Simple new rule update.

[lalo]

MI, we assume big maps are allowed. We're just asking to create a rule where a big map is not a surprise, to make the host to tell us. That's really simple to do! Isn't it? Not everybody will be paying close attention if a map looks weird on the thumbnail, personally I just light up without seeing the map too much since I never had to play big maps in a league game until now.
Can't believe it can be so hard to let people know if a map is big or not before the game starts. We're not asking you to cure cancer.

[daiNa]

I think this topic wont get anywhere since mods have a different vision of classic league and classic schemes from where i started begginers werent hosting big maps on leagues but i guess its fine if tus wanna allowed this nothing we can do

[MonkeyIsland]

We'll probably change the rules. Because of "the Albino case". It shows that a big map can appear as normal without any warning.

MI, we assume big maps are allowed. We're just asking to create a rule where a big map is not a surprise, to make the host to tell us. That's really simple to do! Isn't it? Not everybody will be paying close attention if a map looks weird on the thumbnail, personally I just light up without seeing the map too much since I never had to play big maps in a league game until now.
Can't believe it can be so hard to let people know if a map is big or not before the game starts. We're not asking you to cure cancer.

Yea I know what you're asking. My side is not that different from you. You say why is it a big deal for the host to inform? I was saying why is it a big deal to look at the thumbnail?

personally I just light up without seeing the map too much since I never had to play big maps in a league game until now.

You should be paying more attention to the thumbnail. You're playing a league, it won't hurt to pay more attention in the lobby. In fact, at least it saves you time. (going into the game, then realizing the size and rematching)


@RIP,
You're not contributing anything to this topic. Please stop posting similar messages.

[RIP]

Ok MI, but I think you also tired read and respond on him messages.
I do not mind if I will be obliged to talk in the lobby when I choose a bigger map.

[Triad]

Yes, it is easy to create a low sized big map with 80:29 ratio if you use drastically less colors on your map. For example, maybe not a big map but stilstill Shiny Stuff darts map had 12 or 16 colors in total. 'cause of that it's only 8.62kb

https://www.tus-wa.com/maps/map-10813/

Similiar thing should be doable for bigger maps.

[avirex]

MI, you missed the entire point, your so stuck on those past games, that you won't look to the future for YOUR league.

The rules need to be clear to everyone, not just the couple people here that have already been tricked (yes, we will most likely be more aware of thumbnail) but what about future players, old schoolers that will return, or just people that don't read tus forums, but still play tus?

You can tell me until your blue in the face, that I should have looked at thumb nail. but the fact of the matter is, why would I be watching out for something I never knew was allowed in the first place?

****newsflash***** the rule should be made for any unsuspecting people in the future, and other schemes rules should be made clear if big maps are accepted in those too.

To answer your question, the fact that this league is using MI games as references for rules, then expected me to know the rules.... rather than updating the rule book... yes, it kind of offends me.

Anyway... I'm glad your FINALLY seeing that the rule that when a host makes a big map, he should simply tell everyone is a big map "because of the albino case". Maybe you should consider saying somewhere in the rules what schemes can be played with big maps?

Or shall we just wait to see if a bunch of noobs start playing roper on big maps next year? If there is ever at any time tus games reported with big map in a scheme, that either no one complained, or flew under the radar... that will tell us what's legal now, and in the future.

OK... please, lock this thread... you have FINALLY realized maybe the one rule needs to be changed due "to the albino case" but your not going to see things differently on anything else, because your far too stubborn to take any advice from avirex.

I can't resist not posting to tell you how much of a dumb ads I think your being.. this thread is my rough guy kryptonite MI .  Please....lock... thread...

[Tomi]

The only solution for this is what i already posted. Set map size warning to 0 (always warn) and it will always display the map size. However its not really convenient because you always need to click on the thumbnail, BUT that ways it is ensured that you checked the map size.

[Peja]

The only solution for this is what i already posted. Set map size warning to 0 (always warn) and it will always display the map size. However its not really convenient because you always need to click on the thumbnail, BUT that ways it is ensured that you checked the map size.

doing 1 click looks more convenient to me than checking thumbnails though.

[TheWalrus]

The only solution for this is what i already posted. Set map size warning to 0 (always warn) and it will always display the map size. However its not really convenient because you always need to click on the thumbnail, BUT that ways it is ensured that you checked the map size.

doing 1 click looks more convenient to me than checking thumbnails though.

this

[XanKriegor]

Can someone write a module to display map size w/o need to do any clicks?)))

