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September 27, 2020, 05:10 PM

Poll

More active on WA when 3.8 comes?

Absolutely!
13 (32.5%)
I guess I will have a look and play a few games, but after I will go back to whatever I was doing before.
6 (15%)
WA is dead/dying it doesn't matter what they bring to it.
7 (17.5%)
Maybe.
14 (35%)

Total Members Voted: 40

Author Topic: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?  (Read 2296 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline StepS

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #30 on: June 21, 2020, 12:28 PM »
inb4 oldschoolers boycot 3.8 because the rope doesn't feel the same anymore
That would actually be surprising because the new rendering also decreases input lag.
Dec 30 2013 23:59:44 <StepS> windowed mode isn't the only thing you need about frontend
Dec 30 2013 23:59:49 <StepS> you need it to be actually bigger
Dec 31 2013 00:00:13 <StepS> it actually is very small on my 15-inch full HD screen
Dec 31 2013 00:00:25 <StepS> while running at 640x480 or stretched mode makes it fuzzy
Dec 31 2013 00:00:44 <StepS> this problem has been around since the Worms Armageddon's release and no one has even tried to beat it
[...]

Offline TheWalrus

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #31 on: June 22, 2020, 07:03 AM »
Well sorry to disappoint but I'm bored to tears of this game. And 3.8 doesn't bring anything that would revive my interest at this point. I appreciate devs work though.
I think most of the experienced players feel that way.  We always played for fun and for the competition, there was never a single worms professional or esports footprint though, and when the competition went away, so does the desire to get better and play more.

I still play here and there for fun, but its been 20 years on and off, thousands of games, and few new gameplay mechanics, coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase. 

There was a window to invigorate the 2d worms fanatics but it seems like it has passed.  Deadcode and Cyber have more than done their part many times over even if they and the other maintainers never release 3.8.  The game has enjoyed several great incarnations of activity.  We are in the twilight, and that is just fine with me. 

Offline readyworm

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #32 on: June 22, 2020, 10:35 AM »
It's been interesting reading these comments.  I've loved Worms since the demo appeared on a copy of Amiga Format and I've watched Team17 progress the franchise over the years.  Despite the time that's passed, I keep coming back to Worms Armageddon.  It's a true classic.  Not just in terms of the principles of the game, but in its execution.  Team17 hasn't matched it since.  Its old school 'pixel precision' graphics only adds to it.  Hats off to Karl Morton and the team.

We have to be very thankful that Deadcode and Cybershadow are continuing to improve this classic, and that they have the source code in the first place. You only have to view the change log to see the attention to detail and the work that's gone into it. 

I think 3.8 will make existing users more active, at least to see the differences particularly around the new scheme perhaps different styles of game may appear.

To attract more players and grow the community I think integrating ranks and competitive play is key.  A missions editor and a Missions multiplayer channel would also be a fantastic addition. I appreciate both of these are not trivial to implement.

I know some people talk about version 4 which to me sounds like a very ambitious rewrite.  Personally I'd like the focus to be on the above and perhaps trying to move from a paletted display to true colour.

Offline Kradie

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #33 on: June 22, 2020, 11:44 AM »
Well sorry to disappoint but I'm bored to tears of this game. And 3.8 doesn't bring anything that would revive my interest at this point. I appreciate devs work though.
I think most of the experienced players feel that way.  We always played for fun and for the competition, there was never a single worms professional or esports footprint though, and when the competition went away, so does the desire to get better and play more.

I still play here and there for fun, but its been 20 years on and off, thousands of games, and few new gameplay mechanics, coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase. 

There was a window to invigorate the 2d worms fanatics but it seems like it has passed.  Deadcode and Cyber have more than done their part many times over even if they and the other maintainers never release 3.8.  The game has enjoyed several great incarnations of activity.  We are in the twilight, and that is just fine with me.
The league is only enjoyed by a few die hard competitive people. This alone doesn't make WA dead. AG is still filled with new and old regulars myself included. I still play cups, and tournament here and there, but even if they aren't as active as I hoped they would be, don't make WA dead.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but I think that's a bit disrespectful to Deadcode & team. This hardcore playerbase you speak of, is merely present, and even the developers would ''focus on the hardcore's needs'' I think it wouldn't ameliorate anything.
Still, I do believe the developers are well aware of what everyone wants and not just a set of players.

