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April 28, 2024, 11:25 AM

Author Topic: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.  (Read 1149 times)

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Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2024, 10:02 PM »
Just for clarification!

The official Big RR scheme will be used, unfortunately it might not be clear to everyone that for some silly reason, that scheme still hasn't been fixed!

Currently, Big RR / Tower Race share the same scheme, even though they are 2 completely different game types and styles and should have 2 different schemes/standings pages!

Which is crazy because off the top of my head it makes Lupastic look much better at Big RR than he actually is as most of his wins are from Tower Race, not Big RR!

So, just to make it clear - NO TOWER RACE! Big RR ONLY!

Online Peja

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2024, 07:21 AM »
i love the idea. cant wait for the ultimate athletic triathlon of golf, wfw and wascar!

Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2024, 08:02 AM »
Hmmm, reading that over, when I mentioned Lupastic it was merely because he's the main person I see actually play Tower Race, every Tower Race played in the year was him almost?

So it's not a dig at him, just using it as a statistic.

Offline Lupastic

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2024, 01:37 PM »
Hmmm, reading that over, when I mentioned Lupastic it was merely because he's the main person I see actually play Tower Race, every Tower Race played in the year was him almost?

So it's not a dig at him, just using it as a statistic.

the main annoying problem with the current bigrr/tower tus scheme is that it has inf teleport ammo which is not only totally useless, but also can be annoying, since it's on f8, and can sometimes slow down your roping/and/or your last seconds of roping

https://www.tus-wa.com/schemes/scheme-154/

I dunno who used that warg scheme for both tower AND big rr schemes, but he had absolutely zero f@#!ing idea what he was doing because:

1) big rr doesn't need/ never needed a single teleport for big rr maps oO
2) tower race doesn't need teleports either, because it's not f*ckin 2012 anymore where you play tower race with 3-4 worms and no antisink. tele was used when you plopped your first worm, you had 2-3 more "lives" as teleporting your next worm back to the spot where you previously plopped so you could continue. tower race - with HostingBuddy for example - is obviously played with using antisink, and 1 worm, very much the same as big rr. only the maps are different.

but as Komi pointed out they are indeed different. e.g.: if big rr was separated from tower I'd have a kinda bad, approx ~60% win ratio at it =D



I'm a suitable example why it should be taken as a different scheme on its own, cuz most good ropers (but not cheaters) can outrope me in big rr; but since they are merged as one scheme, my tower race wins kept me on top :-* and as you asked Komi, I think I was the only one to pick tower races purposely, even for clanners. only on a few occasions I saw others playing on tower race coincidentally (they took it as big rr I guess :D )

Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2024, 01:53 PM »
cuz most good ropers (but not cheaters) can outrope me in big rr;

I genuinely don't understand this from you though... I've seen you accuse some very legit players recently of cheating and/or scripting when roping!

Which is crazy because, I am literally known for being one of the fastest Ropers of all time, and of course I've been accused of cheating more times than I can count even if I had dozens of feet and hands combined...

Also, side note, it's hilarious when people who only know me for BnG accuse me of aliasing myself because they had no idea I could rope as well as BnG, it's almost like a party trick at this point :D

Though, anyone can actually see me roping on the stream live, with a mic picking up the ASMR of the keyboard being smashed, but also a key input, as well as a very high quality 4K streaming camera that shows how I actually rope/tap.

Anyway, the point of all this, which as usual probably looks like bragging but is really just proof that guys like blitzed don't cheat, is, my live roping is proof that you can actually rope that fast with 1 hand, 1 spacebar, no fingerroll.

While blitzed is one of the most consistent Ropers of all time(at least when he's sober), he is 100% absolutely not a cheater, and if he somehow turns out to be, it's pretty much the worst cheat I've ever see if that's all it can do lol.

If you could cheat in rope you would rope like Mablak, Masta, Statik, Dulek or Sir-J etc, not blitzed!

Imo blitzed is like top 1% But those guys are top 0.01% And that's a HUGE difference.

Reminds me of this quote:

“In 2013 in response to criticism over him being in a bench role throughout his career and to claims that many would beat him 1-on-1 Scalabrine stated "I'm closer to LeBron than you are to me", suggesting that there is a huge difference between any (active or retired) NBA player and the majority of those outside the league. In an event organized by The Toucher and Rich Show selected volunteers had the chance to play 1-on-1 against Scalabrine (until 11 points with a margin of 2). The format was called the "Scallange" and Scalabrine played four games (one against each of the voluntary contenders). Scalabrine won every game with a combined score of 44-6. In an additional game Scalabrine played against the three hosts of the show and won 11-1.”

So yeah, think of, blitzed annihilating your average player, and then you'll see that he's closer to Mablak etc than others are to him.

but since they are merged as one scheme, my tower race wins kept me on top :-* and as you asked Komi, I think I was the only one to pick tower races purposely, even for clanners. only on a few occasions I saw others playing on tower race coincidentally (they took it as big rr I guess :D )

Yeah and it's sad to me, Tower Race is actually one of my favourite schemes, that's what I was doing live on Twitch with M3ntal when someone, I think khamski from CWT asked me to stream CWT and the rest is history lol.

