Challenges
May 04, 2024, 09:57 PM

NdSC #42

Challenge #892, Viewed 1467 Time(s)

Basic Information
Rate challenge
5 / 5
Total Members Voted: 3
Name: NdSC #42
Type: Misc
Moderator: Turkey Triad

Started: April 21, 2024, 10:08 AM
Expire time: April 28, 2024, 10:30 AM

EXPIRED
You can still submit your time. But you won't recieve the 4 points as it is not the current challenge anymore.

Challenge maps:
Scheme File(s): scheme Darts

Description:
Welcome to new dS challenge #42 hosted by




Get the highest score with 1 team of 8 worms.

If you're not sure about general rules and gameplay of darts, click here, there's also a description of how to score spiked and rebounded worms.



Special Rules for this map:

Teleport your worms to start. Then:
  • Attach rope to wall to the left.
  • Rattle your worm between walls next to start and fly to lower right wall.
  • Use first bounce to fly to upper left wall.
  • Again, use first bounce, and fly to upper right wall.
  • Swoosh to the target on your first bounce.

Gif Demo:




Maximum possible score: 120



NdSC List & Ladder: https://www.tus-wa.com/forums/ds-ds-challenges/ndsc-list-ladder-27138/



Gl, hf, and may the darts be with you!
Name: Horror by XanKriegor
Best Record: 117 by TheKomodo
Pending times: 0
Number of members participated: 4
Number of Records: 9

Download Map:
Downloaded 379 time(s)
Recorded Country Player Recorded Groups Record Replay Map Points Posted Overall Points Overall Rate Info
1st United Kingdom TheKomodo ICB a2a dS 117pts
p:00:11
20 April 24, 2024, 06:30 PM 1,727 Fairly Competent
2nd Ukraine Shtaket ICB tr rrX 111pts
p:00:00
15 April 22, 2024, 08:53 PM 6,076 Elite
2nd Turkey Triad UC dS AbC 111pts
p:0:00
15 April 24, 2024, 04:55 PM 2,582 Elite
3rd Russian Federation kirill470 24pts
p:00:00
10 April 21, 2024, 10:24 AM 2,312 Field Marshall

Statistics of this challenge

Points Overall Points Overall Rate
United Kingdom TheKomodo 25 1,727
Turkey Triad 20 2,582
Ukraine Shtaket 20 6,076
Russian Federation kirill470 15 2,312

Author Topic: Challenge #892, NdSC #42  (Read 1604 times)

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Offline TheKomodo

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2024, 05:11 PM »
This is the best way to explain it:

Swoosh:

When doing a swoosh, the flagpole extension on the last visible normal speed frame must be over and past the vertical point of the direction you're travelling, as well as the rope must shoot in the same direction.

Arch/Mexi:

When doing an arch or a mexi, the flagpole extension on the last visible normal speed frame must be before and not past the vertical point of the direction you're travelling, as well as the rope must shoot in the same direction.

Mexican Swoosh:

When doing a mexican swoosh, the flagpole extension on the last visible normal speed frame must be before and not past the vertical point of the direction you're travelling, but the rope must shoot in the same direction as the direction you're travelling. Note, this is only possible for ONE frame at the very precipice of the flagpole extension.

For all 3, subpixels or slow motion does not count, just frame by frame using normal game speed.

Edit - Triad calls the Mexican Swoosh "The Jackpot Frame" lmao, I like it, it's true, it's actually stupidly but interestingly difficult to pull this off without going HORRIBLY slow!

I've been chatting with Triad on Discord and it seems this is what we're going to be using as standard for Darts from now on.

We are however going to allow both the swoosh and mexican swoosh for swoosh for Darts and Darts challenges in general.

Online Triad

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2024, 05:18 PM »
Yeah, I am in favor of counting Mexican Swooshes valid for both Swoosh and Arch variations of Darts maps. :)



Offline TheKomodo

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2024, 05:19 PM »
This is why I absolutely LOVE getting into friendly forum confrontations with people!

You find out cool shit like this all the time!

Just discovered a new rope move, after so many years, not every day you get that!

Offline Danger135

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Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #33 on: April 24, 2024, 08:10 AM »
Blééé it all!
123  My teams use this, this, and this soundbanks.

Online Triad

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #34 on: April 24, 2024, 08:38 AM »
Will you send a run Dangerovic ;D



Offline Masta

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #35 on: April 24, 2024, 09:57 AM »
If anything though, I'm glad we've had this little discussion because we've actually discovered a new move, the mexican swoosh! That's the most exciting thing I got from this entire escapade!
Yes that's funny, as I've said that totally could be its own trick. I hope you take this away from the discussion too: you need to do testing before making claims. Even if you think you're 100% sure there may be a small detail about how the game works that you have forgotten. Be careful not to state your opinions as facts when it's critical that your own opinions don't come through as facts. That way when someone is asking for advice they can make their own informed decision.

