For that to work we'd need a competition bureau/monopoly-busting taskforce to avoid letting the best players all form into a single clan. That was what killed regular clanners.
A lot of people also aren't used to this kind of system anymore. Only a small portion plays for stuff like ESL or other gaming leagues outside the actual game. 'Ranked' play to some degree exists in nearly every game out there.
Plus, Worms has all these different schemes, which makes it a hassle to understand and master competition. I mean, which players play Elite or Roper nowadays? Zero to none outside of Tus.
Yeah, calling us a low self esteem trash plus getting rid of us, and still cry for inactivity.
WaAaAaH! WhY WoRmS iS DyInG!?! WaAaAaH!
If 5$ for few months of season is too much for someone.. Then wow :D
@Adnan hey did my post offend you? Huahauahau
I know it's not really league related what im gonna say, but we had eac previously, why don't we make something like that but based on tus classic?
I know it's not really league related what im gonna say, but we had eac previously, why don't we make something like that but based on tus classic?
I was actually planning to host a cup similar to previous Elite Winter Cup but with 5 schemes.. "Allround Summer Cup" :) Last time we had +100$ prize pool.
No buy-in? Completely free?
If you are going to make a league for new players, you can cut Elite and Hysteria.. People don't play those schemes on WormNet so why would they be interested? :-[
Competitive Worms is like real life, the gap between the rich and poor, good and bad, just gets bigger and bigger.
Am I wrong?
@Adnan hey did my post offend you? Huahauahau
What post?
Competitive Worms is like real life, the gap between the rich and poor, good and bad, just gets bigger and bigger.
Am I wrong?
Well it sure is gonna be that way if you call the schemes you play Elite and league-worthy and discard every new scheme as noob and not fit for any kind of skill contest/comparison.
It would be a lot closer if you took the fight to their home ground.
i'd add shopper as well cuz people play it
i'd add shopper as well cuz people play it
Yeah, but if you could only chose 1 rope scheme, 1 strategic scheme, and 1 artillery scheme, what would you choose? Could everyone actually answer this please, without hating on other peoples choices?
roper, elite, bngi'd add shopper as well cuz people play it
Yeah, but if you could only chose 1 rope scheme, 1 strategic scheme, and 1 artillery scheme, what would you choose? Could everyone actually answer this please, without hating on other peoples choices?
Well it doesn't have to be strictly 3 schemes, 4 is also a good number xd shopper is popular. This way we have 2 rope schemes and 2 ground schemes, each one has a "pro" and "amateur" choice
Yeah, but if you could only chose 1 rope scheme, 1 strategic scheme, and 1 artillery scheme, what would you choose?
Anyone know who is this guy?
If they get rid of roper, ttrr, bng, and wxw. I would be sad.Anyone know who is this guy?
Russian revelation of Doubletime?
Im in with elite, hyst and big rr
Maybe we shouldn't have split Classic league, because it might be your problem.
I'd also blame the lack of updates, as we haven't had an update in FIVE AND A HALF YEARS! 3.8
I oppose splitting itMaybe we shouldn't have split Classic league, because it might be your problem.
Well, we haven't yet... Surprisingly enough I don't really see many people opposing this, definitely not as many as I thought would, so it seems the idea of going back to 3 simple schemes is pretty good, vastly acceptable at least :)I'd also blame the lack of updates, as we haven't had an update in FIVE AND A HALF YEARS! 3.8
Well, I don't want to blame the lack of updates, while the updates will indeed give us more useful and interesting features, what we have already is good enough, we just want more players, the update would help a little I guess, especially if we had real-time games.
It's not like Worms Armageddon was ever the most popular game in the world to begin with, I think we still have a fairly healthy playerbase considering how old it is, just a lack of official ranked games, and less players who enjoy more hardcore schemes.
Even though I don't enjoy playing Mole, I actually enjoy watching it, I actually prefer organizing things more than being a player these days so I don't care what the community wants, if we can have an active community, would be fun to organize stuff, Tournaments and do streaming etc.
And the truth is HHC, newer players are just far less skilled overall because they tend to stick to 1-2 schemes, yeah these guys are good at Mole, what else can they do lol?
I oppose splitting it
Leaving the 8 schemes right where they are. If people don't want to play those schemes they don't have to.I oppose splitting it
If the choice is between having 8 schemes, nobody to play, or 3 schemes, and more people to play, what would you choose?
I find ita little frustrating you would rather have an empty dying league, than a more active league, if given the choice...I never said i want a empty dying league.
But fair enough :)
Well oldsock isn't wrong, I just find it odd someone would choose this level of activity over less schemes more activity, that's if it worked lol.I never chose this level of activity. I would much rather have a lot more activity.
I don't understand the obsession with 3 schemes. Even more specifically role, strategic, artillery? That's nonsense and arbitrary.You can't speak for anyone individual let alone an entire community. I don't view myself as a jerk.
If you want activity then let's go with Mole Shopper, Intermediate, aerial.
Activity is low here because the game is old (which we can't help) and we as a community are turning into jerks.
If they get rid of roper, ttrr, bng, and wxw. I would be sad.Anyone know who is this guy?
Russian revelation of Doubletime?
Im in with elite, hyst and big rr
Well it's just a suggestion it's not an obsession Ryan.What were those three schemes? roper, elite, and t17?
I just remember the days of 3 schemes in WACL and it was pretty awesome.
Why would you want to replace ttrr, Tight big rr maps are fun also.If they get rid of roper, ttrr, bng, and wxw. I would be sad.Anyone know who is this guy?
Russian revelation of Doubletime?
Im in with elite, hyst and big rr
Well i wouldnt be happy either about roper and ttrr. But im not happy with current status of the league either. Not sure if i would become very active if league was active though. Tight big rr maps are good enough to replace ttrr imo.
Just because ttrr is imposible scheme for new players for way too long time. Its definitely the hardest scheme to be good enough to enjoy it.
TTRR is the cheating game by using multiple spaces that helps you to avoid failing.
Even more specifically rope, strategic, artillery? That's nonsense and arbitrary.
Tight big rr maps are good enough to replace ttrr imo.
What were those three schemes? roper, elite, and t17?
Just because ttrr is imposible scheme for new players for way too long time. Its definitely the hardest scheme to be good enough to enjoy it.
Just because ttrr is imposible scheme for new players for way too long time. Its definitely the hardest scheme to be good enough to enjoy it.A lot of young players get good at ttrr pretty fast.
No sock, i think we will keep other schemes in their actual league, we're not going to shut them downnCool :)
it is time to change the socks and go onBrilliant comment
Tight big rr maps are good enough to replace ttrr imo.
Noooooo! Tightness in Big RR ruins the whole f**king flow and dynamic of Big RR! They should be abolished!
Keep tight maps to TTRR, where that specific group of people can have their own enjoyment without affecting people who enjoy actual fast roping on a normal map.
(Lmao i'm a dumbass who read it the wrong way round, ignore me please Camelo :D )What were those three schemes? roper, elite, and t17?
BnG, Elite and Roper. (But after reading Senators last post I may be wrong, was it really 1 rope 1 bng 1 default? Was default either Elite or Intermediate? I honestly thought it was the 3 I mentioned...)Just because ttrr is imposible scheme for new players for way too long time. Its definitely the hardest scheme to be good enough to enjoy it.
Maybe i'm alone in this but I don't see TTRR as any harder to learn than anything else, it's just different...
1 day for granny shopper.
1 year for roper.
2 years for evil wxw maps.
3 years ttrr :D
Any scheme becomes more enjoyable when you get good at it..
You can learn a scheme because your opponents pick it all the time and then you start enjoying it :)
You can learn a scheme because your opponents pick it all the time and then you start enjoying it :)opponents don't always pick the same schemes every time as well.
You can learn a scheme because your opponents pick it all the time and then you start enjoying it :)
Any scheme becomes more enjoyable when you get good at it.. In league games you are forced to play every scheme and it's not rare that a scheme you hate becomes one of your favorites. I'd rather hear Masta's opinion on TTRR vs Big RR because he is great at both of them ;D
Yes, you can be great at Roper but noob at TTRR. It works the other way, though. If you are great at TTRR, you are also quite good at Roper with no or very little practice.
Generally speaking, a scheme is only as hard as the map.
Whether it's WxW, Roper, Big RR or TTRR, they are all easy to learn, all easy to play, but they all take time and dedication to master.
The only thing that actually gets "harder" is competing with the top players, because as they specialize more and more, they get better and better, so you have to keep getting better/stay warm to keep up, TTRR is definitely harder in that sense, because there is a much greater amount of good players than Big RR.
TTRR actually has legends and history, Big RR has Masta, and that's pretty much it lol, and I think many players have the ability to surpass Masta if they tried, but it's not popular enough :(
Since TTRR has a MUCH bigger and more hardcore fanbase, it's been around longer, and has various godlike players than Big RR, it doesn't surprise me people think TTRR is harder than Big RR, because more has been done with it, I wonder what things would be like, if Big RR as we know it now, was available when TTRR 1st started, I guess it would be as popular if not more popular because of it's more appealing speed/trickery.
