wkWormOrder v. 1.2.0 released

[Albus]

I think it would be nice if there were an option in W:A to disable any other online players' customizations in your game client locally. It would solve the gibberish worm names problem, as well as being able to hide obnoxious graves or flags. Obviously it takes away from the social/creative aspect of worms a bit, but at this point I feel like team names are kind of just noise for me.

I think it's nice what syc said there. I would support the idea that, in the game itself, or through a module, you had an option to leave the game with a "default" layout, without any player customizations, and that, imo, should include everything.

Regarding graves, I can mention obnoxious graves (giant concrete donkey for example) and others that can confuse the player (fake mine etc.).

Regarding the worm's voice: I think would be nice if we could hear the voice in our language if we wanted. Some phrases are useful to know (reinforcements arrived, regarding team weapons etc.). Or, simply, maybe some people would like to hear the game in their language only.

Regarding the names of the worms, with a module or game option, all worms would appear as worm 1, 2, 3 etc, in their order. It could be good for two sides: streamers and players. It would end the problem with gibberish worm names or in different languages (hard to pronounce in streams). It would allow streamers and spectators to see players team orders, allowing them to make more deep analysis of the game. In relation to the players, I don't see the need for a player who wants to make it difficult for the opponent to figure out the order of his team (creating new teams before league matches or using gibberish worm names). I think everyone should know the order of the oponnent team in certain schemes. I, for example, have notes of the order of my opponent's teams and already memorized of some people I play often. On the other hand, since I always use the same team in leagues, I know that some of my opponents know my team's order because have it memorized or have already noted. And even if you haven't noted it down beforehand, you can get during (as some people are saying) or between rounds (through replay file).

But, if there was a module for that, it would be interesting if it behaved like /arrrows. Nizikawa said he can make a module behaviour like that.

[King-Gizzard]

While I am aware you can extract information from a replay file, is it possible to do it during an actual game, or only after?

From what I can see the game locks the replay file whilst playing as it needs to write to it in real-time.  The OS will throw an error if you try to open the file mid-game.

But there are other ways to get the opponent worm order, in about 10 seconds with no programming knowledge and leaving no trace.  If people REALLY want to cheat like this they'll find a way but these things come down to trust and hopefully respect for competitive play.

[Albus]

I've already looked at previous games from a player to know his team order. It is very useful to know, in some schemes, the first worms of the enemy team (to make piles, force the use of ws etc.). And even if someone doesn't write down the enemy sequence or discover in some another way, they end up memorizing the team of people who don't change the team, like me and many people. Knowing the sequence of the enemy team, in my opinion, makes even the game more strategic and less random (something positive for certain schemes).

[TheKomodo]

there are other ways to get the opponent worm order, in about 10 seconds with no programming knowledge and leaving no trace.  If people REALLY want to cheat like this they'll find a way but these things come down to trust and hopefully respect for competitive play.

If you can't access the replay, how are you supposed to know the opponents worm order in 10 seconds without them actually cycling through their team?

Can you explain what method is being used without going into specifics?(Obviously we don't want people to know)

Is it something inside the game? Is it 3rd party software?

[cgar]

Just quickly tested there. Started a cpu only game and printed the replay file out while they were running in the background. Got this:

Code Select Expand

CPU 5ZeplinFluteStreptoFrankTeabag      Mr Meeker
Rusty NailJoker
               thrombosis1New Text DocumentCPU 4WarpedJarvisSandraHarryCleetusFreemanBirianiBenney

Didn't even need to format it lol

[Albus]

Just quickly tested there. Started a cpu only game and printed the replay file out while they were running in the background. Got this:

Code Select Expand

CPU 5ZeplinFluteStreptoFrankTeabag      Mr Meeker
Rusty NailJoker
               thrombosis1New Text DocumentCPU 4WarpedJarvisSandraHarryCleetusFreemanBirianiBenney

Didn't even need to format it lol

That's why I think players should stop worrying about trying to hide the team sequence (creating teams with gibberish worm names or creating new teams to try to confuse the opponent). See how easy it is to get the enemy order!? Worms is not, in essence, a memory game. Just as many write down the use of utilities (and nobody is a worse player for that), others write down the order of the enemy team. And there's nothing that can stop it. A module that shows the sequence of the enemy too (which is not the case with the module in question made by nizikawa, which only shows the order of your team) will only make legitimate something that already occurs (at least for those who know this possibility - being a disadvantage for those who don't know how to do this) and will make life easier for streamers.

