Team of experts

[Impossible]

why Im not in list? GIVE ME IQ TEST IM THE BEST ASDASDASD
hahahahah

[Peja]

my list:

impo
impo
impo
impo
impo
impo
impo

xD

on a serious matter, what do you expect avi?  just throwing in names? either we do a serious election or not, but imo there are way 2 many genious  people to cut it down to 7. i couldnt decide in any way.

[avirex]

yes, i expect people to put don't some names of potential candidates peja, then we can narrow it Down..

This is exactly what dark one s talking about.. Everyone talks about change, but no1 wants to take another step at putting it into effect, then they want to complain nothing is changed.

[Dub-c]

Here a replay about the 1v1 situation in Roper. Additional info in the chatbox at the end.

Btw I meant buffer, not puffer. XD

nr there

but I think blue lost because of that failed hiding at the 4:20 turn

But that's the whole problem, the probability for red to win is a lot higher since red can hide on top (more reachable cr8s) and blue must hope for hard cr8s for red or looses no matter what happens. It makes me feel pretty helpless as blue as my actions don't really matter (even with fd, no chance) since red will have easier cr8s and doesn't need to care about hiding at all.

I've suggested a thousand times to increase fd. Can you see why? Why would blue also not hide on top? Various maps can also help with this dilemma. I think blue lost because he was retarded.

[Anubis]

Here a replay about the 1v1 situation in Roper. Additional info in the chatbox at the end.

Btw I meant buffer, not puffer. XD

nr there

but I think blue lost because of that failed hiding at the 4:20 turn

But that's the whole problem, the probability for red to win is a lot higher since red can hide on top (more reachable cr8s) and blue must hope for hard cr8s for red or looses no matter what happens. It makes me feel pretty helpless as blue as my actions don't really matter (even with fd, no chance) since red will have easier cr8s and doesn't need to care about hiding at all.

I've suggested a thousand times to increase fd. Can you see why? Why would blue also not hide on top? Various maps can also help with this dilemma. I think blue lost because he was retarded.

So you suggest for the blue team to hide on top so red wins even easier? Red attacked every turn and only some harder cr8s/better hides by blue would have stopped the default win. Makes no sense for blue to hide on top because of the advantage red has from the beginning.

[Impossible]

roper is awesome scheme as a funner, but its really unbalanced as a league scheme. Honestly if not a bunch of old school players Id like to see it remove from classic

[Dub-c]

Here a replay about the 1v1 situation in Roper. Additional info in the chatbox at the end.

Btw I meant buffer, not puffer. XD

nr there

but I think blue lost because of that failed hiding at the 4:20 turn

But that's the whole problem, the probability for red to win is a lot higher since red can hide on top (more reachable cr8s) and blue must hope for hard cr8s for red or looses no matter what happens. It makes me feel pretty helpless as blue as my actions don't really matter (even with fd, no chance) since red will have easier cr8s and doesn't need to care about hiding at all.

I've suggested a thousand times to increase fd. Can you see why? Why would blue also not hide on top? Various maps can also help with this dilemma. I think blue lost because he was retarded.

So you suggest for the blue team to hide on top so red wins even easier? Red attacked every turn and only some harder cr8s/better hides by blue would have stopped the default win. Makes no sense for blue to hide on top because of the advantage red has from the beginning.

I would rather draw, then let red team win (unless he does 37 + damage 1st turn and plays flawlessly). You are stating a problem that does not exist yet. When this problem exists, let people find a strategy against it. To discourage it, I would increase fd, so that more skill is involved then just getting the crate and placing a mine complacently on top of the worm . I would use 2 worms, perhaps 3 worms even.  I would use a map where hiding on top would not be optimal because of fd. The main problem with all schemes is that they do not evolve and have changed very very little since the beginning. For roper in particular, the one who picks the scheme should be able to modify and play the scheme however they want (notifies opponent of changes before the game) . That is how things evolve. Not by having a ridiculous popularity contest.

roper is awesome scheme as a funner, but its really unbalanced as a league scheme. Honestly if not a bunch of old school players Id like to see it remove from classic

And . . . I'm done.

[Anubis]

Here a replay about the 1v1 situation in Roper. Additional info in the chatbox at the end.

Btw I meant buffer, not puffer. XD

nr there

but I think blue lost because of that failed hiding at the 4:20 turn

But that's the whole problem, the probability for red to win is a lot higher since red can hide on top (more reachable cr8s) and blue must hope for hard cr8s for red or looses no matter what happens. It makes me feel pretty helpless as blue as my actions don't really matter (even with fd, no chance) since red will have easier cr8s and doesn't need to care about hiding at all.

