barman and his bng skillz

[Rok]

Personally speaking, who gives a f@#!, this game is by far too f@#!ed up to save now anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fox_and_the_Grapes

[Xrayez]

I find no fun in BnG when notching  Almost always rely on intuition stuff

[Fcrate]

imho, if you get THAT competitive, then you have a problem.

[TheKomodo]

lol dude, even people who don't like you, admit your BnG skills. That was just a funny demonstration to show how any "aid" would look like in real world competition.

Yeah, sorry, just seems you are putting me in the same boat as the other stuff talked about in this thread lol...

And Rok, sorry, I was referring to just BnG, it's past help, it's completely f@#!ed, all the fun and innocence has been sucked dry, it can only be enjoyed in the company of people you can trust I guess.

[avirex]

nvm- originally said lets remove bng from classic, but i dont truly believe that...

[Peja]

its just a shame how many people blame barman for something he doesnt even do lol. he has no marks on his monitor, he doesnt have a list of notches on his desk, he doesnt even use a ruler for kamikaze like many others do.
he is guilty putting a f@#!ing huge effort into understanding the mechanics of this game though. thats something which 99% of our community will never do on such a level. people should appreciate that (and i know many do), but some are just whiny jealous fools who are too lazy showing the same effort.

about the visual aid topic itself: its just a big drama with no sense. you cant prove it but its forbidden. why should we allow it? to take away the guilty conscience of people using it although they know its against the rules?  if people want to abuse it noone can do anything against it, why do we even discuss? so lets move on and close this topic because it is nothing more than a desperate try to get attention from someone who cant stand the fact he will never reach barmans level. this whole topic was created because a person from chile found out its better for his ego to accuse a better player to use cheats than realizing he is just too lazy/dumb to reach this level.

[Prankster]

I didn't know visual aids were banned, thought everyone used them who wanted to learn notching.
Anyway, had a long conversation with KRD, and got to the conclusion that it's better to have a rule against them than not. Probably there will still be players who use aids to win some points, but their motivation would hopefully end soon after reachig their goal (playing the system to get points), so they would cause less damage to the game/community than if aids were allowed and legal.

[Kaleu]

Removing  BnG from classic may ease this stuff.

[Peja]

i really wonder where all these bad bad unfair notchers hide lol. go look the leaguestats take the last 3 seasons and watch the bng top 10. you almost cant find them. since anubis tutorial it is basicly public, still i can only recall 1 player who really went into it and he doesnt even playing leagues atm. some guys make it sound like they get notched to death every day they start wa. im quite active since some years and the only one ever notched the shit out of me was barman. and tbh somehow it was f@#!ing cool. its f@#!ing 2013, we play an over 10 years old artillery based game. when i play competetive against the best players around i expect to get my ass kicked. in fact its a shame theres only a handful people who are able to hit you anywhere they want considering the age of the game. i cant care less about how people try to master a scheme. and once again everything is public, still theres no huge wave of players suddenly notching out of nothing (although komo believes it lol) and the reason is simple. it just takes effort to master it, ask avirex. he is oldschool as f@#!, quite a decent bng player when he wants to, and he has the perfect guide in dt forums. he already put some time into it, but do you see him owning every game?  i just can laugh about people suggesting to remove the most classic scheme from classic league because some people think others have an unfair advantage by using a technique everyone is free to learn.

[Aerox]

the most classic scheme

wut

because some people think others have an unfair advantage by using a technique everyone is free to learn.

also free

[Peja]

the most classic scheme

wut

oh please ropa try to tell me worms is not artillery based, and please try to tell me bng is not pure artillery.

[Aerox]

oh please ropa try to tell me worms is not artillery based, and please try to tell me bng is not pure artillery.

Artillery mode is a gimmick put in by an on/off option that wasn't even present in Worms 1.

In addition to that, the classic* Bng scheme is nothing like current Bng.

Knowing all that, claiming Bng is the most classic of shcemes is questionable, hence my questioning.

*unanchored bounce'n'toss fest. Those things started to be seen as cheap and the scheme quickly molded into what we have today; ironically favoring a new type of cheaps.


edit: I wonder how the fans of papers would feel if the game incorporated a gunbound-like angle&ruler type of measuring mechanism that makes the aiming trivial. They should feel totally democratic about it.

[Peja]

i never talked about the artillery mode, i talked about the origin of the worms series which goes back to artillery developed by Mike Forman in the year 1976. and now guess which scheme of the current tus classic league comes close to this game.

[TheKomodo]

peja, there are alot of players who notch/know distances but simple shots like 4s FP and 5s lg, low winds, and that's it.

Almost every shot that is a direct hit is notchable, LG zooks, floorbanks, trapshots, transfers, banks(roughly), this is the only difference between barman and the rest, at least barman bothered to learn the cool shots.

As I have said before, I learned how to notch 4s nades from m3ntal when I 1st met him, I learned everything else myself without any visual aids whatsoever, all my notches were just roughly guessed by which I mean I never actually knew exactly what pixel a grenade would bounce, apparently, barman did, no one can notch the trick shots I used to do, only person i've seen at my level for trick shots is lacoste, but ever since I left b2b, I stopped playing trick BnG's, to be quite honest that's the worst experience for me ever on WA, I really miss b2b's Thursday night Tournaments n stuff...

1st Tournament I entered I missed 3 shots the entire Tournament, I remember beating franz in 5 shots and he couldn't believe it, shortly after KRD convinced me notching was lame, I stopped notching in BnGs ever since, I started notching again last year against other notchers and players who play "lame" but I still to this day mirror my opponents fairness in BnG, I discuss notching with barman during BnG's, but not because we do it, just because we understand each others intentions in this way...

My only concern with notching, is not everyone wants to learn it, if everyone wanted to learn it, I would be totally fine with it, I would encourage it, and go out my way to provide an easy to read tuturial, but it's a ridiculous advantage over anyone who plays fair and instinctual, especially at the level myself/barman/mablak/darKz/anubis could do it, no one has a chance to beat us, it's just really really unfair...

[Prankster]

BnG is pure artillery, but artillery is not the privilege of BnG.

Also no matter how much those notchers are, because (a): we're talking about the visual aids; (b): one (counter)example is perfectly enough for a need of a rule.
This topic isn't against barman, Peja (despite how much Devilage wanted that). I admire the effort he put into studying distances and notches and whatnot. I, on the other hand, have no idea if he used his aids in league games, but I don't care either. Hey, a preventive rule is even better!