[TheKomodo]

As a streamer, I won't stream any matches knowing someone is doing that stuff.

As far as i'm concerned, it degrades skill and the mere fact some people think it's ok is concerning.

I want to help encourage and support a professional, disciplined environment which encourages skill at the highest level, not the opposite.

[Albus]

As a streamer, I won't stream any matches knowing someone is doing that stuff.

As far as i'm concerned, it degrades skill and the mere fact some people think it's ok is concerning.

I want to help encourage and support a professional, disciplined environment which encourages skill at the highest level, not the opposite.

I think the opposite. Regarding my favorite scheme, intermediate, I think that if the order of teams were explicit it would increase the level of the game. People would feel more stimulated to observe the opponent team's sequence and think about the next turns. People can already do this. However, you need to write** the order of the opponent's team somewhere beforehand, during the game or between rounds. I think letting people get rid of this "obligation" would increase their focus only on the game, which would be beneficial. In addition, there is the disadvantage for those people who do not know "easier methods" to know the order of the enemy team's, which maybe some of these people would use if they knew how to do it.

** I admire people who have excellent memory and don't need to write down the order of the opponent's team, the utilities used etc, but not everyone has this ability, and I don't think certain schemes should involve that kind of talent for memorizing things. I know awesome players who make notes about things on the game (utilites used etc.). I don't know about you, but I'm not interested in who is better to memorize things. I want to see creative moves, interesting tactics etc. I would prefer a rule where both players make the team sequence available to streamers and opponents.

[TheKomodo]

As I said earlier, either everyone does it, or nobody does it.

Just make everyone use the same team then?

Not being able to trust people though, that sucks.

[Korydex]

n module for nerds

[nizikawa]

.

[Albus]

As I said earlier, either everyone does it, or nobody does it.

For me, the ideal would be to implement a behavior identical to /arrows. The person would know you're using it. Surely there are people who wouldn't need or want to use it, then, there would be no way to make it mandatory for everyone.

Just make everyone use the same team then?

Not necessarily. As the current module already does, it would just add a number, before the name, indicating the order of the team.



I can't speak for others, but in intermediate I feel that I have more chances of winning and I play more strategically when I play thinking about the sequence of the opponent's team. The point is that there are people who know much more practical methods of getting it and others who do it in a more laborious way. Whoever can get it easier and faster, in my opinion, has a certain advantage. A module that shows the sequence of both teams and behaves like /arrows, will only legitimize and make explicit something that is already done by many (more discreetly) and will increase the level of playing in certain schemes in my opinion. Additionally it will be something positive for the streams.

[XanKriegor]

Adnan, this specific point is different for all maps so it should be specified by the first worm placed.

[Mega`Adnan]

Adnan, this specific point is different for all maps so it should be specified by the first worm placed.

Or maybe save the information of worms spawn in all the maps in this module, but it still would be a problem if someone makes a new map and information of that map isn't saved.
It's just my theory, other better ideas are welcomed.

[Sycotropic]

I agree with Albus that knowing worms order makes the game more interesting and competitive, not less so. The "skill" of memorizing your opponents turn order by their chosen names is pretty boring, and with so many ways to try and throw people off with garbage names it's just a lame part of the game. I agree that if only some people have access to the turn order then it's lame.. so it should just be part of the game

If I'm reading this correctly though, this module doesn't give you access to opponents' turn order right?