Offline Shadow-The-Worm

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #34 on: June 23, 2020, 04:55 AM »
It's been interesting reading these comments.  I've loved Worms since the demo appeared on a copy of Amiga Format and I've watched Team17 progress the franchise over the years.  Despite the time that's passed, I keep coming back to Worms Armageddon.  It's a true classic.  Not just in terms of the principles of the game, but in its execution.  Team17 hasn't matched it since.  Its old school 'pixel precision' graphics only adds to it.  Hats off to Karl Morton and the team.

We have to be very thankful that Deadcode and Cybershadow are continuing to improve this classic, and that they have the source code in the first place. You only have to view the change log to see the attention to detail and the work that's gone into it. 

I think 3.8 will make existing users more active, at least to see the differences particularly around the new scheme perhaps different styles of game may appear.

To attract more players and grow the community I think integrating ranks and competitive play is key.  A missions editor and a Missions multiplayer channel would also be a fantastic addition. I appreciate both of these are not trivial to implement.

I know some people talk about version 4 which to me sounds like a very ambitious rewrite.  Personally I'd like the focus to be on the above and perhaps trying to move from a paletted display to true colour.
It's not a simple rewrite, maggot. It's what Epic Battle Fantasy series since the fourth main title and BH2 are like. It's complex, yet underrated by many maggots like you.
I don't want to harm anybody, but when I am triggered, you'll see no mercy, only angry reaction.
My reaction to 3.8: STATUS CANNOT BE REMOVED!

Offline readyworm

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #35 on: June 23, 2020, 09:43 AM »
Quote
It's not a simple rewrite, maggot. It's what Epic Battle Fantasy series since the fourth main title and BH2 are like. It's complex, yet underrated by many maggots like you.
Chill your boots troll boy  :-X  A rewrite is very complex - that's my point.  Maybe you didn't understand "ambitious rewrite".  I'd love to see a shiny, modern 4.0, but I think 3.8 should evolve into it rather than a ground up rewrite if that's possible. I imagine that would be difficult/impossible with the existing code base though.... and would Team 17 allow it?  You seem to think the work on 3.x is pointless, I'm glad Deadcode/CS don't agree with you.

Offline TheKomodo

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #36 on: June 23, 2020, 07:16 PM »
I appreciate devs work though.


I think most of the experienced players feel that way.


I think that's a bit disrespectful to Deadcode & team.

And the award for biggest failure to understand what was said goes to...



*Drumroll*



*Slightly more intensive drumming*



*DRAMATICALLY MORE INTENSIVE DRUMMING*



.



..



...



Kradie!!!! WOOOOOOO!


Offline Anubis

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #37 on: June 24, 2020, 01:38 PM »
inb4 oldschoolers boycot 3.8 because the rope doesn't feel the same anymore
That would actually be surprising because the new rendering also decreases input lag.

What was changed specifically regarding rope responsiveness? can you elaborate? Like a before/after comparison. And maybe some technicalities like how many ms is the difference etc. Would be appreciated. :)

Offline TheWalrus

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #38 on: June 24, 2020, 08:11 PM »
Well sorry to disappoint but I'm bored to tears of this game. And 3.8 doesn't bring anything that would revive my interest at this point. I appreciate devs work though.
I think most of the experienced players feel that way.  We always played for fun and for the competition, there was never a single worms professional or esports footprint though, and when the competition went away, so does the desire to get better and play more.

I still play here and there for fun, but its been 20 years on and off, thousands of games, and few new gameplay mechanics, coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase. 