Generally speaking Ropers are always decided on the crates, but, in this sense isn't Roper the most difficult? Because sometimes the crates demand absolute perfect roping or you won't even meet the target, at least in TTRR, you CAN reach the finish. Then again, that makes it the easiest as well lol.
You can only get so good at TTRR, you can only get so good at Big RR, you can only get so good at WxW.
What can you even say is harder about TTRR? Or what does it have that's unique that another Rope scheme doesn't have?
"It takes longer to get better than any other rope scheme" - Does it? Or maybe people have just played TTRR for longer, with greater passion than Big RR and therefor it's just evolved more.
Every rope scheme the goal is to get better and better, we've never seen anybody rope even close to what tool assist can do, for any scheme, but we've both seen insane levels of skill for all these schemes, and I think each are as impressive as the other.
Nobody will ever be perfect at any of these schemes, so none of them are harder than the other.
The only thing I ever found hard about this game, is trying to prevent my own anger when I fail easy things i've done a million times before, and that happens in every scheme...
Also, what about Warmers? You could practise for years and years and still suck...
I still hate shopper senatorDidn't you enjoy it more after you learned the basics of roping and were able to make successful turns? ;D Besides, TUS scheme is stripped down to a few different weapons so I don't wonder why people don't enjoy it.
If I were to arrange the 'big 4' rope schemes in terms of skill, I'd rank them as:Why do you rank Big RR and WxW higher than Roper? They require very similar roping skills (when you get a hard crate in Roper). One could say Roper is a bit harder because the maps are non-linear. Also this:
1. TTRR
2. Big RR
3. WxW (hard settings)
4. Roper
Generally speaking Ropers are always decided on the crates, but, in this sense isn't Roper the most difficult? Because sometimes the crates demand absolute perfect roping or you won't even meet the target
it's no harder learning to control the rope in tighter areas carefully, than it is throwing your worm as hard as you can in Big RR, pushing both schemes to the limit.I think you are alone with this view. It's easier to keep the worm on the track on a wide map even if the pace is faster.
As far as Masta goes, I'm not trying to throw any shade but meh. I don't care about offline challenges. If you're not actively on WormNET owning people in multiplayer on at least a semi-regular basis, I couldn't give a crap about any accomplishments you may have. I haven't seen Masta on WormNET in at least 2 years, except for one possible time in which I am fairly sure I played vs. him in Big RR using an alias, but it's entirely possible that I could be wrong. Masta's 'legendary' status comes from offline challenges and nothing else. (In other words, replaying the same map a hundred times until you get a perfect run.) I'm seriously not trying to sound like a hater here, I'm just speaking how I feel.You are wrong, masta is the best overall roper in the game and has been for some time, we played plenty over the past few years when i was still active. Pretty sure hes bored of owning the noobs that play nowadays, so offline challenges present an actual test to push his roping. Maybe since we didn't get daina-zalo, we can have masta-skunk3 instead?
You got to be in the top 20 ropers to say he is the best overall roper, top 30-40 at least.As far as Masta goes, I'm not trying to throw any shade but meh. I don't care about offline challenges. If you're not actively on WormNET owning people in multiplayer on at least a semi-regular basis, I couldn't give a crap about any accomplishments you may have. I haven't seen Masta on WormNET in at least 2 years, except for one possible time in which I am fairly sure I played vs. him in Big RR using an alias, but it's entirely possible that I could be wrong. Masta's 'legendary' status comes from offline challenges and nothing else. (In other words, replaying the same map a hundred times until you get a perfect run.) I'm seriously not trying to sound like a hater here, I'm just speaking how I feel.You are wrong, masta is the best overall roper in the game and has been for some time, we played plenty over the past few years when i was still active. Pretty sure hes bored of owning the noobs that play nowadays, so offline challenges present an actual test to push his roping. Maybe since we didn't get daina-zalo, we can have masta-skunk3 instead?
Can we have masta-skun3 instead? are you that bored? masta would destroy skunk3, wouldn't even be fun to watch.it follows the same formula [ competent challenger ] - [ player who's skill level is less than they believe ]
I just don't any more hype and not show up, cause you know that's whats going to happen.Can we have masta-skun3 instead? are you that bored? masta would destroy skunk3, wouldn't even be fun to watch.it follows the same formula [ competent challenger ] - [ player who's skill level is less than they believe ]
Getting money challenges streamed would be a good way to entertain everyone.Challengers would have put up at least 100 bucks for me to watch it. Just saying.
Probably sustainable if it was done every week...
Getting money challenges streamed would be a good way to entertain everyone.Doubt this will happen.
Probably sustainable if it was done every week...
Dave take a look at the best records in some of the most popular challenges, people go full speed with extreme accuracy pushing it to the limit.
I think you are alone with this view. It's easier to keep the worm on the track on a wide map even if the pace is faster.
Lots of ttrr players play different maps that they don't practice week after week, challenges are just for fun m8.Dave take a look at the best records in some of the most popular challenges, people go full speed with extreme accuracy pushing it to the limit.
I keep up to date with challenges, hence why I am saying this ;)
Sorry but i'm with skunk on this one, if you are already good at TTRR, and doing the same map for a whole week, it's not as impressive as winning actual games, in my opinion.
There is next to no pressure when you have all that time to sit and focus, alone, without distraction.
It still looks cool though, but i've never saw anyone go full speed in a TTRR, I mean the league style TTRR games, ever, well, without falling anyway :D
The only full speed I saw in TTRR is on challenges, on the smaller, more open maps.
Apart from Masta, who are these Big RR pro players? Sorry for my ignorance, I have not followed the Big RR scene.I've heard a lot about fast players in Big RR, not sure who is pro though apart from Masta.
Stop talking about it and start playing it!TTRR ne1?
I am pretty sure when I watched masta play the Big RR challenge the other week, he fell and used his parachute a couple times if i am not mistaken. You rarely see anyone in TTRR challenge win without falling even once, sometimes one parachute, rarely 2 parachutes. Proven wrong :) TTRR is the harder scheme and if you are good at TTRR it will be much easier to get good at BigRR. End of Story. No more posts, please. Let's talk about the variety of games more. yay 8)Dave take a look at the best records in some of the most popular challenges, people go full speed with extreme accuracy pushing it to the limit.
I keep up to date with challenges, hence why I am saying this ;)
Sorry but i'm with skunk on this one, if you are already good at TTRR, and doing the same map for a whole week, it's not as impressive as winning actual games, in my opinion.
There is next to no pressure when you have all that time to sit and focus, alone, without distraction.
It still looks cool though, but i've never saw anyone go full speed in a TTRR, I mean the league style TTRR games, ever, well, without falling anyway :D
The only full speed I saw in TTRR is on challenges, on the smaller, more open maps.
Edit - Missed Senators reply:I think you are alone with this view. It's easier to keep the worm on the track on a wide map even if the pace is faster.
Then howcome players of any skill level fall on both schemes, the best players in TTRR hardly fall, the best players in Big RR hardly fall.
If you try to go as fast as humanly possible in TTRR you will fall, in Big RR, you will fall, and I mean throwing your worm and bouncing as hard/fast as possible.
Try and prove me wrong :)
Lots of ttrr players play different maps that they don't practice week after week, challenges are just for fun m8.
Apart from Masta, who are these Big RR pro players? Sorry for my ignorance, I have not followed the Big RR scene.
I am pretty sure when I watched masta play the Big RR challenge the other week, he fell and used his parachute a couple times if i am not mistaken. Proven wrong :) TTRR is the harder scheme and if you are good at TTRR it will be much easier to get good at BigRR. End of Story. No more posts, please. Let's talk about the variety of games more. yay 8)
Maybe it's not a harder scheme, but it is the more popular scheme, because you can see the whole map almost on any resolution, lot less confusion of where your going. Less confusion = better scheme.Lots of ttrr players play different maps that they don't practice week after week, challenges are just for fun m8.
Yeah I know, what's your point? I was replying to lalo mate.Apart from Masta, who are these Big RR pro players? Sorry for my ignorance, I have not followed the Big RR scene.
That's one of my points lol, Big RR doesn't have the same opportunity TTRR had in terms of playerbase, hardcore players competing with each other rigorously, there are quite a few good players with the potential of surpassing Masta but it doesn't seem like it has enough interest.
You guys are saying Big RR is easier but that's only because the bar hasn't been set high enough yet because it doesn't have the popularity that TTRR had.
If everybody here, and dozens more were actively playing this as much as TTRR in the past, you would understand what I mean about pushing boundaries and that it's still just as hard as TTRR because you can't physically reach the limit because our human bodies can't react as fast flawlessly as tool assist.
