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May 02, 2024, 03:42 PM

Author Topic: Team17 has announced Worms WMD  (Read 64265 times)

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Offline Tomtysti

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #345 on: June 03, 2016, 06:37 PM »
This is the pro scheme as it stands, of course subject to potential change before launch.

So the ranked scheme is currently:

bazooka
grenade
cluster bomb
shotgun x2
uzi x2
jetpack x1
parachute x2
sentry gun (or flamethrower?) x1 (3 turn delay)
firepunch
baseball bat x1 (4 turn delay)
prod
magnet x2
girder x2
dynamite x1 (4 turn delay)
mine x2
old lady x1 (5 turn delay)
air strike x1 (3 turn delay)
unwanted present x1 (4 turn delay)
ninja rope x3
blowtorch x4
teleport x1
worm select x1

Seems more interesting and balanced than the ranked schemes that I remember from the previous titles.

Thank you once again for sharing some info and answering questions, Jonno  :)
« Last Edit: June 03, 2016, 06:46 PM by Tomtysti »

Offline WTF-8

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #346 on: June 03, 2016, 06:51 PM »
hmmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?
The manual in the installation folder is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural

Offline StepS

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #347 on: June 03, 2016, 11:19 PM »
mmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?
I think it'd make sense to make the delay blue colour, yes.
Remember crew, this is an overview of the multiplayer!

Let's focus on the information you now have - more will be revealed as we move forward and everything is locked in :)
Something very important to remember is that once it's live, it'll be quite difficult to backtrack. If you changed the way the ranking system worked later, you'd have to be careful to preserve the achievements (as in, points) of those who would have already had earned them.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2016, 11:22 PM by StepS »
Dec 30 2013 23:59:44 <StepS> windowed mode isn't the only thing you need about frontend
Dec 30 2013 23:59:49 <StepS> you need it to be actually bigger
Dec 31 2013 00:00:13 <StepS> it actually is very small on my 15-inch full HD screen
Dec 31 2013 00:00:25 <StepS> while running at 640x480 or stretched mode makes it fuzzy
Dec 31 2013 00:00:44 <StepS> this problem has been around since the Worms Armageddon's release and no one has even tried to beat it
[...]

Offline goom

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #348 on: June 04, 2016, 01:20 AM »
hmmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?

mmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?
I think it'd make sense to make the delay blue colour, yes.

I was going to make a long post about this, but decided to do a picture instead.

thoughts?

i was considering using a 'clock/timer' instead of a lock symbol, but the numbers seemed much more legible on the latter.

Offline skunk3

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #349 on: June 04, 2016, 04:49 AM »
hmmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?

mmm, ammo and delay numbers got same color... ?
I think it'd make sense to make the delay blue colour, yes.

I was going to make a long post about this, but decided to do a picture instead.

thoughts?

i was considering using a 'clock/timer' instead of a lock symbol, but the numbers seemed much more legible on the latter.

Thumbs up.

Offline The Extremist

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #350 on: June 05, 2016, 06:18 AM »
Definitely, your rank should be based on the rank of the player you beat/lose to.  Meaning, you rank up faster when you beat a higher ranked player, and downrank faster when you lose to a lower ranked player.  This is how Elo* works.

*"Elo" is not an acronym, it's a man's name, so no all caps.

*******

Some good things have been said and shown of this game.  However, based on my experiences, both with Team17 and other game companies, I'm still cautious, maybe even a little worried.

Example #1: MechWarrior Online (Piranha Games)

MWO is based on a tabletop game with a very nerdy following.  Early in development, the team gave these hardcore fans every reason to believe that they were dedicated to making the game they wanted with balanced, deep, competitive gameplay.  But as development progressed, these promises were pretty much thrown out the window.  New features were added to appeal to casual players.  The balance was out of whack, and instead of listening to the best players, the team kept adding bandages that fixed some things and broke others.  This all culminated with the head of the company pretty much telling the hardcore fans to buzz off.

Example #2: Halo: The Master Chief Collection (Microsoft)

Prior to this re-release, the first Halo game (considered to be the most balanced) had never officially been online, and Halo 2 (with the most fondly remembered online mode) had been offline for some years.  Together with Halo 3 and 4, these were promised to be ported just as they were to Microsoft's latest console, along with HD upgrades and new content.  They talked a good talk during development, but actual game assets were sparse.  When it launched, the online barely worked, the entire collection was replete with bugs, and Halo 1 and 2 were based on their inferior PC ports rather than the original, award-winning console releases.  Management clammed up, some iffy bandages were applied, time-limited compensation doled out, and that was that.

Example #3: All 2D Worms games post-WWP

What makes WA so beloved compared to other Worms games can mostly be summed up in three points.

1. Fast, light, predictable physics.

Worms in WA are very easy to move around.  Even a mere Bazooka or Grenade can throw them a good distance, and superweapons can blast them into the stratosphere.  All of the 2D Worms games I've played since then have felt heavier, slower, and stickier.  Aside from walking and jumping, worms simply don't move well.  In addition, pulling off an attack is a chore.

