Lol guys, what are u talking about? Since when roper is based on established spots to be used for hiding? Should we then use pre-defined spots for teleporting in T17?   Luspastic just did the job, and Free is complaining about the parallel universe. "yea dont ask me to tus in the future, i dont respect this", really dude ?!?! Fair play is about skipping your turn when your opponent fails after 1second in a bigRR, even if it is a tus game. It is not about making the opponent's life easier by teleporting yourself in a good position for being attacked.

Yes it has been like that. But it is still a league game. The main objective is to be your best and win the game.

Thats why ELITE > ROPER

 

For me this is a similar case to "telecow", "rotation manipulation" in Hysteria.

For me this is a similar case to "telecow", "rotation manipulation" in Hysteria.

Why is that similar? The argument against hiding on top versus "telecow" is vastly different.

People use telecow to get back into a game that they are behind in, without the ability to pile, Hysteria is RNG based and for lesser skilled players who value balanced competition. Players hide on top in Roper when they are ahead to maintain their lead.

That's completely different.

Players are just pissed in Roper because it means they have even less chance to come back after a mistake or tough crate.

Roper is a stupid scheme anyway, it's so ridiculous luck based it feels pointless to me now.

I’ll go to the top if opponent is less than 100 hp for final turns.  I can see both viewpoints, but ultimately everyone will leverage the rules.  I used to not throw rollers in bng, and typically will not unless opponent does, but following a set of moral rules when opponent does not puts you at a disadvantage.  I don’t think lupa did anything wrong, but you are fully in the right to not play with him if you don’t like his definition of fair play.

For me this is a similar case to "telecow", "rotation manipulation" in Hysteria.

If one thinks telecow and rotation manipulation is "cheap", than they have little to no understanding about how the scheme is balanced.  Hysteria is one of the best balanced schemes in the league pool today, way more so than roper, team17, aerial, ect.  Telecow and rotation manipulation exist to even out the advantages presented by good/bad random placements at the start.  I can't remember the last time someone complained about losing a hysteria because of their initial worm placements were terrible.  If everyone played with the ridiculous 'no telecow', 'no rotation manipulation' rules, many games would be won/lost solely because of initial worms placements.

Team17 has always traditionally been the scheme with the greatest win/loss variance, someone ran the numbers a while back to actually put substance behind it.  The top team17 players have the lowest winrate versus their competitors of any classic league scheme on TUS.  Part of this is crates, but an even larger part of it is the random worm placements.  Random worm placements introduce a huge luck factor that imbalances the scheme as it pertains to fairness.  Again, the tactics in hysteria, whether people like them or not, balance the playing field in any given game, and reduce overall variance.

Why is that similar? The argument against hiding on top versus "telecow" is vastly different.

Yes, each case is a different situation. The hiding on top on Roper tactic has a snowball effect that for many players makes the scheme boring or less fair. In Hysteria, the "worm rotation manipulation" tactic brings balance to the scheme and deal well with start positions. However, some people prefer to play hysteria focused more on the artillery aspect only, forgetting the conventional gameplay roots it has. Just the way BnG rules were created. The tactic of direct shots and sitting nades were considered less fun, or cheap attacks at the point that some players decided to officially create a new rule that later became standard to the scheme.

These are the things that these tactics have in common: they are not apreciated by many players, leading them to create a new sportsmanship behavior, that may or not become new rules that turn the scheme itself into a new variation. The problem is that some rules are subjective and hard to implement in an effective and easy way to people understand and follow it in a mutual agreement.

The best rules exist to fix a "problem" of the scheme, or at least to fix something that makes the scheme boring, repetitive, unfair, snowballing or less fun to play. The rule in these situations is something natural and not created out of the blue by the author of the scheme.

For example, when SIBASA and I created Spawn for Weapons, we were playing only with the main rule intrinsic to the scheme idea that is about only using a weapon if it is the one where the health crate spawned. The gameplay was not so fun playing only with this rule, so we felt the necessity of adding an extra rule, this one: "It is forbidden to attack with the same weapon that was last used by the enemy before your move.". This made the gameplay much better, and way more fun.

The Plop War rule was created similarly too.

The Team17 rule that you cannot rope knock worms is now a scheme feature, but I never understood well the reasons of this rule.

Anyway, I think the Roper rule forbidding players to hide on top should be official as a scheme variation that might be the pattern as the BnG rules are now. Or maybe they will be like Hysteria and Hysteria with no "telecow/jetcow", or Selecsteria, that half players like worm rotation manipulation and half don't like.