There was a window to invigorate the 2d worms fanatics but it seems like it has passed.  Deadcode and Cyber have more than done their part many times over even if they and the other maintainers never release 3.8.  The game has enjoyed several great incarnations of activity.  We are in the twilight, and that is just fine with me.
The league is only enjoyed by a few die hard competitive people. This alone doesn't make WA dead. AG is still filled with new and old regulars myself included. I still play cups, and tournament here and there, but even if they aren't as active as I hoped they would be, don't make WA dead.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but I think that's a bit disrespectful to Deadcode & team. This hardcore playerbase you speak of, is merely present, and even the developers would ''focus on the hardcore's needs'' I think it wouldn't ameliorate anything.
Still, I do believe the developers are well aware of what everyone wants and not just a set of players.
Sorry if that was unclear, was talking about team17 when I referenced "coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase"

DC and CS's updates seem aligned with the hardcore playerbase and have taken suggestions as so, I don't think there is any question of that

Hardcore players and the league drive TUS and AG activity, the drive-by worms players don't stop in here

So at the end of the day I think we essentially agree on this Kradie my sweet

Offline Senator

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #39 on: June 25, 2020, 08:06 AM »
I hope we can have a successful league season when 3.8 comes out! Or at least a cup. ;D

Offline Kradie

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #40 on: June 25, 2020, 06:11 PM »
Well sorry to disappoint but I'm bored to tears of this game. And 3.8 doesn't bring anything that would revive my interest at this point. I appreciate devs work though.
I think most of the experienced players feel that way.  We always played for fun and for the competition, there was never a single worms professional or esports footprint though, and when the competition went away, so does the desire to get better and play more.

I still play here and there for fun, but its been 20 years on and off, thousands of games, and few new gameplay mechanics, coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase. 

There was a window to invigorate the 2d worms fanatics but it seems like it has passed.  Deadcode and Cyber have more than done their part many times over even if they and the other maintainers never release 3.8.  The game has enjoyed several great incarnations of activity.  We are in the twilight, and that is just fine with me.
The league is only enjoyed by a few die hard competitive people. This alone doesn't make WA dead. AG is still filled with new and old regulars myself included. I still play cups, and tournament here and there, but even if they aren't as active as I hoped they would be, don't make WA dead.

You are entitled to your own opinion, but I think that's a bit disrespectful to Deadcode & team. This hardcore playerbase you speak of, is merely present, and even the developers would ''focus on the hardcore's needs'' I think it wouldn't ameliorate anything.
Still, I do believe the developers are well aware of what everyone wants and not just a set of players.
Sorry if that was unclear, was talking about team17 when I referenced "coupled with devs that don't care about the hardcore playerbase"

DC and CS's updates seem aligned with the hardcore playerbase and have taken suggestions as so, I don't think there is any question of that

Hardcore players and the league drive TUS and AG activity, the drive-by worms players don't stop in here

So at the end of the day I think we essentially agree on this Kradie my sweet
True words my tusky intellect.

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #41 on: June 25, 2020, 06:36 PM »
What was changed specifically regarding rope responsiveness? can you elaborate? Like a before/after comparison. And maybe some technicalities like how many ms is the difference etc. Would be appreciated. :)

So, the way render tweening was implemented in WA means that on average, you get to see your roping worm in its new, updated position half a frame* early compared to 3.7.2.1, all other things (like renderer, v-sync settings, number of buffered frames, desktop window manager messing with your games, etc.) equal. Some of the time it'll be exactly the same, other times up to almost a whole frame less input lag, depending on how the tween phase of the sprites works out, but distributed evenly so that it averages out to 0.5 frame. The difference from this alone isn't massive, of course, so people who aren't heavily into roping (or rope with v-sync enabled) might not even notice it. But lower input lag is just always good, and I think someone like you probably would be able to tell, actually. Although on the other hand, tweening just makes the entire roping experience more enjoyable because of the smoothness of motion, so I suppose it's tricky to say precisely what's going to be responsible for any perceived improvement.

We'll see, but I can't imagine anyone will actually want to go back once 3.8 is out. :P

Disclaimer: I'm going mostly by how I remember Deadcode explaining this a rather long time ago, in a discussion I can't find right now, so caveat lector.