Also, Masta has been playing offline and online for years, he put hell of a lot of hours into Big RR, just as he did TTRR. I think it would take any top TTRR player a while to get as good as Masta in Big RR as well.I am pretty sure when I watched masta play the Big RR challenge the other week, he fell and used his parachute a couple times if i am not mistaken. Proven wrong :) TTRR is the harder scheme and if you are good at TTRR it will be much easier to get good at BigRR. End of Story. No more posts, please. Let's talk about the variety of games more. yay 8)
How does him falling and using parachute a couple times prove anything? People fall and use parachute in TTRR as well, what's your point here?
TTRR is not the harder scheme, you are being subjective.
It's this simple, if you play Big RR you learn how to control the rope in wider more open spaces, you have more room to sustain full speed, you can play safe and get solid times, but if you really have that fire in your heart and want to be the fastest humanly possible, you will push your worm to do the fastest tricks, like power spikes, pumps, outlaws, full speed scrolling on zig zag sections with 1 bounce each side, paying attention to the upcoming sections and keeping yourself on the optimum route, each time you do the wrong move, or lose momentum you fall behind, if this scheme was played in the same scheme settings as TTRR, infinite time, I actually think it would be harder to go full speed for 5+ minutes without pause, than doing a short TTRR map for 1 minute.
If you play TTRR you learn how to control the rope in tighter areas, you have less room to sustain full speed, you can play safe and get solid times, but if you really have that fire in your heart and want to be the fastest humanly possible, you will push your worm to do the fastest tricks, you will learn to scroll in tight gaps because your hand eye coordination skills will learn the timing/groove for that map type just as simply as they will on larger maps at faster speeds.
The most crucial aspects in all schemes, is confidence and passion, once you practise enough, you feel more natural, and everything becomes a daily routine you can do in your sleep.
Why does time even matter?I prefer quality, and a BigRR with 5 people playing and falling every turn isn't my idea of quality time. They do both have their individual elements, but overall the collective skill level of TTRR is higher than Big RR, but I disagree, it is still harder.
Do you prefer quality, or quantity?
These are all subjective, what's the best fruit? What's the best colour?
I am talking purely about getting from start to finish, I see Big RR and TTRR as equal in terms of difficulty, and i've explained why already.
They both have their individual elements, right now the collective skill level of TTRR is higher than Big RR, but it's not harder.
Well, don't fall every turn then.I don't enjoy BigRR, why would I even play it? If I wanted to improve, I could do so very easily and become a "pro". But there is not incentive, no ambition to play this boring scheme, imo
Improve.
Well, don't fall every turn then.Yeah, because it is not nearly as interesting. It's the truth! It's fun to go fast and hit some nice speeds, but after 20 minutes I'm cooked. Why push the limits. This will just hurt my fingers in the long run as well as everyone else's who decide to put so many hours into this scheme
Improve.
It's harder, because why?
Is is possibly because you don't find Big RR as interesting, so don't push the limits as much as you do in TTRR?
I don't enjoy BigRR, why would I even play it? If I wanted to improve, I could do so very easily and become a "pro". But there is not incentive, no ambition to play this boring scheme, imo
You can practice BigRR for the next 2 years, and I will barely play any, then we can have a challenge, and if you beat me, then you can say checkmate, until then your all talk.I don't enjoy BigRR, why would I even play it? If I wanted to improve, I could do so very easily and become a "pro". But there is not incentive, no ambition to play this boring scheme, imo
I don't enjoy TTRR, why would I even play it? If I wanted to improve, I could do so very easily and become a "pro". But there is not incentive, no ambition to play this boring scheme, imo
Checkmate.
There is no risk in Warmer.Same with BigRR, "checkmate"
You can have 10 bad turns then do the best turn of all time, then do another 10 bad turns.
You kind of ejaculated too early there sock lol.Big RR isn't a real scheme, I can lose, but I will never lose to you. checkmate! :D It is basically a big long linear wxw warmer with a start and finish sign, idk why they have these start and finish signs on here though, waste of map space for the long warmer maze! :P
How is there no risk in Big RR lol? You can lose, you can't lose a Warmer, jesus did you really just say something that stupid?
Edit - Also if we done that, I would practise TTRR for 2 years, you would practise Big RR for 2 years, i'd win TTRR you would win Big RR.
I've already beat you in Big RR(not officially though), and i've beat you in Roper before.I'm in AG anytime you are ready bro, maybe sensei can stream it possibly now, don't know if he's available. Don't worry, I'll be gentle.
Besides, you are slow in Big RR compared to how fast I can go, when I can master how fast I can potentially go, you wouldn't come close to me, i'm practising cross handed roping right now so yeah I suck, but in 6 months i'll destroy you.
Even when I rope normal I can still move around a Big RR faster than you, you aren't really fast, but damn you are efficient :)
Ready for what? I said i've beat you before I didn't say I am gonna beat you right now, you know i've been focusing on roping cross handed for the past month or so.Your like a boxer or MMA fighter that doesn't take the challenge right away because he is scared. I get it man, no need to be nervous. Take all the time you need. I only make friendly bets, not for money, sorry.
I don't want to ruin my progress by focusing on normal roping right now, I mean, i'll play you right now if you want but I ain't gonna say i'll win because I won't be comfortable, i'd rather you just wait the until I get to where I want to be, because I have set targets for myself, then i'd challenge you for real, can even put money on it.
Ready for what? I said i've beat you before I didn't say I am gonna beat you right now, you know i've been focusing on roping cross handed for the past month or so.And btw, you just think you can move faster than me, you can't actually move faster than me when I try to move fast, and I am more efficient = no contest :)
I don't want to ruin my progress by focusing on normal roping right now, I mean, i'll play you right now if you want but I ain't gonna say i'll win because I won't be comfortable, i'd rather you just wait the until I get to where I want to be, because I have set targets for myself, then i'd challenge you for real, can even put money on it.
And just incase you didn't get what I said above, I can move faster than you, but you are more efficient than me right now because you play more serious.
No, i'm a person who doesn't like to waste his time.And you think I am a kid? All you said is that your faster than me, I don't know what that means where you from but from around here, that is trying to prove or say something. And my response is, get a live stream right now, we can do warmer, BigRR, TTRR, and get a panel of judges to see who goes faster. Unless you don't feel "comfortable" enough.
I am not here to prove if I am or am not better than you, all I said was I am faster than you, but you are more efficient, once I learn to control that speed better, i'll destroy you.
Unless you actually get better as well in that time obviously.
So obviously you would win right now if you even play half good, because i'd probably fall, I haven't played normal for a while, and i've only been doing cross for a little while, so your challenge is pretty stupid really.
I am not in a place where I feel I am good enough to be challenging people.
You can't understand that? I am not a kid, I don't need to prove how good I am to anyone, I ain't Zalo ;)
I'm not trying to swing my willy around and claim I'm among the best at anything, but in my opinion Big RR is far less difficult than TTRR. In Big RR even a noob can learn to max out the rope speed, for the most part, within a year. In TTRR all except the very best players rope safely because it's faster for them to do so. I think y'all have forgotten how amazing Mablak was at TTRR. He would do crazy pump climbs and scrolls all over the place and rarely fall. TTRR has basically an infinite skill ceiling, the ideal (impossible) run resembling a TAS run. It is much harder to time speedy maneuvers on short ropes. In Big RR everyone can maintain full speed all the time without having to operate very close to the margins. Same goes for WXW. TTRR fell out of favor precisely because nobody could compete with the top players... in Big RR I haven't seen nearly that kind of skill divide.I agree joe, you can see his latest replays in the latest challenges section if you want. Here is the latest https://www.tus-wa.com/challenges/challenge-747/
However I haven't seen those Masta Big RR replays people keep mentioning. He's a great roper so I'm sure they are pretty impressive. Could someone link a couple?
As far as Masta goes, I'm not trying to throw any shade but meh. I don't care about offline challenges. If you're not actively on WormNET owning people in multiplayer on at least a semi-regular basis, I couldn't give a crap about any accomplishments you may have. I haven't seen Masta on WormNET in at least 2 years, except for one possible time in which I am fairly sure I played vs. him in Big RR using an alias, but it's entirely possible that I could be wrong. Masta's 'legendary' status comes from offline challenges and nothing else. (In other words, replaying the same map a hundred times until you get a perfect run.) I'm seriously not trying to sound like a hater here, I'm just speaking how I feel.You are wrong, masta is the best overall roper in the game and has been for some time, we played plenty over the past few years when i was still active. Pretty sure hes bored of owning the noobs that play nowadays, so offline challenges present an actual test to push his roping. Maybe since we didn't get daina-zalo, we can have masta-skunk3 instead?
I'm not trying to swing my willy around and claim I'm among the best at anything, because I'm not, but in my opinion Big RR is far less difficult than TTRR. In Big RR even a noob can learn to max out the rope speed, for the most part, within a year. In TTRR all except the very best players rope safely because it's faster for them to do so. I think y'all have forgotten how amazing Mablak was at TTRR. He would do crazy pump climbs and scrolls all over the place and rarely fall. TTRR has basically an infinite skill ceiling, the ideal (impossible) run resembling a TAS run. It is much harder to time speedy maneuvers on short ropes. In Big RR everyone can maintain full speed all the time without having to operate very close to the margins. Same goes for WXW. TTRR fell out of favor precisely because nobody could compete with the top players... in Big RR I haven't seen nearly that kind of skill divide.