We used to play them quite often, Brudi and Cheetah are the best Tower maps!

Offline TheWalrus

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2024, 02:28 PM »
I think big rr should be the same scheme as tower, and Lupa should be able to pick it whenever he wants, but I guess it’s a personal choice for komo for his TRL baby.  Tower roperace is still a big rope race.  Also - it’s just f@#!ing silly, how would you be able to differentiate a tower from a big rr?  For example, SiD’s Guitower is just a typical big rr, but you rope to the top, not an evil big tower like some.  Where does a big rr end and a tower begin?  It would be virtually impossible to tell which maps fall into tower category and which are big rr maps.  Who will determine which is which?

Offline FoxHound

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Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2024, 03:14 PM »
I think big rr should be the same scheme as tower, and Lupa should be able to pick it whenever he wants, but I guess it’s a personal choice for komo for his TRL baby.  Tower roperace is still a big rope race.  Also - it’s just f@#!ing silly, how would you be able to differentiate a tower from a big rr?  For example, SiD’s Guitower is just a typical big rr, but you rope to the top, not an evil big tower like some.  Where does a big rr end and a tower begin?  It would be virtually impossible to tell which maps fall into tower category and which are big rr maps.  Who will determine which is which?

I think Big RR and Tower should be separated. Why? I think most Towers are evil, they have humor, if you fall you NEED TELEPORT, at least for funners, even with anti-sink and 1 worm. I already suggested a feature I call Save State that players go back to a saved position pressing a button. This is needed for bungee race and all other races. Anti Sink helps, but not all maps explore Anti Sink feature, and there are parts of the map that are on top and there's no access to the water, it's bad that a map maker needs to always make maps with water at the bottom to "force save state" using anti sink.

Big RR doesn't need teleport. In this case, teleport will annoy players as Lupastic stated. Removing teleport from Big RR would be a good thing. Although, I think Deadcode or other devs should really think on a solution for these weapons that annoy the gameplay. For example in the scheme settings it would be amazing to select an option to ignore a determined weapon when pressing an F-key, or only pressing shift + F-key for that weapon. This would be great specially for f12 too. It would be a scheme specific thing or maybe something that players could configure, maybe even during the game.

There are many cases of maps that are in the grey area, middle term between two gameplay styles. I think that playing BIG RR and TTRR is a huge difference in terms of gameplay. Someone good in Big RR would suffer against a TTRR player. I think unifying everything and call this RR is not ok for competitive play. The same for Tower and Big RR.

I think each league scheme should receive an official mappack with a pattern of maps, because for example, I know that is not a famous scheme and not played competitively yet, but Boom for Weapons can be very different in terms of gameplay on each map you play. There are very evil maps and there are very easy maps. There are maps that explore the use of skunk a lot, there are maps that don't use skunk. Someone good with skunk would have advantage on certain maps, people good with some crazy combos would be good on other maps. It's complicated to select which map would fit best for a league, but I think that removing evil maps would be a great thing, this to all schemes. Evil maps are challenge maps, not good gameplay maps. Evil maps might be fun to play offline, not fun to play online.

To sum up: Big RR and Tower are different schemes. They deserve a proper scheme, because they need. In my point of view, I think that Big RR could receive a more conservative scheme that will be well seen for most players, specially the old school ropers. While Tower could receive a modern scheme, with LDET or even Rubber bounciness. Because the scheme is less serious anyway. I know that it is a hardcore gameplay scheme, it is serious in this sense, but I'm saying that compared to Big RR it has way more weird parts, creative gameplay, unexpected things you need to do, and when you fall it can really make you go behind other players. Falling in Big RR is not the same thing.

EDIT: We could also separate Creative/Handmade Big RR from Program-made/predictable, symmetrical, constant Big RR map.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2024, 03:25 PM by FoxHound »
I doubt you see this link moving below (you will have to zoom in. If you click at it, you will have maden the impossible):
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Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2024, 03:29 PM »
I think big rr should be the same scheme as tower, and Lupa should be able to pick it whenever he wants, but I guess it’s a personal choice for komo for his TRL baby.  Tower roperace is still a big rope race.  Also - it’s just f@#!ing silly, how would you be able to differentiate a tower from a big rr?  For example, SiD’s Guitower is just a typical big rr, but you rope to the top, not an evil big tower like some.  Where does a big rr end and a tower begin?  It would be virtually impossible to tell which maps fall into tower category and which are big rr maps.  Who will determine which is which?

Lmfao, that's very surprising coming from you!

You see how just changing a very small part of Hysteria makes it a completely different scheme, but you can't see how Big RR and Tower Race are completely different kinds of gameplay?

LIES!

I don't believe it, you're drunk or something!