[MonkeyIsland]

avirex, I haven't "FINALLY" realized your point of view. I'm aware of it. I believe it must be the player's responsibility to notice. The "host's responsibility" idea allows the player to be careless. It is a league game, both parties should pay close attention to what they're agreeing to and that includes 5 seconds thumbnail observation. The albino case, says it is possible for a big map to have a normal-looking thumbnail. While it is theoretically possible, but the odds of that happening is almost zero and we haven't had one single case of it in 8 years of TUS.

Furthermore, big maps for shopper/wxw has been used on TUS several times. That is not a new thing for TUS, only new to you. They didn't flew under the radar, they flew under YOUR radar.

Anyway I'm not gonna continue this debate, I've already wasted enough time on it. We're working on the rules.

[avirex]

of course it flew under my rader, considering big maps make up less then 1% of TUS games...


its really shocking that you wasted this much time debating this... and under no circumstance will you change your mind.

its such a far stretch to imagine that the host should give a simple reminder that he is going to host something that only occurs in 1% of all tus games?? lmfao

i do agree, that we should all pay attention in the lobby.... but "close attention" come on man... you never went and took a piss, or grabbed a drink, or smoked a cigg, or jacked your little dick during lobby???    its not like im saying that the host should describe each and every map style before each game..... 

im asking that the host gives a friendly reminder he is going to host a style game that has came up less then 1% of TUS history...

anyway, nothing i say, or anyone else will change your mind, you made your mind up from OP.

lock the thread already dude? why keep it open? do i entertain you??

anyway, congratulation on finally deciding the rules need some work..

can i give you a friendly tip?? you should update the rules as the complaints come in... when complaints come in, and you can not find a clear rule about it, you then make an update.

i mean, i will not claim to be an expert on this topic, but i would think thats a better idea then basing complaints off MI replays, and quotes... just sayin'

should rly lock the thread though, because im too stubborn not to respond to you.

[HHC]

I think about 10% of the shoppers I played was on bigger maps, it's fairly common avi.

I always considered the 'lightning up = agreeing to map'-rule a necessary evil. It can lead to messed up situations where the map is obviously flawed and the host persists in playing on. But the alternative is probably worse: either you scratch the rule and wait for ppl to sent in hundreds of complaints about ppl whining about the map in-game and quitting; or you make the rule as you say: that you are obliged to mention any significant alterations as the host.
Personally I wouldn't count bigger maps in shoppers and the like as a real deal-breaker (it's not in anyone's advantage? maybe just in wxw where it makes the map a lot harder, but wxw's are never played like this?); and the fact that the host must mention it.. I dunno, it feels like an extra step that ppl are gonna forget about it or feel that it's a nuissance (when playing good friends I find it pretty embarassing to ask them to check the scheme.. or map.., it's a matter of trust). So yeah I can see this rule implemented and then ppl not mentioning it in 95% of their games without prob. And then one day you come across an asshole who can't stand losing and finds a way to get out of a fair-and-square loss by pointing to this little text of rule; that was really just there to serve a guy who once upon a time came across an unexpected situation. It's not worth it in my opinion.

[avirex]

Do you honestly think that it's 10% hhc ?

I don't... I'm sure there has been well over 5000 shoppas played, and I would bet less then100 have been big maps.

Hhc, the rule would protect people on the case they start the game, and then realise its a big map, and want to rh, they would have that option... it would obviously not be justified to finish the game and never even mention a problem with the nap until you lose...

Also, you saying that there is no advantage in big map shoppe means you did not put much thought into it before saying that, and you also didn't read this thread.. (which I can't say I blame you)

In big maps, when you roping /dropping downward, the screen moves in a way I'm not used to, your worm can even fall faster then the screen keeps up. So if your not used to that, your at a disadvantage.

Also, there's some key combo, all + home? That will make the screen center, but in my experience it was very strange, and made me dizzy because it just bounced around so much with my every movement... not to mention in that specific shoppe, I didn't know what key combo it was too activate center camera... off you can say that's my fault I didn't know, and I'll agree to that... but who's fault is it that I didn't even have a clue big maps were played in Tus classic, so I had no reason to want to know... Not my fault I didn't know.. unless someone wants to come and tell me I should have been more knowledgeable about MI's past games/quotes.

Another disadvantage I can think of off the top of my head is how hard the crates are too find, and remember the path to get to them.... but some people have the crates finder patch, which I don't have or even know how to get... you can tell me it's my fault I don't have it sure.. but it's never been needed in classic Tus on the past.

Anyway, needless to say I don't agree with anything in your post. But np

This thread is useless anyway, MI is stuck in his ways.

[MonkeyIsland]

Over 700 big shopper maps, out of ~ 9000.  7,77% big maps.

First TUS shopper on big map is this:
https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/game-15172/