However I haven't seen those Masta Big RR replays people keep mentioning. He's a great roper so I'm sure they are pretty impressive. Could someone link a couple?
I guess bigrr is like billiards and ttrr is like snooker...
billiards is more accesible for most, while snooker requires more precise control
oldsock I just asked if you wanted to do a couple of Big RRs and you said no unless it's a bet...Sure, let's have a game.
I'm quite happy to do a serious game with you and see how I stack up right now, because in my head, i'm not good right now, you claim you are, so if I can even get fairly equal with you in this state, i'm pretty confident i'll beat you when i've had practise.
Let's do 2 please, I wanna do 1 normal and 1 cross handed, see if I can beat myself cross yet as well lol, i'm in a game with salty and fen right now, come AG we'll be finished in a few turns.sounds good!
oldsock I just asked if you wanted to do a couple of Big RRs and you said no unless it's a bet...I never said unless a bet, I don't even bet anymore :)
I'm quite happy to do a serious game with you and see how I stack up right now, because in my head, i'm not good right now, you claim you are, so if I can even get fairly equal with you in this state, i'm pretty confident i'll beat you when i've had practise.
what I can say with 100% honesty is that I actively play W:A and I play a shitload of Big RR and there's only a handful of people who can rival me when I am warmed up. I'd say that most of my Big RR losses in the last year or so have come from Dibz, and like 90%+ of those games are literally my first game of the day.
I'll gladly take on anyone in Big RR any time.
This is the kind of stuff that is missing from W:A. People competing who is better, bonus points that it's about roping. If more people show that passion it might reignite my desire to play again. I am always lurking and following.I challenge you to 50 ttrrs!
what I can say with 100% honesty is that I actively play W:A and I play a shitload of Big RR and there's only a handful of people who can rival me when I am warmed up. I'd say that most of my Big RR losses in the last year or so have come from Dibz, and like 90%+ of those games are literally my first game of the day.I'll gladly take on anyone in Big RR any time.
I'll be honest and say I never thought of you as more than a mediocre roper.
Would be fun to see how you cope with guys such as: SiD, Masta, saltyk9, TheWalrus.. There are also bunch of less known ropers around. Shtaket being one of them. Sock is not that familiar or in love with the scheme, but he seems pretty fired up for some battles.
Anyway, I think your statement of being in the tippity top of Big RR community is a bit exaggarated. But respect your decision to play anyone who challenges you. At least you're sticking with your word.
If this is gonna be next big thing, I can stream so more ppl can watch live. Gl
sock, please play skunk again, he played very poor compared to his other games.Anytime skunk3 would like some more of this, he's more than welcome. As for you, I've unfinished business with you, so get some rest.
Also, I wanna rematch with you, cuz neither of us played our peak either.
oldsock, I will hopefully be playing you like 1000 games over the next 6 months, would be nice to have someone who actually wants to compete and see who can end up better :)Imma take a guess..
Sock I'm not making excuses but my game with you was hands down the worst I have roped all day, including the games I played with everyone else before you. I had just played several 1 vs 1 rr's right before you and was kinda burned out.Don't worry, i understand...
skunk3 can you attach some replay of your games with Masta?
Well it's just a suggestion it's not an obsession Ryan.
I just remember the days of 3 schemes in WACL and it was pretty awesome.
Wow really? I only ever saw people pick BnG Roper and Elite in WACL and CL2K back in 1999/2000...
I can't ever remember any those other schemes you mentioned being played, I didn't even know Forts was a thing back then in Leagues and didn't even think RR was invented till like 2000 or 2001 lol.
Perhaps that's part of the community I didn't see because I was so focused on Warmers and Ropers.
WACL:
- Battle Race
- BnG
- Fort
- Pro
- Roper
- Rope Race
- Team17
Source: http://web.archive.org/web/20010707075917/http://www.wa-forum.com/waclfiles.htm
So that was December 2000, wow...
I remember the day I discovered Worms Armageddon, it was also the first time I used a PC for games and discovered the internet, 12-17th June 1999...(Forget exact day now)
I remember that day clearly, with my mates John and Gary, it was hot, we were in shorts and t-shirts, my friend John told us about the "Interesk Cyber Cafe", I was like woah that sounds cool, so he took us there and I remember walking in just feeling this overwhelming sense of WOW!
So I walked up the corridor which had 5 computers, the 1st guy was playing Diablo, the next guy was playing Command & Conquer, then the guy who works there, Alex, was on the 3rd computer playing Worms and my eyes lit up, I was like "Hey, I have that on my Game Boy!", and since he was a like a youth worker he took interest and asked if I wanted to play so I took a seat and he joined a game in #AnythingGoes, at that point I was like, "Wait, are you playing this with other people??" he was like yeah, that guy is from UK, that guy is from US...
THAT! Blew my mind! So we started the game, I think it was Intermediate scheme or something, cuz we had special weapons and I had HHG, I actually won that game with the last move and took everyone out with the HHG! I was absolutely hooked, so I spent the whole summer at that cafe playing Worms for like 2-3 hours a day, it was a matter of weeks before I discovered Roper when I say "eliteboyz" who later became "TheSheriFF" roping, he wasn't the rope god he eventually became at that point but he was pretty good I remember feeling like it was the most awesome f@#!ing thing I ever saw in my life!
So yeah I started getting involved in Ropers then within days played my first Warmer, few months later I joined a clan but honestly forget which, or maybe that is when I made BDD - Bringers of Death and Destruction, Dodgefreak was in that clan with me, so was avatar and a few other pretty good players, I actually forget who was in that clan now...
So yeah I saw a lot of Elites and BnG being played in the Clanners I played/watched, but I never ever saw any other scheme being picked until around 2002+
Probably because I exclusively stuck to Rope for the first 4-5 years then switched exclusively to BnG until a few years into TuS where I started Roping again, but ever since I started playing BnG, i've never been as good in Rope as I was back then, i'm hoping to become even better than I was back then roping cross handed, but honestly I was doing a TT Big RR with blitz last night for like 6 hours straight and I only finished the map once, at my furthest point I was faster than blitz but honestly most turns I couldn't even last 20-30 seconds and I feel quite depressed I can't do it like I used to, but, it has only been about 6 weeks in total i've roped this way and it's a lot of fun, I forget it took almost 2 years to reach my peak when I first started so need to give my body time to adjust to swapping hands.
This is definitely interesting though, amazing to still learn history even having been there almost the entire time :)
So that was December 2000, wow...
I remember the day I discovered Worms Armageddon, it was also the first time I used a PC for games and discovered the internet, 12-17th June 1999...(Forget exact day now)
I remember that day clearly, with my mates John and Gary, it was hot, we were in shorts and t-shirts, my friend John told us about the "Interesk Cyber Cafe", I was like woah that sounds cool, so he took us there and I remember walking in just feeling this overwhelming sense of WOW!
So I walked up the corridor which had 5 computers, the 1st guy was playing Diablo, the next guy was playing Command & Conquer, then the guy who works there, Alex, was on the 3rd computer playing Worms and my eyes lit up, I was like "Hey, I have that on my Game Boy!", and since he was a like a youth worker he took interest and asked if I wanted to play so I took a seat and he joined a game in #AnythingGoes, at that point I was like, "Wait, are you playing this with other people??" he was like yeah, that guy is from UK, that guy is from US...
THAT! Blew my mind! So we started the game, I think it was Intermediate scheme or something, cuz we had special weapons and I had HHG, I actually won that game with the last move and took everyone out with the HHG! I was absolutely hooked, so I spent the whole summer at that cafe playing Worms for like 2-3 hours a day, it was a matter of weeks before I discovered Roper when I say "eliteboyz" who later became "TheSheriFF" roping, he wasn't the rope god he eventually became at that point but he was pretty good I remember feeling like it was the most awesome f@#!ing thing I ever saw in my life!
So yeah I started getting involved in Ropers then within days played my first Warmer, few months later I joined a clan but honestly forget which, or maybe that is when I made BDD - Bringers of Death and Destruction, Dodgefreak was in that clan with me, so was avatar and a few other pretty good players, I actually forget who was in that clan now...
So yeah I saw a lot of Elites and BnG being played in the Clanners I played/watched, but I never ever saw any other scheme being picked until around 2002+
Probably because I exclusively stuck to Rope for the first 4-5 years then switched exclusively to BnG until a few years into TuS where I started Roping again, but ever since I started playing BnG, i've never been as good in Rope as I was back then, i'm hoping to become even better than I was back then roping cross handed, but honestly I was doing a TT Big RR with blitz last night for like 6 hours straight and I only finished the map once, at my furthest point I was faster than blitz but honestly most turns I couldn't even last 20-30 seconds and I feel quite depressed I can't do it like I used to, but, it has only been about 6 weeks in total i've roped this way and it's a lot of fun, I forget it took almost 2 years to reach my peak when I first started so need to give my body time to adjust to swapping hands.