:D

They actually, when done properly, even have 2 completely different schemes.

The map designs are completely different and repeatable as well.

The way you actually rope, is different as well.

Just like TTRR and Big RR

And TTRR and Big RR are closer than Big RR and Tower Race.

Offline Kradie

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2024, 03:53 PM »
I would dare to say that some TTRR maps does not qualify as TTRR maps at all, but more closer to as a challenge and Tower.

Overall BIG RR and TTRR are very similar while Tower is not. I always thought Tower was completely different kind of beast. Aside from league, it is not as often hosted compared to normal BIG RR.
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Offline TheWalrus

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2024, 08:33 PM »
Lmfao, that's very surprising coming from you!

You see how just changing a very small part of Hysteria makes it a completely different scheme, but you can't see how Big RR and Tower Race are completely different kinds of gameplay?

LIES!

I don't believe it, you're drunk or something!

:D

They actually, when done properly, even have 2 completely different schemes.

The map designs are completely different and repeatable as well.

The way you actually rope, is different as well.

Just like TTRR and Big RR

And TTRR and Big RR are closer than Big RR and Tower Race.
man does anybody read posts anymore, I’m saying I don’t want to make big rr/tower into 2 different allround schemes and then fox went off on some tangent that had nothing to do with my original post after quoting it.

Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2024, 09:07 PM »
TheWalrus, I'm very surprised you THINK they are the same thing, they absolutely are not! It's been known for over 10-15 years!

Big RR /  TTRR / Tower Race / Trick Race

All KIND of the same thing, but absolutely NOT the same thing.

Aerial / Hysteria / Panicsteria / Petrolsteria / Selecsteria, all kind of the same thing but not the same thing!

Point is, the difference between Big RR and Tower Race is FAR greater than the difference between the Hysteria/Aerial type schemes

The scheme settings are also different and have been for just as long outside of TUS.

I mean, just look at the Tower Race maps from Brudi, Cheetah and many others, it literally says Tower Race on them!

You are right though, some people don't know the difference, but it's pretty damn noticeable.

And yes, one of the fundamentals of Tower Races is that you climb them vertically, that Big RR you mentioned must either be a Big RR that's vertical, or a very very very badly designed Tower Race lol.

Offline TheWalrus

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2024, 10:00 PM »
You still aren’t reading, please actually read, lol

So why not make panic and hysteria different allround schemes?  Why not make zar roper and roper different allround schemes?  Why not have 22 schemes in allround league?  You still don’t seem to be grasping what I’m saying, I never said tower rr and big rr are the same thing despite my plea for you to actually read my post.  I’ll make a new paragraph just to help to clarify.

1.  I don’t think big rr and tower rr are the same thing.

2.  Despite the first point, I do not believe tower rr and big rr should be their own, seperate schemes in TUS allround league.  We do not need to add an additional scheme to allround league.

3.  That is literally all the points I made.

So you support a new Tus allround scheme for tower rr komo?  If so I propose a new allround scheme called small ttrr, reserved for 100 sec small maps and pi mission impossible maps. 

Offline TheKomodo

Re: New League using TRL as a test drive - Starting 1st March 2024.
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2024, 10:05 PM »
You still aren’t reading, please actually read, lol

So why not make panic and hysteria different allround schemes?  Why not make zar roper and roper different allround schemes?  Why not have 22 schemes in allround league?  You still don’t seem to be grasping what I’m saying, I never said tower rr and big rr are the same thing despite my plea for you to actually read my post.  I’ll make a new paragraph just to help to clarify.

1.  I don’t think big rr and tower rr are the same thing.

2.  Despite the first point, I do not believe tower rr and big rr should be their own, seperate schemes in TUS allround league.  We do not need to add an additional scheme to allround league.

3.  That is literally all the points I made.

So you support a new Tus allround scheme for tower rr komo?  If so I propose a new allround scheme called small ttrr, reserved for 100 sec small maps and pi mission impossible maps.

Well, of course we're on the same page then if we all agree they are not the same scheme... But...

Wait... Did you accidentally say the wrong thing or did someone hack your account before then?

If you don't think Big RR and Tower RR are the same thing then why did you say this?

I think big rr should be the same scheme as tower, and Lupa should be able to pick it whenever he wants, but I guess it’s a personal choice for komo for his TRL baby.  Tower roperace is still a big rope race.  Also - it’s just f@#!ing silly, how would you be able to differentiate a tower from a big rr?  For example, SiD’s Guitower is just a typical big rr, but you rope to the top, not an evil big tower like some.  Where does a big rr end and a tower begin?  It would be virtually impossible to tell which maps fall into tower category and which are big rr maps.  Who will determine which is which?

I'm a bit confused here...

About adding another scheme to allround, I'm not sure about that.

I'd probably be taking schemes out not adding them if we were to make changes.

Though that's why I've started this new League idea so we're all good!

If anything, I'd at least add Tower Race as it's own scheme in TFL.