo and the T17 to me (lolz)?
Heck, would Worms still be 'fun'?
I agree with you, but yes, I am guessing the reason why people think it's fun in leagues if it came down to pure skill, is because it is a league, it is there as a test to your capability of using a set scheme and rules to beat your opponent in certain games, I personally think if you play the game for fun, there are still hundreds of players out there that like to play random funners, so don't play leagues if this is what you enjoy, although you do have a valid point...
Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMI dont know about you but I feel that many schemes have already degenerated into some kind of chess, in which each and every game has the same set-up and an almost equal way the games develop towards SD. We have altered the maps, added manual placements, basically we've done everything to make this game more predictable under the pretense that it accurately reflects who has more skillzzz, but what we've actually done is taken the fun out of all of it.
Not just Roper and Shopper use custom maps nowadays, but Elite and BnG maps are also tweaked to meet our demands.. to get rid of any possible 'luck'-factors that might take us to a situation that is new to us, to which we are not prepared, to a game that is beyond our personal control. Oh horror!
I can't disagree with you here, because I have noticed the exact same thing, they have more or less the same set-up and an almost equal way that they develop towards SD, but then again, we haven't taken the fun out of it, this is a league remember and it's supposed to be played seriously and competitive, people who don't like that shouldn't play leagues, everyone who knows me can vouch for me here, the way I BnG in leagues, and in funners, are completely different, unless i'm drunk lol, I do think it's fun with extra luck factor, but not in leagues, luck is so much fun, it can give you the biggest laugh even when it happens to you, but if it happens in a serious league game and costs a match you want to win, look at it from this perspective? Some people don't care about losing, some people do, alot of people in this league play with a different style from funners-league matches, and not only that, alot have a completely different attitude also...
Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMIn the meantime we push newbies away with our intricate and abundant houserules and our pro-schemes which have little to nothing to do with what Worms was originally meant to be.
You guys may whine all you want when 'boons' on the T17 forum, as well as Team17 themselves, fail to recognize the superiority of WA and its gametypes, but in all honesty.. it's the WA community itself that is blinded by its own incompetence to keep the game interesting for new and old players alike.
Some people push noobs away yes, we can't make them do any different, I kick noobs if I already have a game setup specifically, but it doesn't bother me because I know whenever I host a random game, and a noob joins (99% of the time it's BnG) not only do I have the patience to teach them the rules, thanks to my skills I can actually attract noobs to BnG, because when people like me, and everyone else in b2b plays BnG, it looks a HELL of a lot more exciting than the TuS/FB/WL style "keep throwing 3s/4s" besides, being a noob nowadays isn't that big a deal anymore, most gamers know that when they play a game for the 1st time, they are a noob, they refer to themself as a noob, so they expect to be kicked a few times, it's the noobs that act like idiots and be disrespectful that get treated like crap, and I don't blame anyone for this... Show me a 1st time player with a nice attitude and alot of time on their hands not only will I teach them the game we are playing, I will give them as much advice tips and tricks about being a WA player, I've told probably over 100 noobs since I started b2b with wormf00d, "yeah gg man, and remember if you see anyone with "b2b" in their name, just tell them I said you could BnG with them
" now with this being said, I do see how all the arguing n stuff on these forums could turn some people away...
Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMWhat people want is not some kind of inate chess-game in which the winner is pretty much predetermined (You can tell almost exactly who is going to be in the final of a RR cup or Elite tourney), instead, they want a game that is fun, easily accessible and competitive. In your drive to make this game more skill-based you have also made it dull, predictable and elitist.
Actually in a league like this, the person with the most skill should deserve to win, and I don't blame them for wanting to, and while I really really do respect your opinion, I think you are assuming quite alot here vouching for "people" in order to make something competitive, you have to rule out options that make it less competitive, "luck" in this case is a big big part, too much luck that is usually 1-sided in most games, and you have most people complaining, it's nice to have a little luck, that creates some unexpected moments that doesn't affect the outcome of the game due to players talents, is cool, but having 1, or 2 turns, of bad luck due to a scheme setting, can ruin anywhere between 15 minutes to an hour of someones day, who wouldn't have even bothered losing if it had came down to their own fault...
Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMTeam17 has been the only scheme that kept me playing WA for longer than 2 months. It is the only scheme left that is not totally predictable. It's the fun of being faced with situations that are beyond your control and in which you must try to think of ways to gain benefit, to gain the upper hand. No T17 game is ever the same.. it's like playing chess, but instead the pieces are scattered randomly across the board. This makes for an entirely different game and no matter how you twist it: there's plenty of opportunity for good players to turn the game in their advantage.
This is correct, but I must also point out, even in competitive T17 games, you still don't really get 2 games exactly the same...
Quote from: HHC on September 09, 2010, 09:15 AMTake out the 'overpowered' weapons, the barrels, the random placements, etcetera etcetera and what you are left with is the same inate, dull chess-shit Elite got turned into in the days of ESL.
I agree, I much prefer T17 with superweapons, it's what makes it more fun
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