This is definitely interesting though, amazing to still learn history even having been there almost the entire time :)
I would love to time-travel back for one day and relive the experience back then. I think it would be awesome. Especially with all the knowledge you have now. :D
skunk, honestly the old me would absolutely annihilate me now at rope hahaha!
You always re-imagine old players, Cody was better than me in 2001 and he is better than me in 2019. You do revisionist history better than anyone I know. You can't beat me in a bo7 and i cant beat mablak in a bo7, so you are a few standard deviations from a worms pro. You'll get there if you spend half as much time talking about how great you used to be, as you claim your mastery to be. You have to play much more to jump up to the next tier, right now you are relegated to being a has been. You play one or two schemes well, but that doesn't give you carte blanche to say or do whatever you want, it just makes you into the next Zalo. Your lack of humility is incredibly annoying to me, nothing worse than a player who thinks he is way better than he is. I'll offer a paypal match which you will inevitably decline, but ill give you 10-1 odds on a bo7, you are that much of an underdog in a real competitive match. And you bet your ass I'll show up, unlike Zalo, and in not even in shape anymore, I don't play this game anymore. You won't back it up, though, I'm sure there will be some apologist reply by this time tomorrow.skunk, honestly the old me would absolutely annihilate me now at rope hahaha!
You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players. Generally speaking a player from today who has all those extra years of experience and practice would destroy their past self as well as most other people. You might be rusty at certain schemes that were more popular back then than today but overall I guarantee that a lot of those memories we have of godly players from way back in the day are heavily rose-tinted from our nostalgia glasses and that players only get better as time goes on, not worse. That's just my opinion, anyhow.
Of course people are different than others and some people can develop roughly the same amount of skill as someone else in far less time, which explains how some people who haven't been playing that long (relatively speaking) can hold their own against people who have been playing from day one, or close to it. I remember pre-Mablak Mablak, when he was just an average player. He was never godly at anything for the longest time... just another person and I played with him a bunch. Then in less than a year he went from an average player to an excellent player, which brings me back to my point that experience matters in Worms, as does routine practice. I am certain that if we took pretty much any good player from today and sent them back in time to WormNET in 99-00 they would utterly rape everyone, including those old names we miss so much.
Also, as an unrelated side note, I've noticed that if I play for an extended period of time and then take a break (a few months, maybe) from Worms I end up playing better than if I played straight through. I think that taking a break from Worms every once in a while is a good thing because some players (myself, at least) develop bad habits and when you can take a break and press the 'reset' button and come back to the game fresh you remember what you should and shouldn't do and those bad habits get dropped. I might be a little rusty for the first few days but eventually my skills come back and I play better than before because I can take all of that experience forward and start over again clean.
Also, as an unrelated side note, I've noticed that if I play for an extended period of time and then take a break (a few months, maybe) from Worms I end up playing better than if I played straight through. I think that taking a break from Worms every once in a while is a good thing because some players (myself, at least) develop bad habits and when you can take a break and press the 'reset' button and come back to the game fresh you remember what you should and shouldn't do and those bad habits get dropped.
<Cueshark> i found that after a long break from rr isn't so bad...you might forget a little about how to rope correctly but you also forget a little about roping incorrectly
skunk, honestly the old me would absolutely annihilate me now at rope hahaha!You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players.
You always re-imagine old players, Cody was better than me in 2001 and he is better than me in 2019. You do revisionist history better than anyone I know. You can't beat me in a bo7 and i cant beat mablak in a bo7, so you are a few standard deviations from a worms pro. You'll get there if you spend half as much time talking about how great you used to be, as you claim your mastery to be. You have to play much more to jump up to the next tier, right now you are relegated to being a has been. You play one or two schemes well, but that doesn't give you carte blanche to say or do whatever you want, it just makes you into the next Zalo. Your lack of humility is incredibly annoying to me, nothing worse than a player who thinks he is way better than he is. I'll offer a paypal match which you will inevitably decline, but ill give you 10-1 odds on a bo7, you are that much of an underdog in a real competitive match. And you bet your ass I'll show up, unlike Zalo, and in not even in shape anymore, I don't play this game anymore. You won't back it up, though, I'm sure there will be some apologist reply by this time tomorrow.skunk, honestly the old me would absolutely annihilate me now at rope hahaha!
You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players. Generally speaking a player from today who has all those extra years of experience and practice would destroy their past self as well as most other people. You might be rusty at certain schemes that were more popular back then than today but overall I guarantee that a lot of those memories we have of godly players from way back in the day are heavily rose-tinted from our nostalgia glasses and that players only get better as time goes on, not worse. That's just my opinion, anyhow.
Of course people are different than others and some people can develop roughly the same amount of skill as someone else in far less time, which explains how some people who haven't been playing that long (relatively speaking) can hold their own against people who have been playing from day one, or close to it. I remember pre-Mablak Mablak, when he was just an average player. He was never godly at anything for the longest time... just another person and I played with him a bunch. Then in less than a year he went from an average player to an excellent player, which brings me back to my point that experience matters in Worms, as does routine practice. I am certain that if we took pretty much any good player from today and sent them back in time to WormNET in 99-00 they would utterly rape everyone, including those old names we miss so much.
Also, as an unrelated side note, I've noticed that if I play for an extended period of time and then take a break (a few months, maybe) from Worms I end up playing better than if I played straight through. I think that taking a break from Worms every once in a while is a good thing because some players (myself, at least) develop bad habits and when you can take a break and press the 'reset' button and come back to the game fresh you remember what you should and shouldn't do and those bad habits get dropped. I might be a little rusty for the first few days but eventually my skills come back and I play better than before because I can take all of that experience forward and start over again clean.
Skill has gotten better, and you are blinded because you play nobodys all day in a deserted server.
skunk, honestly the old me would absolutely annihilate me now at rope hahaha!You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players.
This is beyond madness...
There is so much wrong with what you said it's frustrating choosing where to begin.
Well, to begin with, I said the old me would absolutely annihilate me now, not the old me would absolutely annihilate me if I practised for a year straight.
Next, I know myself and my experiences, that I experienced by the way, better than anyone.
I already explained my story earlier about how I exclusively switched schemes for like 10 years and very rarely ever roped during that whole period, and now even on TUS when I started to Rope again it was never the same without my old keyboard, not to mention i've just NEVER felt the passion that I felt back then, and that I was mostly picking BnG/Hysteria at every opportunity, I did get back into rope for 1-2 years when I was in cfc, but I still focused more on BnG.
Before BnG, I only focused on Rope, during BnG I focused on BnG, during TUS I played a lot of everything but spent a few years focused on mastering Darts as well.
Yeah you are right, people get better with time and practise, but I haven't spent my time practising, I can't believe that isn't obvious to you.
I had a funny vision, you on Jerry Springer right after he tells us his "Final Thought" and you turn round and try to convince the audience "What he meant to say was..."
In short, what I'm saying is that your current self should be capable of doing anything your past self was capable of and then some. This isn't like a physical sport where age plays a factor in declining ability.
You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players.
In short, what I'm saying is that your current self should be capable of doing anything your past self was capable of and then some. This isn't like a physical sport where age plays a factor in declining ability.
No, this is what you said, less than 4 hours ago:You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players.
Telling me I can be as good as I used to be, and that my mind and feelings are pretty much f**king useless are 2 completely different things.
And actually, age can decline, i've cracked my knuckles my whole life and just like my Mum told me as a little boy, I shouldn't have, for one...
I can't tap as good with my left hand as I used to, it hurts and seizes up, I used to be almost as good with my left as I am with my right, now it's not, which is why i'm so excited about learning cross now I don't have to actually cross my arms over.
In short, what I'm saying is that your current self should be capable of doing anything your past self was capable of and then some. This isn't like a physical sport where age plays a factor in declining ability.
No, this is what you said, less than 4 hours ago:You say that but what is more likely is that you felt more confident at rope back then because of your skill relative to that of other players.
Telling me I can be as good as I used to be, and that my mind and feelings are pretty much f**king useless are 2 completely different things.
And actually, age can decline, i've cracked my knuckles my whole life and just like my Mum told me as a little boy, I shouldn't have, for one...
I can't tap as good with my left hand as I used to, it hurts and seizes up, I used to be almost as good with my left as I am with my right, now it's not, which is why i'm so excited about learning cross now I don't have to actually cross my arms over.
Nah, honestly, f**k that, do NOT make the mistake of giving people far too much choice, it just splits everyone up even more.
All we need is a small handful of popular schemes, something that appeals to old and new players.
I could name at least 10 people off the top of my head that would stop playing if this system Chicken23 and skunk3 said was put into place.
Who honestly gives a f**k about 3 scheme PO when you still gotta put up with boring ass schemes you don't wanna waste your life playing?
