Uber, nope lol, you have totally misunderstood me.

I did not say use the rating from singles league, I will explain it again:

TuS Classic Clanners (seperate from Classic Singles), 2 players from a clan play a game, THEIR ratings get saved from the result of this game, for example, each player wins 40 points, their rank goes up to 1040, while the rest of the clan would stay at 1000, lets say those same 2 players, play the same scheme, against a different clan, and they win again, they would maybe win say 39 points each this time, their rank goes up to 1079 while the rest of the clan stays the same, now lets say, these 2 players, continue to play this scheme because they really enjoy it.

One has a rating of 1785 the other has a rating of 1699,the rest of the clan is around 1175, if an opposing clan wishes to get the most points from this clan for this scheme, they would have to play the members of that clan, that actually earned the points, they couldn't noob-bash their way to big points, also, if the members with around 1175 play and lose they would lose around 42-44 points, instead of a ridiculous 50-70.

If one player who has 1900 plays with a player who has 1200 and they lose against a clan who has 1200 and 1200, it would be around 48 points (i'm guessing) if the other clan won, which seems really fair for me, instead of them winning 60 and above.

Basically the concept of this idea, means fairer matches, less frustration, the less skilled but still important and loyal members of the clan can relax that they won't lose ALOT of points for the clan with more accurate points.

This still means, (for those using me and bng as their only arguement which just feels silly and biased btw lol) if I lose a BnG, we would still lose ALOT of points, but I could live with it because it was my fault and my points I lost, but for example, NvM and lalo to lose 70+ points for something they rarely play, does that honestly seem fair to you? The same goes for other players and clans, think about it.

This system to me seems logically less flawed, it's more accurate with points deserved to be won and fairer than the one we have installed at the moment.

I don't see any reason for this not to be used except from people who don't like change, and/or people who want to keep it because they like to noob-bash, and if that is the case, it shows the true colours about ALOT of people in this community.

I would play other schemes alot more if the points were fair for players not so good at that scheme.

The only problem I see with this idea, is the points that already exist, but if you think about it, the standings would be closer and more exciting perhaps even more active because people are not afraid to lose too many points to the "good clans" because there are only a select handful who actually do play any clan they can and don't come up with excuses not to play certain clans.

Again, I'm supporting this idea because maybe SPW would actually play a Roper in a clanner by this calculation.

When Flori got inactive CF had a RR rating of 1800 or something around that and to be perfectly honest it was a reason for us not to play against strong RR clans as much because we were 95% certain to lose lots of points which Flori (and Unique) earned for us. This is just another example, but with a different system we would've been able to play those stronger RR clans without having to fear losing 70+ points which means - again - more activity.

Now one might say "if a football player gets injured it's bad luck for the team, they gotta try and win without him", but this isn't football, it's Worms and noone is obligated to play anyone, we're free to choose our opponents - which is a good and a bad thing to be honest.

Of course it's got its pros and cons but I just like the idea.

QuoteAgain, I'm supporting this idea because maybe SPW would actually play a Roper in a clanner by this calculation.

Like I posted some days ago.

QuoteFor example, Random00 and me are online, and our oppenent are picking ttrr. 1. I still have to play that horrible (my opinion!) scheme and 2. because of Random's high rating at ttrr they still would win about 40 pts. Not 70 pts.,

I dont think that helps in that case with me as an example. ;d

Maybe we'll get some people in between, which could profit with that system. But in my opinion, it wont help Worms, TUS or clans at all.

Clanners are a team game, individual rating we have at singles and 2v2, that's enough for our egoism. ;d

Quote from: SPW on January 29, 2011, 09:57 PM
Clanners are a team game, individual rating we have at singles and 2v2

Its a good idea though.

Quote from: Johnny on January 29, 2011, 10:31 PM

Quote from: SPW on January 29, 2011, 09:57 PM
Clanners are a team game, individual rating we have at singles and 2v2

Its a good idea though.

Thanks for setting me up for a double quote haha.