If you want this to change, then tell Deadcode to make the frames properly visible
There's no technical reason for why there must be a 1 frame delay on the rope release in the first place, at least that I can think of. It should be possible keep track of a few variables and apply those variables on the frame the rope is actually released. That would make the ninja rope more responsive, fun and intuitive.

Offline Masta

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #36 on: April 24, 2024, 11:47 AM »
This is why I absolutely LOVE getting into friendly forum confrontations with people!

You find out cool shit like this all the time!

Just discovered a new rope move, after so many years, not every day you get that!
I do recognize this trick as its own thing. For me it's more about the trick being executed on the first possible frame than how it looks. If a trick recognition system is ever implemented I think it would be cool if tricks that are executed on the first possible frame had some sort of distinction. It could have a different text color or be described as "Perfect", "Perfect Swoosh" for example. Other tricks could have a "Perfect" variant as well. For shadows it would be when the rope is only visible for one frame on the tap and for outlaws and spikes it would be when the rope is released on the first frame you bounce off a surface. Many other tricks may have a "Perfect" variant as well.

Online Triad

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #37 on: April 24, 2024, 12:49 PM »
If a trick recognition system is ever implemented I think it would be cool if tricks that are executed on the first possible frame had some sort of distinction. It could have a different text color or be described as "Perfect", "Perfect Swoosh" for example. Other tricks could have a "Perfect" variant as well. For shadows it would be when the rope is only visible for one frame on the tap and for outlaws and spikes it would be when the rope is released on the first frame you bounce off a surface. Many other tricks may have a "Perfect" variant as well.
A trick detection system would be really awesome. Imagine being able to play competitive warmers, basically something like Tony Hawk but for roping.



Offline TheKomodo

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #38 on: April 24, 2024, 02:23 PM »
I hope you take this away from the discussion too: you need to do testing before making claims. Even if you think you're 100% sure there may be a small detail about how the game works that you have forgotten. Be careful not to state your opinions as facts when it's critical that your own opinions don't come through as facts. That way when someone is asking for advice they can make their own informed decision.

Not sure what you think you achieved here but the same advice applies to you lol.

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #39 on: April 24, 2024, 03:51 PM »
did I do so much? I won't do this again.

Online Triad

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #40 on: April 24, 2024, 04:21 PM »
did I do so much? I won't do this again.
You mean your challenge record? 111 is really good, but not unbeatable. Not sure if I can beat it before the challenge ends.



Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #41 on: April 24, 2024, 04:31 PM »
did I do so much? I won't do this again.
You mean your challenge record? 111 is really good, but not unbeatable. Not sure if I can beat it before the challenge ends.
I meant conversation. For example, I don’t care what method I used to get to 15

Online Triad

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #42 on: April 24, 2024, 04:55 PM »
I meant conversation. For example, I don’t care what method I used to get to 15
Oh, it's just W:A nerds (me included) nerding out about tiny details, mostly. ;D Don't worry about it. All your runs are fine, no void shots.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2024, 04:58 PM by Triad »



Offline TheKomodo

Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #43 on: April 24, 2024, 05:08 PM »
did I do so much? I won't do this again.
You mean your challenge record? 111 is really good, but not unbeatable. Not sure if I can beat it before the challenge ends.
I meant conversation. For example, I don’t care what method I used to get to 15

Well, as long as it's what we consider to be either a swoosh or a mexican swoosh then it's fine.

The good thing is, we know absolutely how to judge it efficiently now.



The difference between Masta and I seems to be the way in which we measure the validity of a move. He said and I quote - "For me it's more about the trick being executed on the first possible frame than how it looks" which means he counts the missing frames that you cannot see normally. I highly doubt anybody even knew this was possible before replays and TA was available.

On the other hand I measure every move based on what you see with the normal frame by frame replay, and if replays weren't available, you'd record it and slow it down showing effectively the same thing. Instead of using TA to show "what we actually meant to happen but doesn't actually happen unless you use THIS specific replay feature to analyze it".

Speaking about those missing frames... They don't exist naturally do they? Those were added to the game via "tweening" weren't they? If this is the case then it's even stronger support to why I don't consider the move that Shtaket did a genuine swoosh. We don't measure moves by the direction the rope shoots only, we also measure them with what we see, the position we're in as we do them etc.

It's actually weird to me why the game was designed like this now, like, why not just show the LAST part of the frame instead of the first as it's being executed? Anyway I'm sure there's a reason for it. If that's the way it really is, then why not just show it like that? Though, that would take away this frame perfect new move we discovered lol.

Regardless of which way you record, it's interesting that in 25 years of playing this game, I've never seen that before!

Offline Danger135

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Re: Challenge #892, NdSC #42
« Reply #44 on: April 24, 2024, 08:34 PM »
Not sure if this is trick race or darts.
123  My teams use this, this, and this soundbanks.