I've suggested a thousand times to increase fd. Can you see why? Why would blue also not hide on top? Various maps can also help with this dilemma. I think blue lost because he was retarded.

So you suggest for the blue team to hide on top so red wins even easier? Red attacked every turn and only some harder cr8s/better hides by blue would have stopped the default win. Makes no sense for blue to hide on top because of the advantage red has from the beginning.

I would rather draw, then let red team win (unless he does 37 + damage 1st turn and plays flawlessly). You are stating a problem that does not exist yet. When this problem exists, let people find a strategy against it. To discourage it, I would increase fd, so that more skill is involved then just getting the crate and placing a mine complacently on top of the worm . I would use 2 worms, perhaps 3 worms even.  I would use a map where hiding on top would not be optimal because of fd. The main problem with all schemes is that they do not evolve and have changed very very little since the beginning. For roper in particular, the one who picks the scheme should be able to modify and play the scheme however they want (notifies opponent of changes before the game) . That is how things evolve. Not by having a ridiculous popularity contest.

I agree with what you say there, hiding on top should be discouraged, I was also thinking to increase Bazooka damage since hiding on Top usually involves having a poor hide.

[DarkOne]

Well okay, guess I should have pointed out a solution, so what came to my mind is obvious 1 worm select to make piling a higher risk, seems like this is no possibility since most disagree with it, it's no option? Another thing could be to limit teleport to 8 (2 teleports for each worm basically), this way you have to decide whether you want to keep the teleports for a turn advantage situation or to get out of a risky situation/save it for late game. One of the things that are important when balancing is a proper risk/reward situation. We kind of did the same in Team17 when placing Girders non-stop was kind of abusive since all you would do is block, block, block. That was a good step in my opinion for T17. What I like most about Hyst is the jetpack, but it kind of falls short because of the endless teleporting ability, shifting the focus on using the jetpack to attack and moving around with it would clearly benefit this scheme. (too much bng, too less jetpack)

Interesting ideas +1 for you, my friend. Free, pay attention to what Anubis just did. This is how you solve problems.
I set up a hysteria experiment cup: https://www.tus-wa.com/cups/cup-553/ And threw in the alternative scheme ideas so anyone willing to test it out could have a go at it. I'll add these schemes in the bunch, though I'm not sure if people want to play bo5. We may have to give people the choice of scheme in that cup, so we can keep it bo3 (perhaps bo5 in the later KO rounds).

Obviously, it's going to take some getting used to changes like this, so I'll be hosting more of theses in the future. If there are a couple of variations that are not that much different from what we have now, I'll remove those from the list.

[zippeurfou]

A bit too late but what about also limiting the number of jetpack to avoid the situation where someone sui a worms and jetpack pile abuse all the others worms ?

[Free]

"This is how you solve problems"

Seriously, stop with the attitude, it's not the first time someone suggests a change in Hysteria, just take a look at all the threads made considering Hysteria over the years and open your eyes.

[Bonhert]

The first thing I would fix is Roper since going first in 1v1 is default victory, you can hide on top from the beginning.

yet it doesn't happen

or can u show us an example of such match?

Because people are too nice I guess (or lack of knowledge),  I told Bonhert about this some time ago, he said he wanted to test it and one day he msged me that it worked, dunno which game# though. Maybe he reads this to show us the replay.

Yea I've been doing this recently and I noticed it helps - if I start a game and happen to lose, I know its because I failed hard and not because cr8s hate me . However I'd rather say it rarely leads to an easy win. Accurate roping is needed.
I recall I've managed doing it here: https://www.tus-wa.com/leagues/game-132044/
The map turned out to had been very easy so it was possible.

[Bonhert]

@topic:
I also like the idea of team of experts. Would entertaining if each of the top 5 or 7 overall rating clans (existing ones) delegated one ambassador  .

[HHC]

Avi's list is nice  Although I would substitute one with a member of CF. Anubis or Komodo should also be there IMO, cause they know the game inside out.

But yeah, I really feel we should push this through. This thread proves it more than anything. A whole lot of things said about a whole variety of schemes and nothing gets done with it 

IMO we should set up a forum for these issues. One public one with a thread for each scheme where everyone can share their thoughts and input. And one private forum where the 'council' of 7 or 9 use the community input to call the shots and finally implement the changes that are needed.

[Peja]

10 people are basicly just a joke when i think on the material we have.

so many names not even mentioned yet, what about MI, Random, Van, Dub, SPW, i could kinda continue endless.. why get the latino fraction completly ignored? what about people maybe not knowing the game inside out but who know how to organise things, for example like darkmaul or impz. there are so many useful  opinions. why should a group of 10 people decide over all others. in this case i rather would like to see MI doing his stuff because its basicly succesful and he is really willing to listen to every idea.