But, it isn't singles 2v2, singles 2v2 is still individual rating for TuS Classic Singles, with this, it's still 2v2 clanners, it just balances everything out more and makes it more suitable for all skill levels and everyones needs, its a shame when a clan wants to play their favourite scheme, but choose other scheme because of the points for that game, with this system, you can play whatever and be happy because its your points so you can only blame yourself for losing, and when it's your own fault, it's easier to keep the peace with others

But Komo, what u basically say is that u want a clanner system based by individuals. A "singles" system inside the clanner system. Really the same as a 2vs2 tus single, just that it keep its own score, and that we all start with 1k in rating in each scheme. It goes beyond my belief of what a team game should be like!

Imagine the noob-bashing in the start of this then. every clan are even. every player 2. First 2 play a "noob clan" 10 matches, woho!

I get ur point, and i see what ur thinking. i Just dont share ur opinion m8!

Quote from: Uber on January 30, 2011, 04:14 AM
But Komo, what u basically say is that u want a clanner system based by individuals. A "singles" system inside the clanner system. Really the same as a 2vs2 tus single, just that it keep its own score, and that we all start with 1k in rating in each scheme. It goes beyond my belief of what a team game should be like!

Imagine the noob-bashing in the start of this then. every clan are even. every player 2. First 2 play a "noob clan" 10 matches, woho!

I get ur point, and i see what ur thinking. i Just dont share ur opinion m8!

No, that isn't it Uber, I try explain again lol:

** IF YOU ARE TOO LAZY TO DO THE MATH HERE, DO NOT REPLY **



When you play 2v2 TuS Classic Singles, it counts as 1 set of points for 2 different players, and both players have different overall score and this player can play 1v1 for HIS score alone.

When you play 2v2 TuS Clanner with my idea of points, it counts as 2 seperate points for both the clan AND the players;

Team 1 - Player A has 1000, Player B has 1000;

Team 2 - Player A has 1000, Player B has 1000;

Team 1 can gain/drop 40 points - Team 2 can gain/drop 40 points;

Team 1 win;

Team 1 wins 40 points for making their Team score 1040, Player A gains 40 points and Player B gains 40 points, making Player A 1040 and player B 1040;

Team 2 lose and drop 40 points making their Team score 960, Player A drops 40 points and Player B drops 40 points making Player A 960 and player B 960;

Team 1 Player C and Player D, both having a score of 1000, and their Team has 1040;

Team 2 Player C and Player D. both having a score of 1000, and their Team has 960;

Team 1 win, their Team wins 38, Each player gains 38;

Team 2 lose, their Team drops 38, Each player drops 38;

So Team 1, both players A and B have 1040, and players C and D have 1038, Team 1 has a score of 1078;

Team 2, both players A and B have 960, and players C and D have 962, Team 2 has a score of 922.

Do you see where this is going, imagine the players from A to D winning losing games with different partners and take note of the results in the future, but give each player a Win ratio for example A: 90% B: 80% C: 50% D: 70% and do the same for the other Team.

Judging by their "skill level" give a fair % of wins and loses for each team and each player in relation to their win percentage, it works out extremely fair for both the players and the teams.

Not only does this seem like a fairer and more accurate system, it also actually makes each individuals part in playing clanners important, while keeping being a clan as a whole just as equally important

u know u just wrote down what i meant,do you? :p thats exactly how 2vs2 singles work, altho here the clan also gets the score added 2 it rating!

The points u earn from winning games is calculated from the SINGLE players, not the overall at all, so its just what i said!

PLAYER A AND B earns 2000 points in ttrr. THen comes C and D and plays ttrr vs a clan with 0 matches so far. 40 poitns for both. Cause its the individual score. So its 2vs2 singles only in a different setting ,cause every player starts with 1000 points + the clan gets the scores added 2 their overall in the scheme..

U take the average points of the 2 players and combine them, just like in 2vs2 singles. BOTH players lose the same/win the same. If not how u gonna find 1 (ONE)  set off points 2 win/lose for the clan.. ?

p.s Btw if we do this u know all clans gotta reset their ratings and overall in every scheme.. Some which taken "years" 2 build up. Sorry mac, still dont have me on this one! g`nite!