Seriously, I could pick Darts, takes 5 minutes, then they pick Mole Shopper or Team17 or BattleRace and i'm stuck for at least 30 minutes absolutely bored out my f**king skull, as would most people be, you can do a lot in your life in 30 minutes man, a lot of people have a lot of reasons for quitting, but I am very confident that's a big one, being forced to play schemes you don't like for their pick, then being insulted when you want to give a free win.
What's worse, someone not wanting to waste their time, or someone noob bashing someone that actually hates that scheme?
I've already said my piece so I won't propose more ideas because that's my personal favourite I suggested.
Nah, honestly, f**k that, do NOT make the mistake of giving people far too much choice, it just splits everyone up even more.
All we need is a small handful of popular schemes, something that appeals to old and new players.
I could name at least 10 people off the top of my head that would stop playing if this system Chicken23 and skunk3 said was put into place.
Who honestly gives a f**k about 3 scheme PO when you still gotta put up with boring ass schemes you don't wanna waste your life playing?
Seriously, I could pick Darts, takes 5 minutes, then they pick Mole Shopper or Team17 or BattleRace and i'm stuck for at least 30 minutes absolutely bored out my f**king skull, as would most people be, you can do a lot in your life in 30 minutes man, a lot of people have a lot of reasons for quitting, but I am very confident that's a big one, being forced to play schemes you don't like for their pick, then being insulted when you want to give a free win.
What's worse, someone not wanting to waste their time, or someone noob bashing someone that actually hates that scheme?
I've already said my piece so I won't propose more ideas because that's my personal favourite I suggested.
If you want people to play league games you have to entice them to do so. Older/veteran players would likely be fine with a league with a handful of scheme options, especially if the scheme picks made sense. However, never players are going to want to play the schemes that they know and enjoy. Also, regardless of what handful of schemes are picked for the league, I don't see that decision as enticing any currently inactive veteran players to become active. Do you? The people who are inactive right now aren't inactive because of the format of the league, mostly. They've stopped playing because of life issues, other games taking over interest and time, and lack of desire to play due to other people not playing.
We all know what are the most popular schemes on WormNET these days, and if we don't cater to those schemes then we cannot possibly expect the league to be active. It's as simple as that. Whether some of those schemes are boring and/or take a while to play is irrelevant to the stated overall goal. Why should Darts be an allowed scheme pick when T17 is bemoaned? What is 'boring' is pretty subjective when it comes to Worms if you ask me. I think that BnG is the most boring scheme ever and I'm not advocating removing it. IMO schemes like mole shopper, SSR, intermediate, classic, and wxw and/or shopper should definitely be a part of the league because that's what people play.
I don't see an option that can please everyone. I still say that we should focus on league shit after we address the primary problem, which is player inactivity. If more people post to TUS saying "I'm back!" and show up in AG to play games and whatnot, that will drum up more interest than a league format change.
You were away for too long Chicken23 :D
There is all-round ladder. Rope and default ladders are just on top of that. Inter and Big RR are already in the all-round (Classic) league.
Seasons were 60 days for a long time. Only after the rope and default ladders were introduced the all-round season was lengthend. Activity had dropped well before that.
Playoffs are already possible with 4 players.
I don't think more schemes or a different point system would help at all. People on WormNet are not interested in playing in a league and if they are, they don't want to play Classic league schemes. You could make a league with Mole Shopper, Shopper and Intermediate, for example, but I'm not sure if even that would bring new players. Btw, I asked players who participated in Mole Shopper cups if they were interested in a Mole Shopper league and only 6 were interested.
Inter and Big RR were removed from Free league when they were added in Allround league (and in default/rope). No scheme is in both Allround and Free league. When you play Inter, for example, the game is counted in both default and allround. Rope and default ladders give people another incentive to participate in the allround league. I'm sure many haven't even read the announcement regarding rope & default ladders so they don't know how everything works. I agree it's a bit complex system but activity isn't being split between leagues.Well if activity is low, why remove classic schemes?
Allround seasons were 3 months long. Activity had dropped close to zero and there was no hope of playoffs. Instead of starting a new season every 3 months, MI decided to make the season indefinitely long so that people could still report their games.
I still don't believe the allround league would become any more appealing to newcomers if we added Mole Shopper etc. You'd also need to remove most of the Classic league schemes.
Inter and Big RR were removed from Free league when they were added in Allround league (and in default/rope). No scheme is in both Allround and Free league. When you play Inter, for example, the game is counted in both default and allround. Rope and default ladders give people another incentive to participate in the allround league. I'm sure many haven't even read the announcement regarding rope & default ladders so they don't know how everything works. I agree it's a bit complex system but activity isn't being split between leagues.Well if activity is low, why remove classic schemes?
Allround seasons were 3 months long. Activity had dropped close to zero and there was no hope of playoffs. Instead of starting a new season every 3 months, MI decided to make the season indefinitely long so that people could still report their games.
I still don't believe the allround league would become any more appealing to newcomers if we added Mole Shopper etc. You'd also need to remove most of the Classic league schemes.
Just open the flood gates, anything goes. Playerbase (competitive) too small to limit schemes.ya
put aerial into classic then we got something
lets open the flood gates, add ariel to classic, mole shooper and other popular schemesmole shopper and aerial into classic, 90 days, sounds good to me.
reduce the season length, try 90 days again...
i think you need some motivation to play and a really long season is the opposite of that for anyone who is playing to try and make playoffs.
There is literally nothing to lose and with this little activity putting all the schemes in 1 pot to encourage the new players is fine.
Everyone is playing their gay ass Rocket League, Fortnite, etc.
Everyone is playing their gay ass Rocket League, Fortnite, etc.What's wrong with Rocket League? xd
Everyone is playing their gay ass Rocket League, Fortnite, etc.
i second this, should happenlets open the flood gates, add ariel to classic, mole shooper and other popular schemesmole shopper and aerial into classic, 90 days, sounds good to me.
reduce the season length, try 90 days again...
i think you need some motivation to play and a really long season is the opposite of that for anyone who is playing to try and make playoffs.
There is literally nothing to lose and with this little activity putting all the schemes in 1 pot to encourage the new players is fine.
So the consesus about the league is: It's dead and nothing will change that? xD
:(
i just want to be able to find a tus or competitive game on the odd occasion when i come online, but i can't be the sole driver of sitting on ag and always being active to try and keep WA. I love worms and don't want to see competitive leagues die, but it needs everyone working in the same direction and some collective mind set to make it enjoyable enough for us to either all come back, or motivate new players to want to play 'league' style.
There needs to be some kind of action or vote, and i think maybe enough people here would vote for shorter seasons and adding kaos, arieal and mole shopper at a minimum?There was dozens of polls and tryouts to make league active again. Not many of ppl are interested anymore. Lots of schemes still needs corrections but we can't even get that going. As I've mentioned few times - of all community only around 40 ppl voted in that poll about new update release.. And 80% of them voted "NO!"
:(
i just want to be able to find a tus or competitive game on the odd occasion when i come online, but i can't be the sole driver of sitting on ag and always being active to try and keep WA. I love worms and don't want to see competitive leagues die, but it needs everyone working in the same direction and some collective mind set to make it enjoyable enough for us to either all come back, or motivate new players to want to play 'league' style.
Probably wasn't your intention but I saw this post as: "my time is more precious than yours so you rather sit in ag and make stuff happen so I can come in once a week and get some instant games going.."
Some of us are tired of trying to convince oldschool to get back. ;)
There was dozens of polls and tryouts to make league active again. Not many of ppl are interested anymore. Lots of schemes still needs corrections but we can't even get that going. As I've mentioned few times - of all community only around 40 ppl voted in that poll about new update release.. And 80% of them voted "NO!"
What else is there to say!? :D
Although, I would be the last to say it's over. Will support any ideas that might actually get us somewhere. But lets stop recycling posts. Twitters, reddits, twitch, compilations, videos, promotions. Surely there are ppl in community that can get some new faces, playing on nostalgia card. Saw it, did it. It's possible. But I don't have skills nor resources for attracting larger amount of newbies.
I think the real question that needs to be asked is of the inactive players: What would you NEED to see implemented to become seriously active again?
I think the real question that needs to be asked is of the inactive players: What would you NEED to see implemented to become seriously active again?
Personally, for me, i'd play singles if the league was simplified into 3 schemes, but i'd have to personally like those 3 schemes as well.
And that's an option I don't think many people would like to see lol.
While the pro league could consist of these schemes: Elite, RR, BnG & ZaR.
While the pro league could consist of these schemes: Elite, RR, BnG & ZaR.
Pro league containing a scheme with no chute, 0 sec mines and.. what, 12-13 sec for turn?
Not to mention roper hides and wind affecting turns when zook is only weapon you can use.
Might as well rename it to masochistic league.
i think reducing season length to 2 months and a change on the visual experience of browsing and navigating the site for first time users will improve things, MI has agreed to making it a bit more simply to see the most active and current league. It might be worth hiding TEL, rope league and all those other variations somewhere for historical data browsing and not to overwhelm us with so many links and places to go...I'd definitely say less PO spots, 4 sounds great, more activity to fight to get into playoffs (in theory). The interface is confusing and the standings are hard to figure out, it definitely needs streamlining, I had trouble finding current season and so forth. Allround should be merged with classic, one set of standings that you get pointed to. Currently you have to select the current season from the bar to view standings, it defaults to season 55 of classic.