In WA, everything is highly predictable.  You would think this would harm complex strategy, but the variety of moves and maps available compensate fully.  Newer Worms games still generally have good map and weapon variety, but it's rendered moot because the game wants to fight you every step of the way.  Not ONCE have I been able to complete a full match without a tricky turn failing because some weird hitch happened, like like a worm stopping dead in it's tracks after a long flight, a worm barely moving after a huge explosion, a worm falling off an edge for no apparent reason, a grenade bouncing in a strange pattern, and so on.

The videos I've seen of WMD so far do seem somewhat looser than other recent titles, but still have some of that unpleasant flavour.  Please show us that Team17 is dedicated to providing a loose, fast, and precise gameplay experience.

2. An unobtrusive, easy-on-the-eyes HUD and art style.

Clarity is key.  Clear names, clear icons, clear numbers, clear what's happening on the map, under all conditions.  WMD's visuals certainly look nice, but is it good for gameplay?  Worms, objects, effects such as fire, and HUD elements need to contrast against the map/background, and be easily recognizable EVERY TIME.

In the videos I've seen, worms are an awkward shape, and sometimes blend into busy parts of the map.  Fire is semi-transparent, and doesn't contrast well against its surroundings.  And most egregiously, the fonts used, which appear similar (if not the same) to the fonts used in other recent Worms games, are thick and hard to read against some background elements.

It may not be too modern, but you never need to struggle to see WA's "black velvet" HUD.

3. Classic network interface.

Server browser.  IRC.  In-game chat.  All standard until Halo 2's matchmaking came along and casualized online gaming.  It's sorta ok for FPSes, but turn-based strategy?  Without flexibility and communication, things can and will get boring REAL fast.

*******

I understand that you have a pre-determined marketing plan, but unless that plan is to continue on the same path of releasing forgettable titles, you need to show that you are truly, FINALLY going to put the very best of Worms into a new package.

Team17 prides itself on being small, independent, and a survivor - make the most of that!

Offline TheKomodo

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #351 on: June 05, 2016, 07:56 AM »
Great post, especially loved the part about MWO, huge fan of MW2 & MW3, when I heard about MWO I was super excited but read lots of bad reviews and figured the idiots in charge ruined another promising game thanks to quantity over quality.

Quality should always come 1st, this planet needs to realize that sooner than later.

Offline WTF-8

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #352 on: June 05, 2016, 08:14 AM »
1. Fast, light, predictable physics.
especially when it comes to bounces and slides
"will it hit this pixel and go left, or hit the next pixel and go right?" <- my thoughts on pretty much every attempt to get a worm slide to somewhere
so damn predictable, yup
The manual in the installation folder is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural

Offline The Extremist

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #353 on: June 05, 2016, 09:05 AM »
Quality should always come 1st, this planet needs to realize that sooner than later.

I'm a technocrat. I don't believe in private business being allowed to make its own decisions or affect government decisions. Greed always rears its ugly head eventually, and leads to polluting, abusive factories in poor countries supplying plastic sex toy shops.

There is no shortage of raw materials or local labour, only a shortage of motivation. Make it here, make it right, cut no corners.

(Um ... sorry about the not-so-wormy talk. The world just kinda bugs me... :-[)
« Last Edit: June 05, 2016, 09:08 AM by The Extremist »

Offline Aerox

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Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #354 on: June 05, 2016, 11:08 AM »
you forgot to compare Worms to FIFA
MonkeyIsland, my friend, I know your english is terrible and your understanding of society limited. However, in real life, people attack and humiliate others without the use of a single bad word. They even go to war with lengthy politeness. You can't base the whole moderation philosophy of a community based on the use of bad words and your struggle with sarcasm and irony. My attack to Jonno was fully justified and of proper good taste.
Eat a bag full of dicks.

Offline skunk3

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #355 on: June 05, 2016, 04:56 PM »
I just noticed that I don't see a drill anywhere in that scheme loadout.

Offline Tomtysti

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #356 on: June 05, 2016, 05:36 PM »
I just noticed that I don't see a drill anywhere in that scheme loadout.
You can now use blow torch to dig directly downwards, at least in one of the early builds shown in the livestreams. I hope they didn't completely remove the drill because of this. Drill may be pretty rarely used in most schemes, but it still has it's uniqueness and it's fun specific uses.

Offline TheKomodo

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #357 on: June 05, 2016, 05:46 PM »
Will be severely disappointing if no drill :(

Offline Anubis

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #358 on: June 05, 2016, 06:05 PM »
If the blowtorch does the same as a drill I see no point in having one, though.

Offline StepS

Re: Team17 has announced Worms WMD
« Reply #359 on: June 05, 2016, 06:10 PM »
If the blowtorch does the same as a drill I see no point in having one, though.
but darts
Dec 30 2013 23:59:44 <StepS> windowed mode isn't the only thing you need about frontend
Dec 30 2013 23:59:49 <StepS> you need it to be actually bigger
Dec 31 2013 00:00:13 <StepS> it actually is very small on my 15-inch full HD screen
Dec 31 2013 00:00:25 <StepS> while running at 640x480 or stretched mode makes it fuzzy
Dec 31 2013 00:00:44 <StepS> this problem has been around since the Worms Armageddon's release and no one has even tried to beat it
[...]