*Not in-game (engine) frame as far as I can recall, but monitor (GPU) frame, where on a 60 Hz panel one frame corresponds to ~16.7 ms.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 06:42 PM by KoreanRedDragon »

Offline Anubis

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #42 on: June 27, 2020, 08:53 AM »
What was changed specifically regarding rope responsiveness? can you elaborate? Like a before/after comparison. And maybe some technicalities like how many ms is the difference etc. Would be appreciated. :)

So, the way render tweening was implemented in WA means that on average, you get to see your roping worm in its new, updated position half a frame* early compared to 3.7.2.1, all other things (like renderer, v-sync settings, number of buffered frames, desktop window manager messing with your games, etc.) equal. Some of the time it'll be exactly the same, other times up to almost a whole frame less input lag, depending on how the tween phase of the sprites works out, but distributed evenly so that it averages out to 0.5 frame. The difference from this alone isn't massive, of course, so people who aren't heavily into roping (or rope with v-sync enabled) might not even notice it. But lower input lag is just always good, and I think someone like you probably would be able to tell, actually. Although on the other hand, tweening just makes the entire roping experience more enjoyable because of the smoothness of motion, so I suppose it's tricky to say precisely what's going to be responsible for any perceived improvement.

We'll see, but I can't imagine anyone will actually want to go back once 3.8 is out. :P

Disclaimer: I'm going mostly by how I remember Deadcode explaining this a rather long time ago, in a discussion I can't find right now, so caveat lector.

*Not in-game (engine) frame as far as I can recall, but monitor (GPU) frame, where on a 60 Hz panel one frame corresponds to ~16.7 ms.


Thanks, will thoroughly test this once I get my hands on it. :D

Offline nino

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #43 on: June 27, 2020, 10:34 AM »
Sadly 3.8 wont bring activity back to WA, nothing will bring it back unless you can create and manage a time machine to make the real kings of WA back to their WA's  age again, nowadays only 1 or 2 WA king still play, rest are putos and slaves!! sorry but thats the truth!!!

95,7% of new players of WA just play a bit and leave game, thats normal, cos they are living in another era of time, technology than us who used to play 20 years ago, plus we became a family who lived at same house but by the time each one had to leave, and this wont be back too.

Look, I used to w8 fridays night my parents sleep, to turn on TV and see a sensual program where girls showed tits too WANK, nowadays the kids just gets the phone, go to bathroom anytime and WANK, times changes!!

Bye putos!

Kiss, cos king!







You Are Losing Time Reading my Signature.

Offline Shadow-The-Worm

Re: Will you be more active on WA when 3.8 comes?
« Reply #44 on: July 01, 2020, 07:43 AM »
Quote
It's not a simple rewrite, maggot. It's what Epic Battle Fantasy series since the fourth main title and BH2 are like. It's complex, yet underrated by many maggots like you.
Chill your boots troll boy  :-X  A rewrite is very complex - that's my point.  Maybe you didn't understand "ambitious rewrite".  I'd love to see a shiny, modern 4.0, but I think 3.8 should evolve into it rather than a ground up rewrite if that's possible. I imagine that would be difficult/impossible with the existing code base though.... and would Team 17 allow it?  You seem to think the work on 3.x is pointless, I'm glad Deadcode/CS don't agree with you.
Did I say anything about 3.x developement being pointless in general? No, I didn't say so. It's just a centrain version in the tree being so sticky in your mind that I am annoyed by its discussion. And I can't ignore it either. No matter where I go over here, 3.8 just follows me like a curse., Even the last 3.6 pre-28 version was good and not annoying to look at. Everything 3.7.2.1 and below was good and not community-pushed. You dare shriek at me just cause I hate your sticky version in the post-Team17 offical era of W:A?! I'll show you what it means to be a monolitic worm! And that beginning... you called me a troll boy... well then, no more Mr. Nice Ultimate Life Form-Based Name. After all, the guilty lassies here are the majority of the Worms Armageddon community (no developers and this site designer included).
I don't want to harm anybody, but when I am triggered, you'll see no mercy, only angry reaction.
My reaction to 3.8: STATUS CANNOT BE REMOVED!