I like the idea of scheme classes, but i personally would only enforce them at a PO stage? And the POs could be very minimum at this stage due to active of only 4 playoff spots? Bo3 or Bo5 from the different 'classes'? Whatever those classes are is indeed up to debate and probably should be done in a separate topic.
I don't see an issue in including moleshopper and ariel into the mix personally, but i do understand the point of views of people saying its too many schemes to master, however it doesn't matter if you can't master them all surely? Because you make up your skills in another area, and as long as the playoffs have the right 'classes' you'll be ok knowing that if someone was the best ariel/hysteria player in POs, you've still got a chance to pick elite/inter, roper, or ttrr/bigrr if you know what i mean?
finding the right class groups won't be easy.. but lets worry about that in the POs and see if we get increased activity? even if POs are picking an approved scheme in order, and as long as the highest seed player has first choice, its still fair and the best allrounder should still win?
If an allrounder today means being pro in moleshop and ariel then so be it, they are the more active player and popular schemes on WA and PO seeds will be determined by your activity and skill level which should reflect the current state of wormnet right? The league should represent what people are playing in AG and people are still playing classic and people are playing newer schemes, so lets have an inclusive league of what represents today's wn. I've got no issues with someone who totally owns these new schemes being in POs because they deserve their place there for taking the time to learn and enjoy that scheme.
its just the same as 10 years ago, technical experts in one scheme like ryan and lordhound in rr, or komodo in bng could nearly get a 100% win, but thats why we've got rating schemes now to encourage allround activity. Imagine if mablak and random00 were active with all their allrounder schemes maxed out with elite rating, add a new scheme and they would need to train and learn it before seeing that rating increase, so a pro in moleshopper, at somepoint is going to start picking their weaker schemes if interested in points to be champion of wa.
thinking about this more, with 2 month seasons, 4 place POs and maybe 30 games to reach POs spot, highest points earn a PO spot. That would be enough to sustain a league and system perhaps for todays level of activity? Players like dibz, oldsock, csongi, sentator, etc could easily play enough games to have POs and be the season champion again and that might be enough to encourage old players to return, but newer players to take part, especially if schemes in that system included schemes they enjoyed. Look at the tournaments, they are still active and popular, WA isn't dying, its just evolving and we need a league that represents the interest of todays players, but new gen and classic.
I like the idea of scheme classes, but i personally would only enforce them at a PO stage? And the POs could be very minimum at this stage due to active of only 4 playoff spots? Bo3 or Bo5 from the different 'classes'? Whatever those classes are is indeed up to debate and probably should be done in a separate topic.
This is how it works, Keep it Simple, KIS- KEEP IT SIMPLE. Only way a league or life works well and enjoyable.
We might be able to get anubis on board, but komodo's I think is in a more 1 scheme league or two leagues that have 1 scheme each domination mode idea he's got in his head I think. Komodo want to play his bigrr, roper league, while not dealing with playing games like ttrr with people, he hasn't got time for that such thing, and such things bore him to death.This is how it works, Keep it Simple, KIS- KEEP IT SIMPLE. Only way a league or life works well and enjoyable.
please! lets do it and lets get komodo and anubis and others playing and trying to be the best wormer again! i could probably manage 30 games a season and maybe more if i had something to play for, and thats a PO spot. If activity gets too high we can increase PO spots or game limit to reach POs.
I never have nor ever will try to be the best wormer, I only got good at things cuz I enjoy them and became obsessed with learning them/creating new ways.We all know you prefer these schemes man you been saying it forever, exactly what i am talking about
Actually sock, my favourite idea so far, which was my own suggestion, which I said would be make a 3 scheme league:
Big RR or WxW
Hysteria or Aerial
Elite or Intermediate
2nd to that, I prefer the idea spleen17 came up with.
I don't know why I even bother talking to you anymore, you've lost the plot man.
Personally, I think Chickens idea is ridiculous in this day and age of WA, but at least he's trying.
I've only ever played like a dozen Aerials, and even less Intermediate games.Yeah, everyone else. You've have been saying what you prefer for the past 20 years.
If it were my choice alone, and everyone happily accepted whatever I choose, that wouldn't be my choice.
Why does what I prefer matter? Everyone else is saying what they prefer, what's the problem?
I've only ever played like a dozen Aerials, and even less Intermediate games.Yeah, everyone else. You've have been saying what you prefer for the past 20 years.
If it were my choice alone, and everyone happily accepted whatever I choose, that wouldn't be my choice.
Why does what I prefer matter? Everyone else is saying what they prefer, what's the problem?
While it's nice to hear about the cleaner navigation, and also seeing change, it's quite disappointing to have such a change made without even so much as a vote, regardless if it's something we want or not, it would feel nice to at least have something implemented by seeing a vast majority winning a vote even if you voted for the losing side...
Why can't we just wait, and do some manual advertising and question the actual community to see what they want first? I'd definitely support any setup as long as I saw evidence that is what the majority of people wanted.
20:55:07 KRD: Basically, it depends on the sort of league you want to be.
20:56:03 KRD: And it sounds to me like your line of thinking is that the community right now would more readily accept a single-scheme league than an all-around one.
20:56:37 KRD: But if it was me and I was launching a proper all-around league, I wouldn't let current scheme popularity dictate too much.
20:57:33 KRD: Because basically your product isn't a place where people can (or can't) play certain schemes. Rather, it's a place where they can play WA competitively.
20:57:41 KRD: So I'd just support the most competitive schemes.
20:58:05 KRD: And I think that's a reasonably constant thing, not something that changes over time.
and also fifth biggest roping community on Worms.
and also fifth biggest roping community on Worms.
That really made me laugh...
I like ZaR, and I like you, but 5th biggest roping community is hardly an achievement to use as a reason to introduce ZaR to the League lol.
lets just keep it simple
4 PO spots
add koas/arieal/moleshopper
60 day seasons (30 months)
rolling seasons (no break between them)
clean navigation across site to main league
30 games minium to reach POs (even if someone is not as active as others, a high winning percentage will award them with PO spot - look at almog who wasn't that active compared to others but consistently managed to reach POs when league was ok)
Some PO system of highest seed picks first
ps. there is 9 days until the new season, can we do all these changes in time? I'd personally be motivated to search for tus if the above was introduced and honestly, WA has always been a passion in my life, i've explained the situation to my wife of the dying competition and she understands if i platy worms again... :o ;D :P
Lets just try those changes and see what happens next before we get lost in PO classes etc
Yeah but i'm not sitting here suggesting Darts or BnG or anything lol.
You had a David Brent moment, it's ok Kradie :D
Also, like I haven't been online for a few months now really, but during my past active periods, I really only saw you and maybe 2 or 3 other guys hosting ZaR.
I think it's a good scheme by the way, but Roper is definitely still more popular.
12 seconds, no parachute, crazy maps, zook only... Most games I see are decided after like 2 turns each... I think this is not a scheme to attract noobs at all.
I think Roper got less and less popular as the maps got crazier and more evil, and more decided by luck.
zook being the only weapon as well, that gets pretty boring when you are used to grenade/mine as well for so many years.
I see ZaR as a simplified, stripped down version of Roper, yes it's fun, yes it's competitive, if it would honestly bring more popularity into the League, i'd support it, but this is simply my opinion, it's not fact or anything, and I don't want it as a main League scheme, ever.ZaR is literally stripped down version, in order to make it more difficult (Opinion).
Komodo, you don't take time to get to know people from WA. You sit there up in your high tower with your Nostalgia goggles, and make decision that best suit yourself.
Personally I don't think the changes does much. The main problem of the league is the lack of new blood. We are all older and more busy with our lives. Even if some of us try to play leagues again it would be for a short time until we get inactive again.
If you have any plans to attract newcomers and teach them how the league works though...
The real problem is that I fear that you might delete the Classic games, or at least make them harder to access.lets just keep it simple
4 PO spots
add koas/arieal/moleshopper
60 day seasons (30 months)
rolling seasons (no break between them)
clean navigation across site to main league
30 games minium to reach POs (even if someone is not as active as others, a high winning percentage will award them with PO spot - look at almog who wasn't that active compared to others but consistently managed to reach POs when league was ok)
Some PO system of highest seed picks first
ps. there is 9 days until the new season, can we do all these changes in time? I'd personally be motivated to search for tus if the above was introduced and honestly, WA has always been a passion in my life, i've explained the situation to my wife of the dying competition and she understands if i platy worms again... :o ;D :P
Lets just try those changes and see what happens next before we get lost in PO classes etc
4 PO spots:
it is currently like that. It picks 4, 8 or 16 based on activity. So if the activity is low, it will automatically go for 4.
add koas/arieal/moleshopper:
Kaos is not popular and doesn't run on standard game settings and will be hard for newcomers to get it running.