Quote from: Uber on January 30, 2011, 07:37 AMthats exactly how 2vs2 singles work, altho here the clan also gets the score added 2 it rating!

This is the most important part that makes it completely different from 1v1 Singles.

While 1 player goes from 969 to 990 and the other player goes from 1606 to 1627, the clan as a whole would go from 1179 to 1200 - This is the most important part, you can blindly argue all you want suggesting it's based more on individual status, but EVERY Single game is at least a 2-man(man/woman) Team effort risking the official points of the Clan, as no one will get to see the individuals points, in the analyzer you should only see the analyzed points for 2 different members.

TuS Singles - You play for yourself.
TuS Clanners - You play for your Team.

What you don't mention in your calculations is that the clan rating is determined by the average of all players, regardless of how often a player plays a certain scheme in clanners. And this (to me, at least) does not show how good a clan is at a certain scheme.
cFc for instance benefits highly from your BnG skills, especially considering you play it a lot, but let's simplify what happens if we go through with this.

cFc (as it is now): 1959
Komo: 2455
lalo: 1213
Oky: 1040
daina: 1325
oldsock: 1160
Auto: 1200
Bofo: 1200
carlOx: 1200
Djflow: 1200
Leroy: 1200
msgoff: 1200
NvM: 1200
ownless: 1200
ropa: 1200
shui: 1200
average: 1280

ps: 1168
Rocket: 1241
alcoholico: 970
guaton: 1342
Camperz: 1279
Artharas: 1200
ch4os: 1200
Dulek: 1200
Guaton: 1200
knightz: 1200
LionHeart: 1200
skunk3: 1200
Uber: 1200
average: 1202

The difference in rating all of a sudden drops tremendously and ps gets a new rating approximately the same as a completely new clan.

Yeah, the games are 2v2, but the players are usually picked according to their strengths

Quote from: DarkOne on January 30, 2011, 10:21 AM
Yeah, the games are 2v2, but the players are usually picked according to their strengths

They still will be, when an opponent has their strong players on, at least this way, the "weaker" members can still play against other clans "weaker" members for good points.

And where did you get thos statistics?

I don't have 2455 lol

daina is in the lead with like 5555 or something.


And seeing as the standings as they are now, are the way they are now because of how people have used the current system, i'd personally keep all that, and put the new system in place, the points will average out soon enough.

Quote from: Komito on January 30, 2011, 10:53 AM
And where did you get thos statistics?

https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/classic-stats/BnG-stats/?sort=clan-up-1-singles&s=18

Just noticed something went wrong with the clan ratings, so I fixed that.

Quote from: DarkOne on January 30, 2011, 11:06 AM

Quote from: Komito on January 30, 2011, 10:53 AM
And where did you get thos statistics?

https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/classic-stats/BnG-stats/?sort=clan-up-1-singles&s=18

Just noticed something went wrong with the clan ratings, so I fixed that.

What am I looking at? That link put me to Singles BnG Standings for Season 18.

And if your example is showing my BnG standings for singles which is 2455 which would be correct, what does that have to do with Clanners? There is no way we would ever reach this score in Clanners because it is much more difficult to win 2v2 BnGs, other players and even myself would lose way more games than my Classic Singles BnG rating, so i'd say that is a bad example.

i always thought the clanner system worked like this, because when u are using the analyzer for clanners, it also asks ur partner and the opponent team's members

Quote from: Husk on January 30, 2011, 12:25 PM
i always thought the clanner system worked like this, because when u are using the analyzer for clanners, it also asks ur partner and the opponent team's members

Yeah but you don't need to put the other member names in, you can leave that part blank.

We only have names there so we can report the games with the correct members and have the statistics there I guess, it's interesting to know who has played who n what not.

But no, it's Clan scheme rating Vs Clan scheme rating, the individual players skills and efforts are not taken into considertation (which is a shame lol).