Members who play moleshopper usually play mostly moleshopper.
rolling seasons (no break between them):
It's already like that. Current season got extended because there was no activity and no reason to start a new season so I just extended it so people can report.
clean navigation across site to main league:
All old leagues will be removed from the menus.
30 games minium to reach POs:
No problem.
Some PO system of highest seed picks first:
It is already like that.
Personally I don't think the changes does much. The main problem of the league is the lack of new blood. We are all older and more busy with our lives. Even if some of us try to play leagues again it would be for a short time until we get inactive again.
If you have any plans to attract newcomers and teach them how the league works though...
and also fifth biggest roping community on Worms.
That really made me laugh...
I like ZaR, and I like you, but 5th biggest roping community is hardly an achievement to use as a reason to introduce ZaR to the League lol.
Personally I don't think the changes does much. The main problem of the league is the lack of new blood. We are all older and more busy with our lives. Even if some of us try to play leagues again it would be for a short time until we get inactive again.
If you have any plans to attract newcomers and teach them how the league works though...
I like the idea of scheme classes, but i personally would only enforce them at a PO stage? And the POs could be very minimum at this stage due to active of only 4 playoff spots? Bo3 or Bo5 from the different 'classes'? Whatever those classes are is indeed up to debate and probably should be done in a separate topic.
I think there was a max of no more than 3 rope based schemes?
Also wxw and shopper could be grouped into another class, so if someone picked shopper, wxw couldn't be picked?
Come on Chicken23! Roper and WxW are one of the most obvious couples in Allround league. WxW has been a Roper duplicate for a long time (since we've had hard WxW maps). It has been explained in other threads before.
What's unique in T17 and Shopper is that you start with no weapons and must make the most of what you get. That's why they have a separate class and shouldn't be picked both. Big RR with TTRR is also controversial because the roping technique is closer to WxW/Roper. The reason why it's with TTRR is that they are both racing schemes and there's no battle.
I always thought of WxW of it as more of a combination of Shopper & TTRR
Big RR shares the same techniques as WxW in terms of actual roping around, not attacking of course.
I don't even come close to understanding why you called it a Roper duplicate, any chance of elaborating on that?
You're still doing the same thing, roping very fast from A to B and then try to get an attack in, and after that, you pile, not to mention how the skills translate, in real WxW maps (those that barely give you enough time to attack) usually the best roper wins, as opposed to the best shopper (who is a totally different scheme in which time is spent in strategically using the weapons as opposed from roping from point to point). And really, most of the attacks in WxW are not different from roper, you barely get there and attack with whatever you can. Surely you can punish mistakes easier because it's easier to pile worms together and break havok in WxW, but on high skill level, it usually come downs to roping skill and crate luck, the way you attack is irrelevant because most of the time you're only gonna get one worm and if you can hit with a zook you can hit with a sheep, the only difference in the damage dealt, which is what makes WxW luck based, in part, but all down to roping.
Now I do agree that the roping style might seem more similar to that in RR because both maps use straight lines but not really, as you're doing mostly kicks, spikes and scrolling at full speed, something not very present in RR. I do consider roper to be the best part of roping but you just can't ignore the similarities.
We used to have a problem, that WxW and Roper were too similar to guarantee each being a scheme in classic league.
Now you've gone and made them even more similar to the point where WxW is simply a roper in linear maps, whilst Roper is a WxW in a random map.
And I've heard many opinions claiming WxW is similar to Roper, which I didn't think was justified at first, but with the advent of more difficult WxW maps, there's not much difference anymore.
So you thought of WxW as a combination of Big RR and Shopper, right? :P
I say WxW is closer to Big RR/Shopper than Roper because of how you actually rope around
I guess it comes down to which perspective you look at it then
I see you did too because you put WxW in the same group with Roper etc and Shopper in the same group with T17 etc. How could you after that say that WxW is actually closer to Shopper than Roper? ;)
Players can pick
2 of BnG, Hysteria, Aerial
2 of Elite, Intermediate, Team17, Shopper
2 of TTRR, Roper, WxW, Big RR
For example, if you pick Elite and your opponent picks Shopper, you can't pick Intermediate or Team17 anymore.
I asked MI and he said we could add the rule Komo and I were talking about.It seems okay, but I'm not sure what it is exactly accomplishing. Does this make it fundamentally better? I've never walked away from a PO series thinking I've been screwed by picks. Sometimes I've wished I had 3 picks instead of 2, but that is what is important about playoff seeding and attaining a good spot in the standings.QuotePlayers can pickIs this a good idea?
2 of BnG, Hysteria, Aerial
2 of Elite, Intermediate, Team17, Shopper
2 of TTRR, Roper, WxW, Big RR
For example, if you pick Elite and your opponent picks Shopper, you can't pick Intermediate or Team17 anymore.
Players can pick
2 of BnG, Hysteria, Aerial
2 of Elite, Intermediate, Team17, Shopper
2 of TTRR, Roper, WxW, Big RR
For example, if you pick Elite and your opponent picks Shopper, you can't pick Intermediate or Team17 anymore.
It seems okay, but I'm not sure what it is exactly accomplishing.
Sometimes I've wished I had 3 picks instead of 2, but that is what is important about playoff seeding and attaining a good spot in the standings.
I wouldn't be worried about the system not giving enough incentive to play. 1) there's a minimum game limit that can be adjusted 2) there's a limited number of PO spots 3) top seeded players get probably an easier opponent 4) the higher ranked player has still the advantage of choosing 3 schemes, he just can't pick the same scheme type 3 times.1.) Minimum game limit was already adjusted, its 30 currently, makes sense since there is less activity
if a player that isn't good at a particular scheme set, and has seed advantage, his final pick will be for the opponent, essentially. They will be forced to pick a scheme in the deciding match that more or less, the opponent will have the advantage, unless they picked their worst scheme set first, which doesn't make any sense unto itself either. Who wants to pick something they are shit at in the deciding game of a Bo5?
Also, non rope default players would be forced to choose rope for their last pick. Hardly makes for an exciting, competitive Bo5.
the only new players TUS has gotten to the league are usually specialists who play one or two schemes in allround, not all of them.
These new players who play one or two schemes are not even close to getting in playoffs so...
Playoffs certainly need some review of the rules.
Whats wrong with letting highest seed pick first, bo5 and all schemes in tus classic are available?
Playoffs certainly need some review of the rules.Whats wrong with letting highest seed pick first, bo5 and all schemes in tus classic are available?
???
I don't agree with the view that this rule would alienate non all-arounders. Firstly, a scheme specialist has a fair chance in Shopper/Elite/Aerial as I mentioned earlier. Secondly, this rule will more likely help scheme specialists because the opponent can't pick 3 x your biggest weakness. Players who play all the schemes are usually ranked higher and have the advantage of picking first.
In the Classic League, the first four games must include two rope based schemes (Rope Race, Roper, WxW/Shopper) and two normal schemes (BnG, Team17, Elite, Hysteria). The last game is picked by the higher ranked player and can be any of these schemes.
Ah now I understand :) Currently there are no rules at all. You can pick anything.
Shopper and WxW used to have a shared rating but they got separated in 2009. As WxW maps evolved, it was later grouped with Roper in "Allround league". There was a poll between two scheme class options and the one with Roper/WxW won over WxW/Shopper (see the picture below).
There was also a rule about scheme picks in playoffs but it was removed in 2011 I think.QuoteIn the Classic League, the first four games must include two rope based schemes (Rope Race, Roper, WxW/Shopper) and two normal schemes (BnG, Team17, Elite, Hysteria). The last game is picked by the higher ranked player and can be any of these schemes.
That rule was quite useless anyway. You could just pick WxW first and then TTRR + Roper.
Just changing the topic slightly.I think 50% win ratio should be waived with this few people in the league. There isn't a big pool of people and there is deserving players like chicken23 and oldsock that would be otherwise penalized for playing an inordinate amount of games against the top players in the league.
The current system requirements at the mid way point have pretty much given us POs for tus singles. we have 30 days for 1 more active person to get a 50% winning ratio.
What about clanners?! i'm seeing some games being played...
And whats your suggestion? What is the problem with the above? If highest seed player picks and has advantage to select 3 rope based schemes.. thats fair because they are the highest seeded player right?
Playoffs should represent the league in miniature and tell which player masters a set of different kind of schemes the best. We can accomplish that by having every scheme type played in a PO series.
Players can pick
2 of BnG, Hysteria, Aerial
2 of Elite, Intermediate, Team17, Shopper
2 of TTRR, Roper, WxW, Big RR
For example, if you pick Elite and your opponent picks Shopper, you can't pick Intermediate or Team17 anymore.
Players can pick
2 of BnG, Hysteria, Aerial
2 of Elite, Intermediate, Team17, Shopper
2 of TTRR, Roper, WxW, Big RR
For example, if you pick Elite and your opponent picks Shopper, you can't pick Intermediate or Team17 anymore.